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I will be purchasing a sailboat to circumnavigate the world.
- Thread starter MrPressStart
- Start date
You'll clearly never agree so just stop this back and forth please.
Read this, OP:
"My Father's SOS—From the Middle of the Sea"
https://www.outsideonline.com/2360811/mayday-fathers-disappearance-pirates
I do not think you are likely to survive this. Heed the warnings of many of the people in this thread.
But more than anything anyone is saying in this thread, go seek out people in real life who you can meet who have demonstrable proof that they've done exactly what you're considering, and listen with an open mind to what they will tell you.
And finally, you have a child. Please seriously consider your responsibilities in life right now.
"My Father's SOS—From the Middle of the Sea"
https://www.outsideonline.com/2360811/mayday-fathers-disappearance-pirates
I do not think you are likely to survive this. Heed the warnings of many of the people in this thread.
I've never sailed before, so I'm quoting Chuck the Bean here as one example of someone with experience telling you this is a bad idea. Please heed their warnings.
But more than anything anyone is saying in this thread, go seek out people in real life who you can meet who have demonstrable proof that they've done exactly what you're considering, and listen with an open mind to what they will tell you.
And finally, you have a child. Please seriously consider your responsibilities in life right now.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Crowhurst
tl;dr Guy enters a race around the world to save his family from financial ruin, ends up way over his head, boat was eventually found adrift with his decreasingly sane log entries, including "an attempt to construct a philosophical reinterpretation of the human condition that would provide an escape from his impossible situation".
I must admit this was the first thing that entered my mind when I saw this thread. The film The Mercy is a reasonably accurate reconstruction of what probably happened, starring Colin Firth and Rachel Weisz as Crowhurst and his wife. I saw it recently on UK Amazon Prime video where it comes free with the subscription.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mercy
That's a cool dream OP, I've considered something like this before myself, but you should get some actual experience in this so you don't literally kill yourself. My cousin works on sailboats for a living going all over the world and I'm not sure it's something he'd be completely comfortable doing alone, you're going to want to do a bit (a lot) more than doing a bit of weekend sailing on a lake to prep for this.
Apropos of nothing, this was a decent read: https://www.amazon.com/dp/0618257322/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_awdb_t1_oK77BbQZRC61V
Seriously though, I think you should spend more time coming to realistic and emotional grips to the worst-case scenarios you'd be facing and the "oh shit"-case scenarios. It will help you prepare emotionally (because then shock, shame and betrayal won't slow you down if shit hits the fan) and also help you figure out what you need to mitigate harm should such a situation occur. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
I've read a bit about families where one parent goes away for months at a time. In many cases, the relationship is changed and it doesn't always snap back, unless both partners have retained the same vision for their relationship and work like hell to return to it. I'm not even talking about cheating or anything that drastic. It's just that people can change a lot (especially children at that age) and roles in that family will have shifted to accommodate a partner being away. The homecomer will have changed too: they've now had this big experience that their family had no part of. This is hardly an insurmountable problem but it's one that people seem to underestimate.
Seriously though, I think you should spend more time coming to realistic and emotional grips to the worst-case scenarios you'd be facing and the "oh shit"-case scenarios. It will help you prepare emotionally (because then shock, shame and betrayal won't slow you down if shit hits the fan) and also help you figure out what you need to mitigate harm should such a situation occur. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
I've read a bit about families where one parent goes away for months at a time. In many cases, the relationship is changed and it doesn't always snap back, unless both partners have retained the same vision for their relationship and work like hell to return to it. I'm not even talking about cheating or anything that drastic. It's just that people can change a lot (especially children at that age) and roles in that family will have shifted to accommodate a partner being away. The homecomer will have changed too: they've now had this big experience that their family had no part of. This is hardly an insurmountable problem but it's one that people seem to underestimate.
"Have you ever sailed across an ocean, Donald...on a sailboat, surrounded by sea with no land in sight, without even the possibility of sighting land for days to come? To stand at the helm of your destiny. I want that, one more time."
-- First thing I thought of when I saw this thread.
-- First thing I thought of when I saw this thread.
I admire your passion OP but I fear you're not really taking it seriously. Maybe because you have it in your head that it's 5 years away? I dunno, I know nothing about the see but I get the impression that you envision this as a gentle cruise.
