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Deleted member 4037

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,989
Nah Dary is right. "Turn this off if you don't like it, but we're still gonna objectify the hell out of you for creepos to wank to" is still a fucking shitty message.
I mean ive seen people say "I cant play this game because of x", if you can turn off x completely its at the very least more open to those people. Giving the option is not worse than having it shoved onto you. Read into the subtext all you like, but if anything its some sort of movement
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,492
I mean ive seen people say "I cant play this game because of x", if you can turn off x completely its at the very least more open to those people. Giving the option is not worse than having it shoved onto you. Read into the subtext all you like, but if anything its some sort of movement
Of course.
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
I guess it all goes back to the argument of wether we want to "allow" these things to exist, but without them being the norm vs not wanting them to be a thing at all.
Did we play the same game? While it has an amazing story/characters, its very much sexualized. Try again.
I think he means those games became success stories despite being from series that are super niche in the west and thus are more likely to cater to western audiences in the future (Yakuza did by remaking 2).
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
I kind of assume the messages these developers are taking away from the success is "oh wow, these westerners like super Japanese stuff too", not "we should cater even more to them!". If anything, the latter is already a historically failed initiative of gen 7.

That's another thing I find interesting about using Nier A as an example. The original Nier had a version specifically made for western audiences. It didn't do very well, so Yoko Taro said he was just going to make whatever he wanted and not worry about western cultural expectations getting in the way. He was shocked to find how successful in the west Nier A was precisely because of this and IIRC he's given interviews on how he'll keep making things along those lines.

And I mean, if you go by online discourse in general within the game world, "feminist" is almost a bad word. We can decry how toxic gamers are, but we similarly kind of have to acknowledge that's visibly the main base as far as a lot of these companies are concerned. This site is a minority in the grand scheme of things in terms of being progressive, and really this thread is even a minority in that.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
I guess it all goes back to the argument of wether we want to "allow" these things to exist, but without them being the norm vs not wanting them to be a thing at all.

I think he means those games became success stories despite being from series that are super niche in the west and thus are more likely to cater to western audiences in the future (Yakuza did by remaking 2).

How's that is an example when Nier Automata use sexualized designs and it wasn't made to appeal to western audiences? The point was that japanese publishers and developers are paying attention to the west but with Nier and even Yakuza, that's not true in how the games are made.
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
How's that is an example when Nier Automata use sexualized designs and it wasn't made to appeal to western audiences? The point was that japanese publishers and developers are paying attention to the west but with Nier and even Yakuza, that's not true in how the games are made.
The argument is that by finally becoming hits in the west, regardless of their sexualized elements, they may, in the future, try to appeal to western audiences even more in some specific scenarios.

Like, say, if after Automata, Nier became a long-running series that heavily relies on western sales, and if a sequel to Automata featured even sexier designs and this game flopped in the west particularly, they'd probably tone those down significantly in a subsequent game.

This is all speculation, obviously, but I see the logic behind it.
That part gets my demand.
Same here, I see 0 value there.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
How's that is an example when Nier Automata use sexualized designs and it wasn't made to appeal to western audiences? The point was that japanese publishers and developers are paying attention to the west but with Nier and even Yakuza, that's not true in how the games are made.

I believe the point is that for Japanese developers to pay attention to western reception, it helps if there's any reception to begin with. If a game sells all of 300 copies outside of Japan, its developer isn't going to be exactly flooded with opinions of fans and critics on his character designs and why they are problematic. It seems like a simple enough point, I don't understand all the uncharitable readings and out-of-context quotes, let alone condescending shit like this:

Did we play the same game? While it has an amazing story/characters, its very much sexualized. Try again.
 

A.J.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,523
I guess it all goes back to the argument of wether we want to "allow" these things to exist, but without them being the norm vs not wanting them to be a thing at all.

I think he means those games became success stories despite being from series that are super niche in the west and thus are more likely to cater to western audiences in the future (Yakuza did by remaking 2).
I don't believe you can full on stop these things from existing. And if that is your end game then you probably don't want to say it out loud at this point since the Strawman arguement used against reduction is "You are going to take these things away."
 

