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Deleted member 11276

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,223
So with the pretty insane specs and custom hardware of the Series X, I really wonder how much impact next gen will have on PC gaming, talking about next gen only games here. Couple of points:

- custom SSD with custom decompression hardware: Xbox Series X games won't run on a standard HDD, is it safe to assume future PC ports will require a NVMe SSD with atleast 2.4 GB/s? I think that will be the case indeed. However, XSX also sports features we have not seen in PC gaming yet, like hardware decompression. I wonder if PCs will be fine with PCIe 3.0 SSDs running at 2-4 GB/s or if hardware decompression may be necessary. Maybe it is possible MS or other vendors will release SSDs with similar hardware found in Xbox Velocity Engine?

- VRAM / RAM: So it seems like in best case scenario, developers will use 10 GB of extremly fast GDDR6 memory for the GPU. I wonder if future games will struggle on 6 and 8 GB VRAM cards, sure it could probably work on lower resolutions and with lower textures, but will it be enough for a stutter free experience? In addition, XSX uses a new, apparently, hardware based feature called Sampler Feedback Streaming which MS said will massively reduce VRAM consumption due to intelligent texture streaming. I have found something similar called DirectX Sampler Feedback, but I don't know if its the exact same thing and if current GPUs support it at all. If it can't be used on PC we could see an enourmous increase of VRAM usage and higher prices for new graphics cards.

- Mesh Shading. So this was a surprise for me. Mesh shading allows for significantly increased geometry detail with high framerates and low CPU usage. However, only Turing supports this and apparently, according to Star Citizen developers, it's not an easy switch between older shading methods and mesh shading. Could this mean GPUs that do not feature mesh shading will suffer in next gen games?

- CPU: so the Ryzen CPU clocks at about 3.6 GHz fixed for 7 cores and 14 threads which is very impressive indeed. Due to the high efficiency of Zen 2 and the high clock count, Intel CPUs with less than 12 Threads may not keep up with that, even if clocked higher. So will 4c/8t cpus die next generation?

BTW, I know a lot of "PC will get better parts after the consoles are released" talk will come up. Let's just say this: I think it's important to view it from a perspective of people who just upgraded their PCs. People don't have money to buy a new GPU or CPU every year.

What's your opinion? How will next gen consoles impact PC gaming?
 
Last edited:

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
15,493
First few years the Series X will be able to compete with the high end. After 5 years this will be different.

I just hope to see a decrease in prices.
 

nsilvias

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,008
> 1. PC CPU's are faster than console cpus so decompression will be faster regardless
 

Deleted member 8468

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
9,109
M.2 drives are already faster than 2.4gb/s games just don't utilize them.

If anything this console generation might actually let us see some use out of them for gaming.
 

Jadax

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,055
I don't see how it would affect PC gaming tbh - right now most people have 16gb ram (even though games don't use that much), people use m2 1TB ssd commonly, ryzen zen 2 latest is already running at that clock or better, and with zen 3 about to release PC gaming will be ahead.
 

Elven_Star

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,995
At first, it'll be on par with high-end PCs. After 1-2 years, better GPUs will hit the market at reasonable prices. To answer your question, there won't be much of an impact. Same thing happens at the beginning of every console cycle.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 11276

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,223
At first, it'll be on par with high-end PCs. After 1-2 years, better GPUs will hit the market. To answer your question, there won't be much of an impact. Same thing happens at the beginning of every console cycle.
I think it's important to view it from a perspective of the people who just upgraded their PCs. People don't have money to buy a new GPU or CPU every year.
 

Deleted member 34714

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 28, 2017
1,617
Custom SSD is just nvme, nothing different.
SSD speeds on XsX isn't a high cap compared to PC as well.
CPU on xbox series X as we know it don't benefit from boost/turbo speeds so that's a negative already.
GPU will be interesting because Nvidia will launch the 3000 series. If time repeats itself as usual, Nvidia will have something that shits on consoles very quickly.
 

