[Rumor] IGN FR: Amazon won't sell any Switch and upcoming Nintendo games in France
- Thread starter Rouk'
- Start date
There's no point in comparing US and European laws IMHO.
Having said that, it's difficult to comment without knowing whether there's a local french regulation about this or not (IIRC there is one here in Italy about selling goods below cost, and one specific about online book resellers too)
Having said that, it's difficult to comment without knowing whether there's a local french regulation about this or not (IIRC there is one here in Italy about selling goods below cost, and one specific about online book resellers too)
OP
OP
For France:
I just searched, it seems in 2017, there was around 25M unique Amazon custommers per month. Out of a population of 67M (with around 13M people under 15, so really a market size closer to 54M). Fnac, its main competitor had 12.5M unique customers in the same time frame. So Amazon is only twice as big as Fnac, and covers less than half of the population.
And I'm not talking about paid account here, for neither of them.
Loss leaders are illegal? Or is this only for the manufacturers, not companies trying to get ppl in the store? I'm thinking printers and ink business model here.
I'm surprised the EU allows for that with its antitrust laws.
Why should anyone care for how much you sell a console? If Amazon is giving it away for 10€ who cares? As long as Nintendo gets what it deserves it should not matter what Amazon is doing.
Completely different subsidiary, and completely different distributor from the issue years ago with the 3DS price drop, and NoA not refunding the price difference to Amazon NA. Different situations.
Nintendo cares, because it undercuts their relationship with their other retail partners. It could lead those other partners to no longer sell Nintendo products, or to demand a cheaper price to compete with Amazon (in which case Nintendo would make less from each console).
All that is happening here is Nintendo is refusing to sell to Amazon directly because they [AMZ] are assumingly breaking pre-existing pricing agreements they had together. Amazon is still free to purchase Switches from other sources and resell them (assuming this is legal under French law), but their margins would be non-existent at that point. That sounds like what they are doing with Switch software, and I'm sure they're making much lower margins as a result.
It's almost as if there's not enough information to decide who is breaking any laws or how this came to be.
Amazon are the king of shit practicing. They've singlehandedly destroyed countless companies because of their aggressive pricing, not to mention their tax evasions.
but yeah nintendo are just as bad ok
Nintendo has already been paid for any products Amazon sells. I don't know about EU, but here in the US, I haven't seen any small retail game shops in years and years. It's only just Gamestop and the bigger stores like Best Buy and Walmart. And it wasn't Amazon that made those smaller retailers go away, it was Gamestop buying up all the other franchises like Babbage's and EB. This is only going to hurt Nintendo by costing them sales because the #1 retailer isn't selling their products. That's a lot of lost sales right there.
People are posting based on the information in the op because breaking the low is ok if you're protecting other retailers. And I said both companies are wrong here. Never said Amazon is good so I don't need you to lecture me about how bad they're.
Both companies are obviously being dodgy, I agree, but my point was that it shouldn't be a surprise to see most of the vitriol go towards Amazon. It's not a fanboy thing, it's a should-be natural reaction to anything to do with amazon because they're a pile of crap.
Some here are not acting like both companies are wrong except one is worse. Some here are acting like Nintendo is doing the right thing which is what I'm talking about.
With malls, there's choices. At this rate in a few decades, there is going to be only a choice. Singular. And that's literally what Amazon is aiming for. They can take a hit for hundreds of millions to billions and bury their competition until it doesn't matter. And I don't remember malls have daily crawls to pricing that they can match every. single. day. of. the. year.
Well shit, I'm not in France but Amazon.fr ships for free to my country and they always had the best prices by far. So much so that I'm fine with some french boxes for non-limited editions.
True, Nintendo can't control what Amazon sells products for ONCE they're purchased. However Nintendo can certainly refuse to sell to Amazon after if there is a breach of an agreed upon price level. Which sounds like what is happening here. It would also not be the first time Amazon has bullied distributors and manufacturers using their market dominant position to gain a more favorable business arrangement.
Nintendo isn't REQUIRED to sell to Amazon, nor is Amazon required to buy directly from Nintendo. But I'm sure Amazon can't get a good price for the Switch outside of getting it direct from Nintendo, so they simply won't sell it. That's Nintendo's loss for missing a large market, and Amazon's loss for not servicing fans of Nintendo's products.
I wish Amazon had some competition in the US.
Good to hear they don't completely dominate the rest of the world the way they do in the United States.
I say this as a guy who has had an Amazon account almost since the site started to buy books.
I have noticed issues with Amazon and PS, Nintendo, and some third party content too.
it is hit or miss as far as having stock or allowing pre orders.
it is hit or miss as far as having stock or allowing pre orders.
I would care. So should anyone paying attention. The major reason to go with loss leading on product is to drive competitors out of business so you can charge more later, when you have more of a monopoly.
OP
OP
No matter what we are talking about, Monopoly is a bad thing, for everyone. I believe the main reason the video game market is thriving right now is because Sony Microsoft and Nintendo are all doing well. (Just think of the early years of the gen : dead wiiU and Vita, a 3DS sold at loss, and PS4/One having far too few games, compared to what happened in 2016 and onwards)
100% agree.
Without competition the company is only going to focus entirely on profits. You need competition to spur innovation.
I love how people are defending Nintendo for breaking the fucking law by price fixing.