Dmax3901

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,951
Uh, your example of Nier is weird when the game and franchise does these things too and had a success regardless of it. They didn't changed it to appeal to western audiences.. the game is extremely japanese with a bunch of sexualized designs with 2B and A2 being the big examples.

Not to mention that Yoko Taro valorized the fact that people were making fanservice arts of 2B with her butt lol

The bases for those games even in the west are pretty okay with sexualized characters. Yoko Taro was pretty much praised for asking for zip files of 2B hentai. And Nier A's success is also partially based on Platinum's pedigree, with their most iconic franchise being about a dominatrix witch.

Large swathes of the western gaming audience has made it pretty clear to both niche and mid tier Japanese developers that they're totally into hyper anime-related stuff and despise significant changes to it. You can take a look at some lewd VN sales on Steamspy to see what Japan is doing right now can be pretty lucrative.

Did we play the same game? While it has an amazing story/characters, its very much sexualized. Try again.

I'm confused. The post I was responding to was questioning the importance of talking about Japanese games when Japan is a 'different beast'. By bringing up Yakuza and Nier I wasn't downplaying their various issues, merely saying that more niche Japanese games have more of a western audience than ever before and therefore our discussion of their problems has never been more important.
 
Nov 6, 2017
1,202
I'm confused. The post I was responding to was questioning the importance of talking about Japanese games when Japan is a 'different beast'. By bringing up Yakuza and Nier I wasn't downplaying their various issues, merely saying that more niche Japanese games have more of a western audience than ever before and therefore our discussion of their problems has never been more important.

I misread then I guess.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
I believe the point is that for Japanese developers to pay attention to western reception, it helps if there's any reception to begin with. If a game sells all of 300 copies outside of Japan, its developer isn't going to be exactly flooded with opinions of fans and critics on his character designs and why they are problematic. It seems like a simple enough point, I don't understand all the uncharitable readings and out-of-context quotes, let alone condescending shit like this:

Sure, that's indeed a point but I don't think that it applies in reality. I'm pretty sure that the next Nier games are going to use the same things again. Regardless of success in the west, I don't think that they'll change it if there's not a good amount of people demanding it, which I don't think it exists in this big number. Nier Automata was plenty accepted with 2 million of sales outside of Japan even with how it had it's designs and in future installments, I can bet with you that it'll continue it because of Yoko Taro. So yeah, I really don't believe in those changes at all..
 

Dary

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,429
The English Wilderness
But that option atleast gives you the choice of not having it forced on you, and those that enjoy it can consume

I mean I can kinda see where your coming from but I would think options to make the game cater to multiple groups is always the best
Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
I'm confused. The post I was responding to was questioning the importance of talking about Japanese games when Japan is a 'different beast'. By bringing up Yakuza and Nier I wasn't downplaying their various issues, merely saying that more niche Japanese games have more of a western audience than ever before and therefore our discussion of their problems has never been more important.

Sure, but the point is the support of those aspects far outweighs the pushback, with many playing precisely for those reasons. They have a base, and they're catering to that base by keeping in what the west will not give them.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
Sure, that's indeed a point but I don't think that it applies in reality.

Neither do I, frankly; I was just pointing out they weren't saying Nier or Yakuza weren't sexist (the opposite, in fact).

Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!

The sad thing is that it would probably increase sales more than hurt them. :(
 

A.J.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,523
Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!
I'm not sure that's a 1 to 1 comparison since every character in the game has a broken armor version and they generally aren't on the same level of sexualization as "bikini with titty bounce".
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
Like, say, if after Automata, Nier became a long-running series that heavily relies on western sales, and if a sequel to Automata featured even sexier designs and this game flopped in the west particularly, they'd probably tone those down significantly in a subsequent game.

I probably wouldn't use anything Yoko Taro does as an example. The guy's brain doesn't work like a normal human.

