Ah, yeah that's true.
It's a really exciting time for the Yakuza team.
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Yakuza 3 remaster cut transphobic elements from original game
- Thread starter RPGamer92
- Start date
It's a really exciting time for the Yakuza team.
Yeah, Yakuza 0 really lit a fire under them, which rules.
Remember those dark, dark days of thinking we were never going to get a localisation for 5
I guess you could call it "self-censorship" at best:
"Self-censorship is the act of censoring or classifying one's own discourse. This is done out of fear of, or deference to, the sensibilities or preferences (actual or perceived) of others and without overt pressure from any specific party or institution of authority. Self-censorship is often practiced by film producers, film directors, publishers, news anchors, journalists, musicians, and other kinds of authors including individuals who use social media."
"Self-censorship is the act of censoring or classifying one's own discourse. This is done out of fear of, or deference to, the sensibilities or preferences (actual or perceived) of others and without overt pressure from any specific party or institution of authority. Self-censorship is often practiced by film producers, film directors, publishers, news anchors, journalists, musicians, and other kinds of authors including individuals who use social media."
I mean, you COULD call it that, but I think the smarter call would just be to call it "editing".
Yep, i agree. All the "censorship" whining is really stupid.
To be fair, we had to BEG Sony to step in (thanks Gio Corsi!) but once that hurdle was crossed, things clicked, it helps that Zero helps introduce newcomers.
A shame we couldn't get VC3 brought over.
Here's what I've noticed about people like you.
Your starting point for the determination of censorship isn't the question of who is changing something, but what is being changed. Is it transphobic, racist, sexist, something else considered "offensive"? Therefore, changing it must be censorship.
In cases like this, where a creator desires to change something in order to improve it, that places you in the awkward position of decrying censorship while simultaneously asking that creator to suppress their vision.
Put another way: it isn't actually that you're allergic to censorship, so much as you're just reflexively defensive of the need to maintain space for things like transphobia in video games.
The Michiru substory was really the most egregious example of transphobia in the series. I think they must've realized they went too far with it because they never really brush with it again after that.
I know that guy got banned but daaaaaaaaaaamn b, you put him in his place
Yakuza series keeps on winning.
Only got into the series from 0 but absolutely loved 0,1,2 since they came out on ps4.
Kiryu instantly became one of my all time favourite protagonists and in the three entries I have played they have been surprisingly wholesome and progressive so it's good to see them want to make these changes when needed.
Now we just need details on if/when the rest are coming out in the west.
Only got into the series from 0 but absolutely loved 0,1,2 since they came out on ps4.
Kiryu instantly became one of my all time favourite protagonists and in the three entries I have played they have been surprisingly wholesome and progressive so it's good to see them want to make these changes when needed.
Now we just need details on if/when the rest are coming out in the west.
I don't have any insider knowledge here, so don't treat this as the gospel, but I don't THINK you have much of anything to worry about re: the remasters coming to the West. Sega of America has mentioned the remasters of 3-5 a few times, while being careful to point out that they aren't announcing anything yet, which is a good sign. They're acknowledging them, not pretending they don't exist. By summer time we should likely know more about their future plans.
I didn't play all of 3 but that character in 0, one of the real estate bosses, was a pretty big y i k e s too. I wouldn't say there's no transphobia in the series post-3.
The Pleasure King? Yeah, that's fair. The game kind of goes out of its way to make that character turn good after you fight them, but...it's still not great.
Definitely not as bad as alleyway rape and a "that was worse than prison" blackout joke, but...yeah.
That's great to hear, I haven't read anything since the initial announcement so I wasn't sure if we would get them but I was secretly hopeful.
Kiryu is just the best.
At least we have Chinese localisation of Yakuza 3 and 4. If I recall correctly, we have a whacky flow to translate Japanese to Chinese:
Japanese -> English -> Chinese
Yakuza 3 was the only game that featured legitimately transphobic elements. And the dialogue in the recent Kiwami games and localizations have always painted Kiryu as a very progressive and accepting individual.
The quest involved a Transgender person becoming attracted to you and literally chasing you around the city, with Kiryu running away like his life depended on it.
Worst thing was, it happened multiple times in the game.
User Banned (permanent): Inflammatory False Equivalence in Defense of Transphobia; Account in Junior Phase
I agree it isn't nice but then again you kill people on video games all the time and isn't it wrong to kill people? We are talking about a work of fiction here... so why is the moral outrage limited to transphobic behavior and not murderous behavior for example?
Fantastic.