What the fuck guys?
What the fuck guys?
But isn't any company also free to not sell a specific product to a retailer? As long as they fulfilled existing orders and never confirmed any new ones I don't see what amazon can do if Nintendo doesn't want to supply more to them.
Why would Nintendo bother going through a wholesale distributor and give up a portion of their cut if they're big enough to do the deals with all the major retailers themselves? This is assuming that's how Nintendo is doing it in France/Europe, but it would seem odd for Nintendo to not have direct relationships given Nintendo's size.
Wholesalers perform a vital distribution function for smaller manufacturers, but unless they're required by law in France, it's in Nintendo's best interest to control that supply chain and make those deals directly. Then they can control the price of their own products by cutting off supply for retailers that don't want to play ball. The same way Apple does it, or a host of other high-profile manufacturers.
You make a good point. So my next question is if I purchase product directly from Nintendo and Apple, and then turn around a sell it for a big loss, why would that care to them if they've already been paid?
Amazon wants to dominate. They don't mind taking the hit. It's their MO.
Huh? They sold it to me, the retailer. I've paid them what they charged me for it. So they're whole. If I turn around and give it away how does that effect them if they've already made their money?
Gee, now where I have I heard of a company doing the bolded part before? I'm sure that wonderful company Nintendo has never engaged in such shady practices.
Amazon sells so much and has so many other business that they don't need to sell Nintendo products. Basically, Nintendo needs Amazon more than Amazon needs Nintendo.
If I'm Retailer B, and Retailer A is over there selling the same product below cost because they want to put me out of business, I'm going to complain to Nintendo to give me a better deal. Or I might tell Nintendo to maybe not send over that next batch of Nintendo consoles, as that space might end up with a few more Sony shelves or other products.
It doesn't help Nintendo to piss off any of their large retail partners, and the best way to do that is to make sure the playing field is relatively level. If they appear to be showing favoritism, or turning a blind eye to one of their partners undercutting the others, it makes it hard for them to do deals in the future.
Nintendo is a manufacturer, not a market. They're allowed to make business deals that benefit their business, as long as they're not abusing a dominant market position to suppress competitors. In this case, Nintendo's competitors are Sony, Microsoft, and other game/hardware makers. Nintendo does NOT have a monopoly in this market. You may personally not care about the other players in this market, but that does not mean they aren't competitive.
But you're not wrong, Amazon doesn't need any particular company more than companies need Amazon, which is why they are often a pretty scary company.
That's exactly what they did back when Yamauchi was in charge. And now it seems kharma is still coming back to bite them in the ass, lol.
Yeah, they were definitely engaging in some suppression back when Nintendo was king. Video games were too nascent as an industry at that time for them to really get called on it. Couldn't really get away with it in today's market though, too much money in it to not get scrutinized.
I dunno about karma, but it definitely seems like these fights with Amazon are becoming more of a regular thing. I think these manufacturers are starting to realize if they cede too much power to Amazon, they may not be able to get it back. We basically saw the same with with Sony calling Amazon's bluff on the 20% discount earlier this year. Amazon ultimately blinked on that one, but I doubt they'll stop trying. We'll see who blinks first on this France thing.
Can't say it better.
It's atonishing how people can be brain washed.
"Amazon is evil"
"Nintendo is nice"
Life is not black or white, it's full of gray.
And right now Nintendo is abusing its position.
In France Amazon itself is quite big.
But almost nobody knows what prime is.
Also Netflix is growing but not very big as for now.
In all my family ans friends i knows only 2 persons that have a Netflix account (and i d ont have one)
In France the peuple that loves streaming généraly goes with ilegal ways. Other ones just watch tv with their internet box
The most important thing for Amazon is that the customer needs Amazon more than Amazon needs the customer.
Amazon Canada is bitch and a half.
you can barely pre order some games now, at best they usually sell em at launch
you can barely pre order some games now, at best they usually sell em at launch
Nintendo has to have positive relations with all retailers. Amazon is undertaking actions meant to enhance its businesses while damaging others. Companies are going to complain to Nintendo. Amazon is devaluing the Switch when hey are undercutting retailers by such huge margins. 30-60 Euros is a huge undercutting. Obviously as a Consumer you really do not give a shit but you have to consider it from the Corporate viewpoint which is what Nintendo and its partners care about.
PlayStation got froggy with Amazon when it came to the big discounts on their games with preorder discounting. Its not something that is limited to Nintendo
PlayStation got froggy with Amazon when it came to the big discounts on their games with preorder discounting. Its not something that is limited to Nintendo
Amazon frequently picks fights with suppliers that result in stock issues. I wouldn't be surprised if they're demanding lower wholesale prices or something like that.
To many here, anything that is not instant gratification cannot be called pro-consumer. Seeing the big picture is just not possible. If a business goes belly up because they don't chose to go in a price war with companies such as Amazon or Walmart, that's their own undoing, because to the 'rational' consumer, the best price is the only thing of value.
If France and Spain have rules forbidding big retailers from undercutting small mom and pop shops when it comes to CDs and books, it's probably only a matter of time before it gets extended to software.
I'm not sure if Nintendo feels it has an obligation to keep giant retailers from destroying their smaller retail partners, or if that is even the reason it has made such a move, but if it is, good on them.