Anyway if the recent success of a lot of mid-tier stuff is anything to go by, I wouldn't place sexualization as a +/- qualifier but rather something most people are just straight up apathetic about if the game plays good/has a good story/etc. So I really don't see a scenario like that happening unless a hypothetical Nier sequel is bad in other aspects like combat or story.
 

Valkyr1983

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,523
NH, United States
Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!

I guess for me it would depend on if it was really part of the artists vision or not, I'd be fine with it if so

You using "cgi" titty bounce implies it was also against what Daisy Ridley would want for her character so that really doesn't work, she has agency over how she's represented. Of course if she was totally cool with it and wanted it in, than that's also fine

We consume movies differently than games. Games are inherently customizable

I mean we have games that allow easy modes, modifiers, etc

Most games also have selectable costumes for playthroughs, etc

In some ways you are describing those "unrated" editions with extra footage of nudity or inappropriate content

That's really the same thing, and most seem fine with having the choice

I'd like the same in games, If it means more can comfortably play games like MGSV and we can still have the content Kojima and his fans (like myself) want
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!

I'd see no problem with that if it's an option and not the only version available. It doesn't take away from the normal version. Besides, that sounds like a hilarious Saturday night with friends and loved ones.

Edit: Provided this is all signed off on by the people involved. If Ridley was not cool with this and they used a legal loophole to do it, I'd think it would be tasteless and not a good thing even if I'd support the company's right to do it.
 

Dmax3901

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,951
Okay, imagine if the home releases of the Star Wars sequels came with a "Rey Swimsuit Edit" - the films are exactly the same, but now Rey is wearing a bikini and has added CGI titty bounce!!
This is disturbing but a great way to explain what it's like playing some of these games.

Sure, but the point is the support of those aspects far outweighs the pushback, with many playing precisely for those reasons. They have a base, and they're catering to that base by keeping in what the west will not give them.

Some conversation is better than zero conversation, in my eyes.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,895
That's another thing I find interesting about using Nier A as an example. The original Nier had a version specifically made for western audiences. It didn't do very well, so Yoko Taro said he was just going to make whatever he wanted and not worry about western cultural expectations getting in the way. He was shocked to find how successful in the west Nier A was precisely because of this and IIRC he's given interviews on how he'll keep making things along those lines.
It's kinda funny, because the novelty of a Japanese RPG where the main character was a devoted father was what singlehandedly led me to buy that game.
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
I probably wouldn't use anything Yoko Taro does as an example. The guy's brain doesn't work like a normal human.
You're probably right, though I wonder how much authority Taro will keep now that according to SE, Nier has become a "housold property", I was only sticking to the example for the sake of the argument though, I realize he's a special case haha.
Some conversation is better than zero conversation, in my eyes.
Definitely.
I don't believe you can full on stop these things from existing. And if that is your end game then you probably don't want to say it out loud at this point since the Strawman arguement used against reduction is "You are going to take these things away."
Oh, for sure, I mean if you asked me if I'd rather have that perfect scenario then sure, but I realize it's basically impossible so I don't strive to accomplish that at all.
It's kinda funny, because the novelty of a Japanese RPG where the main character was a devoted father was what singlehandedly led me to buy that game.
Same here!
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
You're probably right, though I wonder how much authority Taro will keep now that according to SE, Nier has become a "housold property", I was only sticking to the example for the sake of the argument though, I realize he's a special case haha.

I feel like Square wrestling control away form Taro would kill the series far harder than increased sexualization.

And what message would this send to all the young girls who thought to look up to Rey as an inspiration?

They preferably wouldn't see it as it would be an unrated joke edit. It can exist separately from the far more inspiring story of the proper version.
 

SENPAIatLARGE

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,501
Japan is not going to change its fundamental (sexist) values to cater to western tastes, when there is already a sizeable western audience that eats it up.
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
Japan is not going to change its fundamental (sexist) values to cater to western tastes, when there is already a sizeable western audience that eats it up.
Only time will tell I guess. The home console market is becoming increasingly more expensive to the point I can see series like Yakuza becoming more and more dependant on worldwide sales, to the point some series can't even allow themselves to not get localized anymore.