DieH@rd

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,665
PCIE5 and 6 are comming, and the drive speeds will quadruple from the current Gen4 (which Series X is not using) during this gen.
 

TitanicFall

Member
Nov 12, 2017
8,322
> 1. PC CPU's are faster than console cpus so decompression will be faster regardless

In relation to a Series X CPU? The majority would need to upgrade their CPUs. The impact of Series X or next-gen consoles in general is that minimum specs are going to go up. That's the impact it will have on PC gaming.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,901
Ampere is easily going to crush Series X and PS5 on the GPU side. Most likely AMD's Ryzen 4xxx CPUs will be better than next-gen consoles as well. Current NVMes are already faster than what's in Series X. Won't be much of a change, imo.
 

ss_lemonade

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,695
- CPU: so the Ryzen CPU clocks at about 3.6 GHz fixed for 7 cores and 14 threads which is very impressive indeed. Due to the high efficiency of Zen 2 and the high clock count, Intel CPUs with less than 12 Threads may not keep up with that, even if clocked higher. So will 4c/8t cpus die next generation?
Isn't it an 8c/16t cpu?
 

chris 1515

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,075
Barcelona Spain
So with the pretty insane specs and custom hardware of the Series X, I really wonder how much impact next gen will have on PC gaming, talking about next gen only games here. Couple of points:

- custom SSD with custom decompression hardware: Xbox Series X games won't run on a standard HDD, is it safe to assume future PC ports will require a NVMe SSD with atleast 2.4 GB/s? I think that will be the case indeed. However, XSX also sports features we have not seen in PC gaming yet, like hardware decompression. I wonder if PCs will be fine with PCIe 3.0 SSDs running at 2-4 GB/s or if hardware decompression may be necessary. Maybe it is possible MS or other vendors will release SSDs with similar hardware found in Xbox Velocity Engine?

- VRAM / RAM: So it seems like in best case scenario, developers will use 10 GB of extremly fast GDDR6 memory for the GPU. I wonder if future games will struggle on 6 and 8 GB VRAM cards, sure it could probably work on lower resolutions and with lower textures, but will it be enough for a stutter free experience? In addition, XSX uses a new, apparently, hardware based feature called Sampler Feedback Streaming which MS said will massively reduce VRAM consumption due to intelligent texture streaming. I have found something similar called DirectX Sampler Feedback, but I don't know if its the exact same thing and if current GPUs support it at all. If it can't be used on PC we could see an enourmous increase of VRAM usage and higher prices for new graphics cards.

- Mesh Shading. So this was a surprise for me. Mesh shading allows for significantly increased geometry detail with high framerates and low CPU usage. However, only Turing supports this and apparently, according to Star Citizen developers, it's not an easy switch between older shading methods and mesh shading. Could this mean GPUs that do not feature mesh shading will suffer in next gen games?

- CPU: so the Ryzen CPU clocks at about 3.6 GHz fixed for 7 cores and 14 threads which is very impressive indeed. Due to the high efficiency of Zen 2 and the high clock count, Intel CPUs with less than 12 Threads may not keep up with that, even if clocked higher. So will 4c/8t cpus die next generation?

BTW, I know a lot of "PC will get better parts after the consoles are released" talk will come up. Let's just say this: I think it's important to view it from a perspective of people who just upgraded their PCs. People don't have money to buy a new GPU or CPU every year.

What's your opinion? How will next gen consoles impact PC gaming?

The custom SSD technology uses the new Direct Storage API, I am sure we will have Direct Storage SSD arriving on PC. The most important number is 4,8 GB/s using compressed data with realtime hardware decompression into RAM. This is impressive, few SSD reach this speed.
 

PixelatedDonut

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
Philly ❤️
games will scale like they always have, and with these consoles wasting so many resources trying to push 4K that leaves good headroom for lots PC gamers.
 

Maple

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,792
The requirements for next-gen games on PC are going to skyrocket.

People have been cruising by on 2500k and 3770k CPUs for years with no issues. That's about to change.
 

