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Xbox Game Studios + Bethesda + ABK |OT30| Why So Series X|S?

Should there be a new OT?

  • Yes

    Votes: 451 53.6%

  • No

    Votes: 391 46.4%
  • Total voters
    842
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Josh5890

Josh5890

I'm Your Favorite Poster's Favorite Poster
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
23,726
Let me throw something positive out there on a day of Xbox dooming. Yesterday I had a few minutes to kill on my lunch break so I booted up my Series S to check on some game updates. I briefly booted up Gears of War 3 almost at random, just to check out the menu. On a giggle I tried to join an online match and low and behold there was a couple of games going on. I played a quick online match of a 13 year old console game from two generations ago. That is something you rarely can do anymore.

It was fun.
 
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mentok15

mentok15

Member
Dec 20, 2017
7,542
Australia
Ascenion said:
At this point I think they know it's a lost cause this cycle. Beyond that they focused too heavily on Game Pass as the platform out the gate this gen. Never assume the consumer is going to make connections. Spell it out for them in obvious but inventive ways. That didn't happen.
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Thing is if they stop caring about this cycle it's going to make the next on even harder.

Arc said:
At ~900K a quarter S/X won't come close to Xbox One.
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Depending on if they start next gen 2026-2028 Xbox Series will sell 35-40 million, vs XBO almost 60. At least it's a lot better compared to consoles that were considered failures, WiiU and PS Vita were 10-15 million.
 
vixolus

vixolus

Prophet of Truth
Member
Sep 22, 2020
56,716
the Photo Mode tweet from NT is by far their most commented on and retweeted post recently.
 
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Check it out

Member
Oct 25, 2017
544
At this point, I just hope there is a place I can access my Xbox digital library going forward that isn't a console and I would especially like to access it through Mac OS. If Satya is so obsessed with everyone playing, he should have no problem letting the other main personal computing ecosystem access Xbox games.
 
Reflecting Sky

Reflecting Sky

Member
Mar 17, 2024
345
Mr Evil 37 said:
If they don't, I'll still be here buying and playing my games on Xbox so it doesn't really bother me lol

I just prefer to be glass half full than glass half empty and don't like catastrophising.
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That's how I approach things as well. We'll see where the ship strands, as we Dutch say. Things can look radically different within the next two years.
 
NDA-Man

NDA-Man

Member
Mar 23, 2020
3,326
UraMallas said:
You are in here a lot. I feel like you should have been prepared for these exact numbers.
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I was. Xbox expected hardware down 40% last quarter or whatever, and there's no reason for it to bounce back. I was just stating that while there are headwinds that affect both consoles, the collapse in Xbox marketshare can't be explained just by the economy doing poorly or whatever.
 
vixolus

vixolus

Prophet of Truth
Member
Sep 22, 2020
56,716
9b316f2cff5f7cc71af862a7096b4cd3.jpg


Dunno when these update but US Top Sellers Sea of Thieves seems to be holding quite well. Top non f2p/non yearly sports title.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
544
N64, GameCube and Wii U were all commercial disasters. Nintendo was able to survive these down sale consoles by supplementing with a handheld in the Game Boy Advance, an absolute commercial home run with the Wii and the greatest console ever in the Switch. The rumors of the portable Xbox make sense to try to supplement the commercial failure of the XBone and XSX/S but I don't see how they can differentiate themselves too much from the available options. Steam Deck seems to have that market locked.

The difference in these scenarios is that Nintendo stayed agile and continued to rely heavily on exclusives. They were true to their ethos and it ended up paying off. People eventually realized they wanted to play Nintendo games and they weren't just for kids as was the reputation in the early 2000s. Most of their decisions were based on finding their niche.

Microsoft doesn't seem to have a clear vision except to make the most money possible. They tried to trick consumers by parading Phil In cute t-shirts (suits are never our friends)but as soon as real money was invested (Activision) the ROI became king. It's going to be fascinating to watch them squirm and pivot to win back any unwarranted trust. I don't think they'll ever get mine back, which is fine, I don't think they really care.
 
Linkified

Linkified

Member
Dec 24, 2017
1,205
NDA-Man said:
How much money did MS throw at bolstering the first party? Like, it's a decade from the launch of the Xbone, and like seven years since they started acquisitions, and like... the biggest exclusive they had last year, Bethesda's first new game since Fallout 4... barely moved the needle. Hi-Fi earned a ton of buzz but was never going to move hardware, and Redfall is Redfall.

We're I in Microsoft, I'd look at 2023, then the start of 2024, and conclude yeah, there ain't value to being in Hardware. GAASes are hobbled by being tied to this anchor, and single player ain't selling the box.
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Just point out everything you've mentioned is not marketing of the hardware like the other poster pointed out.
 