Depressing to comparae this with the Catherine remaster debacle :(
Depressing to comparae this with the Catherine remaster debacle :(
Unbelievable use of this GIF
Kiwami had a very transphobic sidestory, the Pleasure King is a caricature that at best flirts with transphobia. And I think the progressive nature of the series as a whole has been greatly exaggerated. There's no major women characters in any of these games that doesn't exist to be damseled or to serve as fodder for male character development, just for a start. I don't have time to list every grievance i have with the series, but suffice it to say i think it talks out of both sides of its mouth a lot.
Yes, the portrayal/obsession with violence is arguably problematic but violence has nothing to do with this issue, they are completely different topics. Please don't bring violence up again.
Nothing excuses deadnaming or directly using the wrong pronouns for a trans person. The game flippantly mistreats its trans character in this way - to the point that the development team don't think it represents their views and have cut it from the game.
And it is cool that the developer did it to avoid insulting trans people but I'm referring about the moral outrage since I never see the same level of outrage against violent behavior on video games anywhere which for me is weird.
Always saw it more as a "someone I am not attracted to is hunting me and that's why I have to escaoe" and not as a "Oh my God, transpersonal is hunting me, eww" . Iirc there are at least two queslines with an old lady (0 and Kiwami 2 I think) were an old lady is doing a similar thing and Kaz/Goro are trying to escape. Never understood it as ageism.
Good to hear.
My time with 0 definitely had me feeling weird about some characters, but Pleasure King isn't presented as trans, rather a drag queen. Either way I can get not being comfortable with it. I wasn't too big on the phone club stuff either.
How so? Would people here be so supporting if the Yakuza dev had taken out fighting from the game? There's a generalized acceptance of violent behavior which I find puzzling since violence is much more damaging than name-calling in my view.
You don't kill people in the Yakuza games, and Kiryu always fights pretty much in self-defense, so even in that sense what you are saying makes no sense.
It's a false equivalency because we are talking about how media can affect the way people are treated, minorities being shown in a stereotypical damaging way leads to discrimination IRL. This has nothing to do with "violence".
Violence depiction in games is bad but it doesnt target anyone for their sex, gender choice or race, is mostly a gameplay mechanic against the "bad guys". I think the difference in intention is clear enough.
Yes, people would care if they took out one of the main gameplay elements of the game what are you even on about. Beating up criminals is most of what the game is, misgendering people and being transphobic isn't.
Ishin doesn't need a remaster because it's already on PS4 60 fps 1080p; just need official localization announcement (because of the rumor of SEGA survey including Ishin awhile back).
While Kenzan remaster probably wont happen, fan translation (hopefully) still happening & release this year.
Violence is one of the central themes of the Yakuza series. Trans-people issues/ridicule is not.
But if media can affect the way people are treated how can violent behavior not also affect people with violence which is also damaging?
Ok this makes sense about the difference here but then again violence is just bad in general and not applied to a specific group.
Okay, yes, violence is bad. Thank you. This has never been a contentious aspect of video games before.
Violence isn't used in a discriminatory way in the Yakuza games, and Violence in video games don't make you violent IRL. It's pretty clear. Also Violence is bad, it's obvious, most of the times in games the hero is just fighting for the sake of good and fighting bad guys, you know? The main character, Kiryu, would literally never fight anyone if people weren't assholes.
Also how in the hell do you only have 5 posts and they are specifically from this topic. You should know how people coming to sensitive topics like this and having NO POSTS ANYWHERE ELSE is a huge red flag. It's fine if you're not a troll but come on lol.
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But this is not only about Yakuza. I mean almost every game has violence. Games like GTA or RDR you drive over anyone or can shoot anyone. Still you won't see the same outrage.
Yeah but if a game made ridiculing trans-people its central theme that wouldn't make it ok either...
This is what I don't understand. Yeah violence isn't being used in a discriminatory way here but then a bad behavior that is not discriminatory (meaning it affects everyone) suddenly makes that behavior good? This is what I have trouble understanding about this moral stance towards these topics. Granted, I consider it a good thing not to make fun of trans people or anyone due to their identity but then again I think it is time this moral outrage is more consequent with bad behavior in general then.
I lurk mostly but this is a subject that intrigues me now so I posted.
The Key part in here is harmful stereotypes that don't reflect reality at all and end up harming people IRL, that's it.
This is not the time at all to make a false equivalency and start talking about Violence in games, if you care so much you can make a topic about that subject, I wouldn't have a problem with that at all and I think it's worth talking about, but it's 100% unrelated and you look dishonest in this thread.
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