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
6,013
Series X with Gamepass might end up being a better deal than a PC. All the power of a high end (current) ~$1000 pc and access to tons of games, for probably a lot less.

I can't imagine that there will be a huge power increase for medium range gpus this year to put sub-$300 gpus on par with the new Xbox.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 11276

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,223
The custom SSD technology uses the new Direct Storage API, I am sure we will have Direct Storage SSD arriving on PC.
Yes, DirectStorage is confirmed for PC. Question is will we have to buy new SSDs to use it? Is it just a software feature? No one knows. And the most important feature is SFS which is part of the velocity engine but not DS apparently.
 

PLASTICA-MAN

Member
Oct 26, 2017
23,845
To close out the segment on the power of Xbox Series X, The Coalition's Technical Director, Mike Rayner, came up to show us how his team is planning to optimize Gears 5 for Xbox Series X. The team showcased a technical demo of Gears 5, powered by Unreal Engine, for Xbox Series X using the full PC Ultra Spec settings, which included higher resolution textures and higher resolution volumetric fog, as well as a 50% higher particle count than the PC Ultra Specs allowed. They also showed off the opening cutscene, which now runs at 60 FPS in 4K (it was 30 FPS on Xbox One X), meaning the transition from real-time cutscenes to gameplay is incredibly smooth.

There were also some noticeable improvements in a few other areas as well. Load times were extremely fast, and the team was able to turn on some features that, while previously implemented, had to be turned off for the Xbox One X version. This included contact shadows (providing extra depth to objects) and self-shadow lighting on plants and grass, making every scene feel more realistic. Rayner also shared that the game is already running over 100 FPS and that the team is investigating implementing 120 FPS gameplay for multiplayer modes, giving players an experience never before seen on consoles. Most impressive of all? The fact that the team was able to get all of this up and running in a matter of weeks.

Well for now yeah but not in the upcoming years. The general course of time will be the same. But this time, it's the first time we are getting high-end.
Still even if next-gen consoles will be surpassed by PCs, don't expect low settings vs max settings like this gen vs PC like pixelated shadows vs crips shadows. All versions of games will stay high end but PC will offer 5K and more if a console game is 4K and 75 FPs and more if a PC game is 60 FPS. Diminishing returns will happen and the gap now is so narrowed down.
 
Last edited:

Waaghals

Member
Oct 27, 2017
862
I think a lot of very tech interested people will buy an XSX at launch to check it out.
I also think that it will be very expensive to solidly outperform the new console in every area for the first year or so.

This will not matter in the long run. You will be able to turn down settings, and there are many gameplay experiences on pc that are not available on consoles.
I do not believe it will have any lasting impact on the market.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,159
Small, you forget PC gaming is about so so much more than simple specs.

However, I'd be happy to get one alongside my PC. For getting discounted titles and more gamepass titles to save on games physically etc. With less caveats.
 

Gitaroo

Member
Nov 3, 2017
8,073
It's still not the fastest cpu compare to pc market but it is better than a lot of cpu especially the one with less cores, zen 2 is still not 100% clock to clock as fast as newer i7 irc, but zen 3 is. Gpu will have advantage over a lot of the old one from pascel etc for sure, but vram situation is a maybe; games has full 13.5 gigs acess but it still has to share between sound etc. Look at xbx version of gears 5 which can't have ultra texture even when it had 9gigs rams available for games but a 2080 can do it without any issue with only 8gigs vram. Ppl forgot to factor in its a share pool of memory. Higher bandwidth than 2080 though.
 

SunBroDave

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,280
MS raising the technical floor that most games will target over the coming years is actually a good thing for PC gaming. In theory we'll be getting games that better take advantage of high end PC hardware, as opposed to be held back by less ambitious games that have to run on low-spec consoles. Think about all of the games over the last gen that saw serious downgrades from pre-release to release because they had to run on PS4/XB1. like The Witcher 3. If consoles get stronger, then we should see those types of downgrades happen less and less.
 

