Should there be a new OT?

  • Yes

    Votes: 442 53.3%
  • No

    Votes: 387 46.7%

  • Total voters
    829

Kazaam

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,866
London
Report them then, what good does posting in here do about it?
I think if there's one "sanctuary" where someone can or should vent their frustrations in that regard (justified or not), it's here. I don't post much, but I was quite outspoken regarding the xbox news this past week and even I feel overwhelmed by the amount of threads and news that portray xbox's existence as some kind of insult in itself.

Don't get me wrong, I think for their decisions and pr blunders Microsoft should absolutely be raked over the coals. But I also think peeps should have a safe place here to say their frustrations or to want to move on and talk about games. For all the justified criticism the management of Xbox has invited, it's not hard to see that everyone has come out to feast on these news almost with some form of glee
 

vixolus

Prophet of Truth
Member
Sep 22, 2020
56,608
There was also rumors years ago about stuff like the game wanting your phone number to text you even when you arent playing right?

The whole its a game but also a whole different medium thing kojima said checks out.
 

DontHateTheBacon

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,775
It does, but PC gamepass is not very popular or big. Unless it becomes accessible through steam it'll stay that way. MS store/Xbox app being as unpopular as it is absolutely craters their reach on that platform. The reason they have a plateau in GP subs is because the consoles aren't selling anymore.
Isn't it Microsoft/Xbox's job to make PC Game Pass appealing though?
 

Kazaam

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,866
London
Ironically not a metal gear Kojima fan, but a more recent fan of his work and I'll eat up whatever he delivers. The more outlandish the better... as long as outlandish doesn't mean half naked women suffering from a disease that forces them to be naked.
 

Haregan

Member
Aug 21, 2022
2,359
Serbia
We are most likely going to get zombies 3 years in a row and I don't think they will bring back special ops, but something like Extinction could work. It is similar, but different enough. I love the extraction zombies they have now and I hope they keep doing new and different stuff.
 

mentok15

Member
Dec 20, 2017
7,533
Australia
For all the justified criticism the management of Xbox has invited, it's not hard to see that everyone has come out to feast on these news almost with some form of glee
Yeah a few seem to be using the current actions of MS as an excuse to post their grievances that MS shouldn't have ever got into gaming to begin with. I'm still a bit doomerish about Xbox management, and Xbox future in hardware, but some of the other threads are getting a bit much
 

The Lord of Cereal

#REFANTAZIO SWEEP
Member
Jan 9, 2020
9,922
Hey all, I have a question. When a game says it's leaving Game Pass on a certain day, is that inclusive of the day or not?

So Norco is leaving on Wednesday the 15th, will I still be able to play it on Wednesday or does access end Tuesday at midnight?
 

vixolus

Prophet of Truth
Member
Sep 22, 2020
56,608

View: https://x.com/JempireG/status/1786068247735140533

Hey all, I have a question. When a game says it's leaving Game Pass on a certain day, is that inclusive of the day or not?

So Norco is leaving on Wednesday the 15th, will I still be able to play it on Wednesday or does access end Tuesday at midnight?
I don't think there's a consistent time, similar to when a game unlocks. It could be until 11:59 PM local time, or UTC, or it could be in the morning etc.
 

Rosebud

Two Pieces
Member
Apr 16, 2018
44,306
And thats based on.. ?
Not the poster, but they probably refer to this

GNIN568WIAAzQb8
 

pg2g

Member
Dec 18, 2018
5,115
Events of this past week seem to cast doubt on one of the central theses of Gamepass--that it does not matter how much your game sells.

You're ignoring the engagement piece of the equation, which is pretty important for a subscription service.

I don't think it's a central theses of Game Pass that releasing flops is okay.
 

NDA-Man

Member
Mar 23, 2020
3,321
You're ignoring the engagement piece of the equation, which is pretty important for a subscription service.

I don't think it's a central theses of Game Pass that releasing flops is okay.