UraMallas

UraMallas

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,619
United States
Iunno. Feels like GaaS games can come late and still hit. There's this base still built in, playing, talking about it, engaging with the title online. Even years later. So, maybe counter to the prevailing wisdom, I feel like GaaS games DON'T need to be day and date. They can come over when they need a boost as long as they are actually good games. Sea of Thieves didn't need Playstation to be a hit. It differentiated the Xbox platform and is now mopping up some extra revenue as the game transitions into another phase. Forza Horizon obviously doesn't need Playstation to be a hit. If the GaaS game is good, it is going to find the audience later or early. No matter imo. So, you differentiate the platform with a period of exclusivity and then you potentially bring them over to make a second debut. It's also the case you don't need a second marketing beat for GaaS for reasons already listed where you do for single player games.
 
Shirkelton

Shirkelton

Member
Aug 20, 2020
6,242
At a certain point it doesn't matter what Sarah Bond promises or alludes to; whether or not they're in hardware is a choice that's being made for them.
 
Toriko

Toriko

Banned
Dec 29, 2017
7,793
I really wonder what Xbox will look like in 5 years. At this point them releasing another console in 2026 is likely not going to do anything.

What if the handheld device starts selling through the roof though and stimulates hardware. Crazier things have happened.

UraMallas said:
Iunno. Feels like GaaS games can come late and still hit. There's this base still built in, playing, talking about it, engaging with the title online. Even years later. So, maybe counter to the prevailing wisdom, I feel like GaaS games DON'T need to be day and date. They can come over when they need a boost as long as they are actually good games. Sea of Thieves didn't need Playstation to be a hit. It differentiated the Xbox platform and is now mopping up some extra revenue as the game transitions into another phase. Forza Horizon obviously doesn't need Playstation to be a hit. If the GaaS game is good, it is going to find the audience later or early. No matter imo. So, you differentiate the platform with a period of exclusivity and then you potentially bring them over to make a second debut. It's also the case you don't need a second marketing beat for GaaS for reasons already listed where you do for single player games.
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Honestly I agree. I think it is the SP games ironically that would benefit from day and date. Porting Hifi Rush or Gears later is not going to do too much bottom line wise.
 
Casa

Casa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,749
Other than going fully third party mega-publisher, I'm not really sure what they can pivot to that would completely transform their outlook.

Nobody is buying the reasonably priced consoles now as it is. Who is going to rush out to buy this super powerful, "most significant technical leap ever" machine that they teased which will likely be more expensive? If they make this rumored Xbox handheld I don't see how they can price the thing low enough to entice casuals.

Unless they can align an all-time great launch lineup for a machine that has some cool new gimmick that people can latch into I don't even see a selling point for a new Xbox console. Going another generation where the Xbox Next and PS6 are nearly identical will just see the Xbox getting smoked 10-1 rather than 5-1 or whatever it is now.
 
mentok15

mentok15

Member
Dec 20, 2017
7,542
Australia
Check it out said:
N64, GameCube and Wii U were all commercial disasters. Nintendo was able to survive these down sale consoles by supplementing with a handheld in the Game Boy Advance, an absolute commercial home run with the Wii and the greatest console ever in the Switch. The rumors of the portable Xbox make sense to try to supplement the commercial failure of the XBone and XSX/S but I don't see how they can differentiate themselves too much from the available options. Steam Deck seems to have that market locked.

The difference in these scenarios is that Nintendo stayed agile and continued to rely heavily on exclusives. They were true to their ethos and it ended up paying off. People eventually realized they wanted to play Nintendo games and they weren't just for kids as was the reputation in the early 2000s. Most of their decisions were based on finding their niche.

Microsoft doesn't seem to have a clear vision except to make the most money possible. They tried to trick consumers by parading Phil In cute t-shirts (suits are never our friends)but as soon as real money was invested (Activision) the ROI became king. It's going to be fascinating to watch them squirm and pivot to win back any unwarranted trust. I don't think they'll ever get mine back, which is fine, I don't think they really care.
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That's the issue, they don't care. Nintendo has to care as gaming is pretty much their entire business, for Microsoft it's just a very small fraction of their revenue ($15 vs $221 billion)
 
Dougieflesh

Dougieflesh

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,421
Milky Way Ghetto
UraMallas said:
Iunno. Feels like GaaS games can come late and still hit. There's this base still built in, playing, talking about it, engaging with the title online. Even years later. So, maybe counter to the prevailing wisdom, I feel like GaaS games DON'T need to be day and date. They can come over when they need a boost as long as they are actually good games. Sea of Thieves didn't need Playstation to be a hit. It differentiated the Xbox platform and is now mopping up some extra revenue as the game transitions into another phase. Forza Horizon obviously doesn't need Playstation to be a hit. If the GaaS game is good, it is going to find the audience later or early. No matter imo. So, you differentiate the platform with a period of exclusivity and then you potentially bring them over to make a second debut. It's also the case you don't need a second marketing beat for GaaS for reasons already listed where you do for single player games.
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Yeah, but just think how much more money you could make if it came out earlier 👀
 
Clippy

Clippy

Member
Feb 11, 2022
2,231
GK86 said:

View: https://twitter.com/shinobi602/status/1790474998538223643?t=A2TWxT-mUlrI4jYPplJfRg&s=19

How long before we see day and date launches on rival platforms?
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Tweets like that make no sense to me, no offense to shinobi

Xbox talks about putting games elsewhere > hardware collapses > hardware collapse is WHY they announced what made hardware collapse? At least use previous quarters to make the point.