Mobile, handheld (?) and low budget will remain as is though, obviously.
 

SENPAIatLARGE

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,501
Only time will tell I guess. The home console market is becoming increasingly more expensive to the point I can see series like Yakuza becoming more and more dependant on worldwide sales, to the point some series can't even allow themselves to not get localized anymore.

Mobile, handheld (?) and low budget will remain as is though, obviously.
but if it sells well by not changing, why change?
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
Mobile, handheld (?) and low budget will remain as is though, obviously.

I mean that's kind of what Japan is doing in general outside of Square. These are all low-mid tier games for the most part in terms of budget with multi-platform releases utilizing the least power they can to keep costs down (which is why the success of the Switch is so important for the survival of Japan's game industry). Steam where this kind of stuff thrives (the Nekopara series is a million+ seller) is kind of proving to a lot of companies that the people over here want this stuff.

Japan really isn't part of the AAA industry anymore as far as budget goes outside of stuff that would be a fraction of the cost if it wasn't made by people with zero managerial skills like every major Square Enix game since 2005. Even Nintendo software largely costs less to make compared to big western AAA games.
 

Opa-Pa

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,810
but if it sells well by not changing, why change?
We're talking hyphotetical cases. What if it sells well for now and then suddenly it doesn't? Do you can the series or adapt?

I'm not saying "All japanese franchises that depend on western sales will eventually drop sexist content", but I don't think it's that crazy of a scenario that a handful could eventually tone it down due to western reception.
I mean that's kind of what Japan is doing in general outside of Square. These are all low-mid tier games for the most part in terms of budget with multi-platform releases utilizing the least power they can to keep costs down (which is why the success of the Switch is so important for the survival of Japan's game industry). Steam where this kind of stuff thrives (the Nekopara series is a million+ seller) is kind of proving to a lot of companies that the people over here want this stuff.

Japan really isn't part of the AAA industry anymore as far as budget goes outside of stuff that would be a fraction of the cost if it wasn't made by people with zero managerial skills like every major Square Enix game since 2005. Even Nintendo software largely costs less to make compared to big western AAA games.
I realize this, but I'm speaking strictly of the rare cases of japanese properties that get consistently "bigger" games, like Yakuza, Souls, Square properties, Resident Evil, and whatnot. I suspect Atlus will join them provided they didn't already with Persona 5.
 

A.J.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,523
It seems more like most of Japan wants to groom an overseas otaku audience rather than conform.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
I realize this, but I'm speaking strictly of the rare cases of japanese properties that get consistently "bigger" games, like Yakuza, Souls, Square properties, Resident Evil, and whatnot. I suspect Atlus will join them provided they didn't already with Persona 5.

At that point, it kind of becomes a balancing act of bringing in new people and not pissing off old fans. Games like Souls and Resident Evil already have western appeal baked into their identity. That identity is important to maintain unless you want your series to be whatever like Final Fantasy and largely survive on name alone. For better and worse, sexuality has become a big part of the identity of many series.

But there's another factor here that a lot of people forget: this is what the developers WANT to make. In Japan, it's a largely passion-based industry just as working in anime is. They're not just going after the sexuality-craving otaku base because it's a very reliable portion of the market, but because it's what they themselves are into. Hashino and Soejima, Taro, Kamiya, Harada, Ono, Ishiwatari, etc; it's less "sex sells, so let's put it in" and more "I like sex, so let's put it in! also it sells I guess"
 

A.J.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,523
thats precisely how i see it. Look how the anime community has evolved to accept an increasing amount of fanservice over the years.
It makes me curious how that Canadian developed Neptunia game will turn out. It might end up being a better product or it could end up being a confirmation that the west is truly celebrating otaku culture.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
It makes me curious how that Canadian developed Neptunia game will turn out. It might end up being a better product or it could end up being a confirmation that the west is truly celebrating otaku culture.