Cleardata

Member
Nov 1, 2017
261
I think the effect will be positive as the baseline is moved up for multi platform games.
  1. Ray Tracing Support
  2. SSD optimized titles.
  3. More Multi core support in game engines.
  4. Cross Play / Cross Save / Play Anywhere
 

Genio88

Banned
Jun 4, 2018
964
Don't know and i don't really care, i love PC gaming in general and i'm sure my PC with i5 9600k OC and RTX 2060 will run "next gen" games just fine at 2560x1080p which is the resolution of my current ultra wide monitor, and when it'll start giving me issues i can always upgrade it
 

chris 1515

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,075
Barcelona Spain
Yes, DirectStorage is confirmed for PC. Question is will we have to buy new SSDs to use it? Is it just a software feature? No one knows. And the most important feature is SFS which is part of the velocity engine but not DS apparently.

This is an hardware feature, there is a decompressor block inside the SOC probably inside the SSD controller. I suppose it means buy a new SSD.
 

gdt

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,554
Same shit every cycle. It'll compete for awhile, then get dusted in end of year 1/2. And that's fine.
 

MazeHaze

Member
Nov 1, 2017
8,627
I think it's important to view it from a perspective of the people who just upgraded their PCs. People don't have money to buy a new GPU or CPU every year.
I just built a rig with a 2070 super. In about 2 years I will sell this card and upgrade, and it'll only cost me a couple hundred dollars net for a substantial upgrade. I'm pretty sure my ryzen cpu will last me the entire generation. People building $1500-2000 rigs can most likely easily afford a new gpu in a couple years, especially if they sell their old one. A 3070/4070 or whatever will easily kick ass the entire gen. Hell my 6 year old gtx980 still blasts through most games on higher than console settings at 1080p 60fps
 

Bjones

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,622
so my answer is none.

but the reasons isn't because of pc will have better specs in a year it's because for pc gaming specs don't matter.
If you own a laptop for school or home and it can run overwatch then a lot of pc owners are good with that dual functionality.
 
Last edited:

TitanicFall

Member
Nov 12, 2017
8,322
Custom SSD is just nvme, nothing different.
SSD speeds on XsX isn't a high cap compared to PC as well.

There may be a difference. Right now there's not a signifcant difference in load times between an NVME and Sata SSD for games on PC. So something tailored made for gaming applications might change that. Of course it may just be the issue that PC hardware is so different that there is no SSD optimization for games.
 

secretanchitman

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,838
Chicago, IL
It's absolutely impressive hardware for the price, no getting around that. There is simply no way to build a PC with that kind of performance for around $500-$700 and this is coming from a 9900K/2080/970 Pro 1TB/Dan Case v2 owner.

It'll probably sway a lot of folks who want high-end gaming but don't want a PC. However, I'm not getting another Xbox because I have a PC that's more than capable of handling games next-gen and by the time my PC starts to not handle games, it'll be upgrade time anyway (5-7 years from now).
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,545
so my answer is none.

but the reasons isn't because of pc will have better specs in a year it's because for pc gaming specs don't matter.
If you own a laptop for school of home and it can overwatch then a lot of pc owners are good with that dual functionality.
Plus the fact that you don't need specs like this if you game on a 1080 or 1440p monitor or don't care about Ultra settings etc
 

Elven_Star

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,995
As somebody else mentioned, scalability is also a factor. I was so happy when I heard next-gen consoles are going for 4K. I game on a 4:3 17" CRT monitor @1280x960 (basically, 4:3's 1080p). The number of pixels my PC has to push is less than 15% of 4K! (1228800 pixels vs. 8294400 pixels). My 1070 is never going to die.
 
Last edited:

Braag

Member
Nov 7, 2017
1,908
I'm guessing things will go forward normally. Though at some point mechanical drives will become almost obsolete for newer games, which is fine because SSDs are quite cheap these days unless you going for the larger m.2. drives.
 

orava

Alt Account
Banned
Jun 10, 2019
1,316
Similar and faster hardware will benefit greatly. Slower hardware can easily scale down because it's basically same tech. So PC will manage very favorably.