Which would be fair, but for everything that Microsoft had said over the past year regarding Hi-Fi (and even their attitude towards Redfall post-launch as something that they wouldn't give up on). Like, I agree that they would very much prefer failures, but with how they handled their "success" its really... confusing. "Things are fine, Gamepass is good" and yeeting Tango don't necessarily mesh (even if it had run up to the extreme limits of its niche-ass combination of genres).
 

disparate

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,181
I think people are too up their own ass about gamepass "sustainability" inasmuch as it's hardly unique, PS Plus Premium isn't a dissimilar service from a platform holder, and EA Play Pro gives you day 1 access as a publisher. The main key differentiator at this point is mostly price where PS Plus and EA Play Pro:
  1. is 2x the price
  2. offers annual subs
 

Rosebud

Two Pieces
Member
Apr 16, 2018
44,306
I think people are too up their own ass about gamepass "sustainability" inasmuch as it's hardly unique, PS Plus Premium isn't a dissimilar service from a platform holder, and EA Play Pro gives you day 1 access as a publisher. The main key differentiator at this point is mostly price where PS Plus and EA Play Pro:
  1. is 2x the price
  2. offers annual subs
The whole "problem" are the day 1 games. EA gets their money on mtxs
 

pg2g

Member
Dec 18, 2018
5,115
Which would be fair, but for everything that Microsoft had said over the past year regarding Hi-Fi (and even their attitude towards Redfall post-launch as something that they wouldn't give up on). Like, I agree that they would very much prefer failures, but with how they handled their "success" its really... confusing. "Things are fine, Gamepass is good" and yeeting Tango don't necessarily mesh (even if it had run up to the extreme limits of its niche-ass combination of genres).

I think under normal circumstances both Arkane and Tango would still be there, so I don't really think what they said a year ago matters. Circumstances changed and they had to make some hard decisions. If you take their word for it, it had less to do with their performance and more to do with where they were in the development cycle for their next games. I don't buy that entirely obviously, they wouldn't drop a successful studio because they had just released a game.
 

Check it out

Member
Oct 25, 2017
544
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
 

pg2g

Member
Dec 18, 2018
5,115
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.

It's in every news outlet, I think the damage is done.
 

biglo25

Member
Apr 28, 2020
2,683
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
nah their stock prices are never affected by gaming stuff like the ABK deal was only talked about for a couple minutes at a time in those investor calls they care more about Azure and AI but they will probably release a statement at some point
 

YozoraXV

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,097
it had less to do with their performance and more to do with where they were in the development cycle for their next games.

This is exactly it and it's what most people miss. If Tango were about to release a new game in the next 18 months they wouldn't have been closed.

MS had a number that had to reach and someone had to go, if Tango wasn't closed what other studio would be a better fit to close? Pretty much all of their other studios are about to release a new game.
 

The Lord of Cereal

#REFANTAZIO SWEEP
Member
Jan 9, 2020
9,922
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
Honestly I feel like they didn't bother with a public statement because they know that there's nothing they could have said to justify it in public or that would have added any more information not already covered in the news reports and internal messaging.

Also the fact that they're probably not done yet with the restructuring and layoffs... But really, they're just waiting it out until Hellblade 2 and then E3 where there'll be more positive news for Xbox
 

pg2g

Member
Dec 18, 2018
5,115
Honestly I feel like they didn't bother with a public statement because they know that there's nothing they could have said to justify it in public or that would have added any more information not already covered in the news reports and internal messaging.

Also the fact that they're probably not done yet with the restructuring and layoffs... But really, they're just waiting it out until Hellblade 2 and then E3 where there'll be more positive news for Xbox

I feel like (moreso hope) this was them getting the bad news out of the way before the showcase and the barrage of releases.
 

DrowsyJungle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
926
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
If anything, layoffs make stocks go up. Which is horrible, but mostly the trend.
 

Granjinhaa

Member
Dec 28, 2023
3,658
Dusk is pretty decent source on Horror stuff
is he though. he gets so much stuff wrong.

I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
cutting jobs and closing studios makes stock prices go up so they don't even need to say shit in this broken ass system
 

CubeApple76

Member
Jan 20, 2021
6,815
I do find it strange that Microsoft hasn't released a clear public statement on the closures. My copium is thinking of scenarios where most jobs are saved and there is just a massive restructure. I feel they have to share something soon on this because it could theoretically effect stock prices.
This news is irrelevant for the MS stock price.
 

ArjanN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,189
I feel like (moreso hope) this was them getting the bad news out of the way before the showcase and the barrage of releases.