Whether it's "better" or not is probably going to be irrelevant among the fanbase because it's not a mainline game that plays anything like the mainline games. It's not a DmC scenario where it's being made as if it was a mainline title, it's a spin-off.
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,492
Sure, but the point is the support of those aspects far outweighs the pushback, with many playing precisely for those reasons. They have a base, and they're catering to that base by keeping in what the west will not give them.
Do you have proof of this? That's quite a claim.

I'd be willing to bet most people don't care either way. They aren't buying it because she's hot and they aren't not buying it because she's sexualized. Which leaves us with two relatively small camps. How do you know which one is bigger?
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
Do you have proof of this? That's quite a claim.

I'd be willing to bet most people don't care either way. They aren't buying it because she's hot and they aren't not buying it because she's sexualized. Which leaves us with two relatively small camps. How do you know which one is bigger?

I'd use online discourse and gaming culture in general as an indicator (the people that actually do care and fall on the side of pro-sexualization/objectification outnumber those that don't on places like Reddit and Twitter), but you're right in that there's no way to know 100% for sure.
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,492
I'd use online discourse and gaming culture in general as an indicator (the people that actually do care and fall on the side of pro-sexualization/objectification outnumber those that don't on places like Reddit and Twitter), but you're right in that there's no way to know 100% for sure.
Fair enough. My anecdotal evidence would swing the other way, but I know I hang in different crowds than... those types of people.
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
I wouldn't be shocked at this considering some otaku series like Neptunia do better in the west than in Japan.
Yup. I mean we are at the point where Kim Kardashian is posting pictures of characters from Darling in the Franxx on her Instagram and saying they are her 'hair goals'. That anime is pure otaku-bait and mainstream celebrities are watching it.
 

Vlaphor

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,202
Topeka, KS
I guess for me it would depend on if it was really part of the artists vision or not, I'd be fine with it if so

You using "cgi" titty bounce implies it was also against what Daisy Ridley would want for her character so that really doesn't work, she has agency over how she's represented. Of course if she was totally cool with it and wanted it in, than that's also fine

We consume movies differently than games. Games are inherently customizable

I mean we have games that allow easy modes, modifiers, etc

Most games also have selectable costumes for playthroughs, etc

In some ways you are describing those "unrated" editions with extra footage of nudity or inappropriate content

That's really the same thing, and most seem fine with having the choice

I'd like the same in games, If it means more can comfortably play games like MGSV and we can still have the content Kojima and his fans (like myself) want

Stuff like this is also why I like mods in gaming. Everyone can get what they want. It's one of the reasons why I play primarily on PC, the level of customization the platform gives you.

Even if something is taken out afterwards, it's a cinch to put it back in (Street Fighter V for example), even if the game isn't on PC at all (Tokyo Mirage Sessions).
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,784
Yup. I mean we are at the point where Kim Kardashian is posting pictures of characters from Darling in the Franxx on her Instagram and saying they are her 'hair goals'. That anime is pure otaku-bait and mainstream celebrities are watching it.

To be fair, that's probably Kanye's influence and he's always been into otaku stuff. Celebrities are people too and it was only a matter of time until a really big one ended up being a fan of something super otaku-baity and actually making that known to the world. Not like she's the first one either, she's just probably the most visible.

We're totally going to have a weeb president that made Linkin Park Naruto AMVs in his/her youth in our lifetime.
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
To be fair, that's probably Kanye's influence and he's always been into otaku stuff. Celebrities are people too and it was only a matter of time until a really big one ended up being a fan of something super otaku-baity and actually making that known to the world. Not like she's the first one either, she's just probably the most visible.

We're totally going to have a weeb president that made Linkin Park Naruto AMVs in his/her youth in our lifetime.
It definitely is, I only bring that up to suggest that content aimed at otaku is growing in popularity in the west as anime has become more accessible and mainstream.
I think, as a western fan, it is good to criticize Japanese media for things you find objectionable and make your voice heard to content creators (I certainly do). Just be aware that among the western audience for Japanese content, that criticism represents a small minority. Most of the western audience either doesn't care or enjoys the content we commonly criticize here.
 