I guess we're quickly gonna see the shift from "Xbox is gonna be fine despite going multiplatform" to a new story.
 
CaptNink

CaptNink

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,147
B.C, Canada
So *if* this is the end for XBOX hardware, what happens to our digital library? Can we hope for an app of some sort or are my 400+ digital games I own going to go up in smoke.

I guess it's time to start seriously start thinking about this.
 
Toriko

Toriko

Banned
Dec 29, 2017
7,793
Clippy said:
Tweets like that make no sense to me, no offense to shinobi

Xbox talks about putting games elsewhere > hardware collapses > hardware collapse is WHY they announced what made hardware collapse? At least use previous quarters to make the point.

I guess we're quickly gonna see the shift from "Xbox is gonna be fine despite going multiplatform" to a new story.
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Hardware collapesed way before putting games on PS5. Unless you mean PC?
 

level

Member
May 25, 2023
857
CaptNink said:
So *if* this is the end for XBOX hardware, what happens to our digital library? Can we hope for an app of some sort or are my 400+ digital games I own going to go up in smoke.

I guess it's time to start seriously start thinking about this.
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My guess is that they'll be stuck on the console. However, maybe Microsoft will allow cloud streaming of them. But then again, this may also rely on gamepass not being canned too.
 
UraMallas

UraMallas

Member
Nov 1, 2017
19,619
United States
Dougieflesh said:
Yeah, but just think how much more money you could make if it came out earlier 👀
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I guess I was posting under the assumption that they want to sell consoles and so try to balance some things. If they are saying "quarterly profit above longterm health of console" then yeah. It doesn't matter and they should just move it all now. Which I'm not saying is unlikely anymore. I don't know the plan but I think it's definitely worth entertaining the idea of them truly giving up and burning the console biz down.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
544
Linkified said:
Just point out everything you've mentioned is not marketing of the hardware like the other poster pointed out.
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What's interesting is they decided to go PC day and date and from that point Xbox consoles seemed to be secondary. AFAIK, no Xbox first party exclusives were missing from PC day one but often we'd wait a year to get ports of PC games. I didn't love going PC day and date as a console consumer because it signaled to me, that the Xbox console wasn't their priority. If I felt that way, I can imagine it wasn't a rare sentiment. A few friends who had an Xbox One skipped the XSX because they didn't see value . They also ended up playing less Microsoft published games than they did in the last generation.

Microsoft has historically failed as a hardware manufacturer and I'd guess that Xbox has to be one of their few true successes. Eventually the numbers showed Xbox hardware wasn't important in the longterm but Microsoft tried to play this both sides game. If I was a PC gamer I would see zero reason to own a Series console.
 
Zebesian-X

Zebesian-X

Member
Dec 3, 2018
20,189
Clippy said:
Tweets like that make no sense to me, no offense to shinobi

Xbox talks about putting games elsewhere > hardware collapses > hardware collapse is WHY they announced what made hardware collapse? At least use previous quarters to make the point.

I guess we're quickly gonna see the shift from "Xbox is gonna be fine despite going multiplatform" to a new story.
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Hardware was collapsing before the ports started dropping, not because of them
 
Rosebud

Rosebud

Two Pieces
Member
Apr 16, 2018
44,338
CaptNink said:
So *if* this is the end for XBOX hardware, what happens to our digital library? Can we hope for an app of some sort or are my 400+ digital games I own going to go up in smoke.

I guess it's time to start seriously start thinking about this.
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We have to pay a sub to be able to play them at the cloud. I'm dreading this possibility
 
Mr Evil 37

Mr Evil 37

Member
Mar 7, 2022
11,950
Check it out said:
AFAIK, no Xbox first party exclusives were missing from PC day one but often we'd wait a year to get ports of PC games.
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This was only a few games. Gears Tactics, Age 1-4, Ara. All strategy games with PC-focused audiences that required time to get console versions to where they wanted to be and it didn't make sense to arbitrarily delay the PC version. The vast majority of games were and are on both day one, and now we're even getting Myth Retold day one.

Really don't think this was a major factor.

Edit: I forgot Flight Sim. Still, my point stands.
 
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