It's really great how MS handled the console hardware this time.
 

Deleted member 47654

user requested account closure
Banned
Sep 10, 2018
2,612
I need streamlabs and Microsoft Office running on the console, also M+K support, thats all i ask Microsoft.
 

ChristianM

Member
Mar 21, 2018
480
Sweden
Of course it will move the baseline for games. But developers won't suddenly start making games that only works on 8 core cpus and custom built nvmes. 100 million+ ps4/xbox one's suggests otherwise. Gradually over the years the requirements will surely shift until what is state of the art today is the new baseline. But it will take years. No need to panic.
 

Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,898
Wait? what's this PC thing? Are you guys sure you are not talking about a dead and obsolete platform? I vaguely remember stumbling across that abbreviation in historical archives from before PS4Pro and Xbox One X hit the market
 

Mentalist

Member
Mar 14, 2019
18,181
So with the pretty insane specs and custom hardware of the Series X, I really wonder how much impact next gen will have on PC gaming, talking about next gen only games here. Couple of points:

- custom SSD with custom decompression hardware: Xbox Series X games won't run on a standard HDD, is it safe to assume future PC ports will require a NVMe SSD with atleast 2.4 GB/s? I think that will be the case indeed. However, XSX also sports features we have not seen in PC gaming yet, like hardware decompression. I wonder if PCs will be fine with PCIe 3.0 SSDs running at 2-4 GB/s or if hardware decompression may be necessary. Maybe it is possible MS or other vendors will release SSDs with similar hardware found in Xbox Velocity Engine?

- VRAM / RAM: So it seems like in best case scenario, developers will use 10 GB of extremly fast GDDR6 memory for the GPU. I wonder if future games will struggle on 6 and 8 GB VRAM cards, sure it could probably work on lower resolutions and with lower textures, but will it be enough for a stutter free experience? In addition, XSX uses a new, apparently, hardware based feature called Sampler Feedback Streaming which MS said will massively reduce VRAM consumption due to intelligent texture streaming. I have found something similar called DirectX Sampler Feedback, but I don't know if its the exact same thing and if current GPUs support it at all. If it can't be used on PC we could see an enourmous increase of VRAM usage and higher prices for new graphics cards.

- Mesh Shading. So this was a surprise for me. Mesh shading allows for significantly increased geometry detail with high framerates and low CPU usage. However, only Turing supports this and apparently, according to Star Citizen developers, it's not an easy switch between older shading methods and mesh shading. Could this mean GPUs that do not feature mesh shading will suffer in next gen games?

- CPU: so the Ryzen CPU clocks at about 3.6 GHz fixed for 7 cores and 14 threads which is very impressive indeed. Due to the high efficiency of Zen 2 and the high clock count, Intel CPUs with less than 12 Threads may not keep up with that, even if clocked higher. So will 4c/8t cpus die next generation?

BTW, I know a lot of "PC will get better parts after the consoles are released" talk will come up. Let's just say this: I think it's important to view it from a perspective of people who just upgraded their PCs. People don't have money to buy a new GPU or CPU every year.

What's your opinion? How will next gen consoles impact PC gaming?
I just did a new build over the holidays, so this is very relevant for me

CPU: Ryzen 3700X- I'm good
RAM: 32 GB DDR4 3200
2 TB SATA SSD- this could be an issue... But I think it'll be all right, even though it's not NVME
GPU: GTX 1660TI- Honestly, the Series X is aiming at 4k 60, and I'm not planning on moving from 1080p anytime soon. So I think I'll be fine until the next wave of ray-tracing cards are available and the tech is matured--and hopefully the crazy performance of the next gen consoles will force the manufacturers to bring down the prices on mid-range cards to compete with the console value proposition. Spending 350 bucks or so in a holiday sale 3 or 4 years from now for a 3060 or equivalent should keep me up to date.