Laiza

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,171
Just wanted to mention that Attack on Titan 2, the video game, is remarkably faithful to the source material and that means shockingly respectful depictions of the female cast. In the character creator, literally all of the outfit options are long-sleeved shirts with accessories (like vests and such), and pants are mandatory (which is WHAT YOU WOULD EXPECT FOR A GODDAMN MILITARY ORGANIZATION *ahem*). Even the usually over-the-top DLC costumes are more respectful than what you usually get out of, say, Street Fighter V or whatever - even Mikasa's Chinese dress outfit, which is usually an excuse to show excessive amounts of leg, gives her shorts(!). And it's a Japanese anime game through-and-through in terms of gameplay and the odd "friendship" system (which is mandatory to unlock skills for your OC). Honestly, it's kind of a shock to play this after all the recent bullshit I've had to put up with from Japan generally. This alongside the Souls games really proves to me that, hey, turns out Japan isn't totally hopeless after all, though I still hold little hope for things improving in Japan as a general trend any time soon. (And honestly - most of the credit for the female characters' depictions goes to the author of the original manga to begin with.)

If there is one thing I have to complain about, though... well, besides the skin tones only going to a middle-brown color (likely a consequence of the choice to go with a generic light-skinned protagonist in all of their pre-rendered cinematics), it's that the female voice options never go all the way to rough, no-nonsense soldier lady like I want to. Actually, some of the voices seem really ill-fitting for someone who is ostensibly a well-trained (but vengeance-driven) soldier, with at least a few existing purely to fill out a check list of "anime stereotypes". Heh. Even when they're not sexing up the ladies, turns out there's just some things you can never get away from. Regardless, it's a good positive example that I was very pleasantly surprised by. If only more devs would go this route.
 

petran79

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,025
Greece
I'd use online discourse and gaming culture in general as an indicator (the people that actually do care and fall on the side of pro-sexualization/objectification outnumber those that don't on places like Reddit and Twitter), but you're right in that there's no way to know 100% for sure.

They see it more as a freedom of expression issue. It also has to do with the sloppy preparation and procedure they tried to pass bill 156, creating even more opponents. Worth noting that the politician who was in charge of the bill also wrote a novel with sexual pranks
 

esserius

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,325
Online discourse in general has the attention span of a goldfish, so to take that as an indicator of anything other than what's happening in the immediate present is probably wasted effort.

As for gaming culture, there's a certain segment that's radicalized, but that small group isn't where the money is (admittedly, that same group is a lot easier to exploit than the larger market).
 
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esserius

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,325
Online commentators - us included - make up a minority of the wider gaming public. Reddit has its demographics, same as any other site.
Minorities are increasingly disproportionately influencing major markets though - for better and worse.
Not really. Its just games are larger than ever, media in general is and access to people and new markets is a much smaller barrier. Japan is always gonna make their weird sexualized anime shit. It just reaches more people because the market forces have naturally allowed that to occur.

Compare how much more difficult it was to play Japanese games on the PS1 and PC back in the day compared to the PS4 and PC now.

I dont really think that there is an army of otaku gamers being bred. Games are just bigger and all games benefit from that. These games are an incredibly small part of the market. All these games releasing this year (hell the last 5 years) added together will sell less than the next CoD iteration.

Doesn't make the issue of sexualization less relevant. But I wouldnt overblow the reach.
I think gaming markets are smaller and narrower than they've ever been, mostly because the money continues to funnel upwards.
 
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Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,575
It seems more like most of Japan wants to groom an overseas otaku audience rather than conform.

Not really. Its just games are larger than ever, media in general is and access to people and new markets is a much smaller barrier. Japan is always gonna make their weird sexualized anime shit. It just reaches more people because the market forces have naturally allowed that to occur.

Compare how much more difficult it was to play Japanese games on the PS1 and PC back in the day compared to the PS4 and PC now.

I dont really think that there is an army of otaku gamers being bred. Games are just bigger and all games benefit from that. These games are an incredibly small part of the market. All these games releasing this year (hell the last 5 years) added together will sell less than the next CoD iteration.

Doesn't make the issue of sexualization less relevant. But I wouldnt overblow the reach.
 
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