I've definitely notcied them getting bad news out of way like a month before E3/a big showcase. Where it's just long enough to get out of the news cycle and it means you can just focus on the good news.
 

Shirkelton

Member
Aug 20, 2020
6,238
Astonishing that people are still going to the mat for these people after they straight up lied to them on a number of occasions in the past year.

If you think that everything is hunky dory with Xbox's business model, why are they making so many changes?

Hell, why did they say under oath, that they'd need far more subscribers than they currently have to make it worthwhile.

Anyway, playing through Old World Blues now and it's kind of astonishing that this and Dead Money were split up by Honest Hearts at original release. Especially given of the four, OWB and DM are so closely linked.
 
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Sydle

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,421
Astonishing that people are still going to the mat for these people after they straight up lied to them on a number of occasions in the past year.

If you think that everything is hunky dory with Xbox's business model, why are they making so many changes?

Hell, why did they say under oath, that they'd need far more subscribers than they currently have to make it worthwhile.

What they said in prior years about it being profitable, when they were smaller like a 2.5K-3K person org with 20+ million subscribers, while also being supported by all the people buying games, MTX and DLC, in addition to getting the 30% cuts from their store, can all be true. I don't see any reason to doubt that they had a better balancing act back then for it to make sense.

What they said to the FTC last year about needing to track to higher Game Pass subscribers (was it 50M by end of 2022 and 100M by 2028?) likely had the ongoing operating costs of Bethesda (+2.5K employees) and ABK (+17K employees) built into their model. The reason they gave for purchasing ABK had to due with their mobile store ambitions, which they stated back in 2022.

They also said under oath that the ABK acquisition did not have any console growth built into its model. That seems revealing in regard to how much they were counting on PC, cloud, Game Pass and whatever this mobile store turns in to.
 

Montresor

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,367
So, how are thread regulars feeling about their future with Xbox after a few days have passed?

I'm still going to play on Xbox. It's an exceptionally good system, with an inordinate amount of good games. I don't have time to play all the great games I want to play on this system. The system still has my favourite controller, my favourite OS, and I love achievements, and I've loved so many games on the Xbox ecosystem, from indie (Tunic), to Japanese (Like A Dragon and Danganronpa), to first-party (Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush, and Forza Horizon).

However, here's one thing that has changed for me: I've given up on the dream of Xbox first-party being respectable and ever being able to stand toe-to-toe with Sony and Nintendo. In my opinion, that dream is dead. For years, since 2018, I have been hoping for Microsoft to eventually reach a point where they could be counted on to release one GOTY candidate each year (like Sony and Nintendo do almost every year), with feel-good stories like God of War 2018 or Tears of the Kingdom 2023 for Xbox fans (exceptionally good, universally acclaimed GOTY-level masterpieces on Xbox).

However, I think that dream is dead. I don't trust them to ever reach that level of respect and popularity. And my rationale is: I think they don't know what they're doing. My rationale for thinking they don't know what they're doing: they closed down the studio that made of the absolute best Xbox first-party exclusives that have ever existed (closed down Tango, makers of Hi-Fi Rush).

And another thing that changed for me is: I kind of no longer trust Xbox leadership. They might say they'll continue to make Xbox consoles, or they'll keep first-party games on game pass, etc. I don't think they're competent or honest, and so what their leadership says doesn't really matter anymore.

Again, I'll continue to play on Xbox. But I grew up with Nintendo, so I'll be getting a Switch 2 and spending a lot of time dividing my time between Nintendo and Xbox, until Xbox consoles one day die off.
 

Lotus

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
107,116
The whole "problem" are the day 1 games. EA gets their money on mtxs

Yep, and because they never made such promises, they can adjust as needed. Like i was starting to get used to the idea of their first party titles arriving after about a year. Yet for God of War Ragnarok it's getting close to two years now without it being on the service. That level of uncertainty where I can't even trust that their first party stuff will at least arrive on the service after a year makes PS Extra/Premium a substantially worse service to me compared to Game Pass's day 1 promise.

But... at the same time, because I don't know when it'd show up (although admittedly, for big titles like that I wouldn't wait a year or more anyhow), they got me to actually purchase the game. For the consumer, Game Pass wins handily in how they do things, but it unfortunately comes with a cost.