Also some people are being super judgemental about your wife and kid. If your wife is genuinely fine with it and being supportive then that's awesome and you're incredibly lucky. A 10 year old kid isn't going to suffer because their dad took a trip for a year or two, especially if like you say they're going to meet you a couple of times throughout the trip. I think it'd be pretty rad for a kid to be able to tell their friends that their dad sailed around the world solo. It's not like you're the first parent to ever attempt something like this.
Also some people are being super judgemental about your wife and kid. If your wife is genuinely fine with it and being supportive then that's awesome and you're incredibly lucky. A 10 year old kid isn't going to suffer because their dad took a trip for a year or two, especially if like you say they're going to meet you a couple of times throughout the trip. I think it'd be pretty rad for a kid to be able to tell their friends that their dad sailed around the world solo. It's not like you're the first parent to ever attempt something like this.
You might want to learn how to fish as well, if you're planning on eating what you can catch, I don't think fishing in the ocean is the same as fishing anywhere else really.
And to be honest I doesn't sound like you really have the experience to do this. But don't let me get you down OP, you do you.
And to be honest I doesn't sound like you really have the experience to do this. But don't let me get you down OP, you do you.
So a couple of quick questions, how much sailing experience do you have? I'm not talking about lakes I'm talking about the open ocean? Are you VHF licensed or at least have experience? First Aid experience? A minor injury can turn very nasty, very quickly out on the sea if you don't know how to deal with it. Do you know how to plot courses in case of GPS/equipment failure? You say you'll have ample help on the trip? How? Is someone going with you?
These are just the starter for 10 questions that popped into my head.
I know you said it's a 5 year plan but that's a lot of time and money you have to invest over that period unless you have some of these skills now. I'm guessing you have a job to hold down during that time and you've already said you have a family so to me this seems like a huge(and dangerous) undertaking.
This is the most Resetera topic I've read in a while.
The community attacking itself with condescension and judgement over people they don't know. An OP who is probably trolling about a boat voyage and successfully getting a forum riled up. What seems to be some jealousy the OP implies they have money to be able to do something like this, even if it is a joke topic.
OP if you aren't trolling the forum to get people posting shit, this is a matter for your family and you possibly self-reflecting and/or speaking to experts. Yes you do have a child, but I'm not going to call you a deadbeat dad, imply you are spending your child's inheritance or even suggest you must end up cheating not having sex with your wife for a few years. Not right off the mark. That is a little unfair even if you are wanting to do something I wouldn't.
I do think this is something you dream up overnight and think it's a good idea, but as I said you discuss it with your family and some experts not a video game forum that routinely has to ask how to wash themselves. Dick hygiene on a boat!
Tldr; Real life isn't waterworld
The community attacking itself with condescension and judgement over people they don't know. An OP who is probably trolling about a boat voyage and successfully getting a forum riled up. What seems to be some jealousy the OP implies they have money to be able to do something like this, even if it is a joke topic.
OP if you aren't trolling the forum to get people posting shit, this is a matter for your family and you possibly self-reflecting and/or speaking to experts. Yes you do have a child, but I'm not going to call you a deadbeat dad, imply you are spending your child's inheritance or even suggest you must end up cheating not having sex with your wife for a few years. Not right off the mark. That is a little unfair even if you are wanting to do something I wouldn't.
I do think this is something you dream up overnight and think it's a good idea, but as I said you discuss it with your family and some experts not a video game forum that routinely has to ask how to wash themselves. Dick hygiene on a boat!
Tldr; Real life isn't waterworld
Sailing around the world when you sound like you have basically no experience is a terrible idea. The fact that OP thinks this'll cost him like 10k speaks of how unprepared he is, you won't even get a boat for anywhere near that, nevermind all the other costs.
The rest is between him and his family.
The rest is between him and his family.
Did they really have no experience?
Whenever I hear of a story of someone/a couple with no experience doing something then they take to said thing like a fish out of a water and are suddenly experts my bullshit meter goes off, especially when they have a vlog. I'd bet my bottom dollar that they were both experienced sailors before they started and only said they were newbies to make their series more appealing.
Ok I'm late to this thread but I'm gonna take the OP at their word.
So, I know people who have done this. I spent most of my childhood and teenage years at least once a week on a sailboat. Make sure you talk to other couples (specifically couples) who have made trips like this, live this lifestyle. It is definitely, definitely not for everybody. Most common thing – and this is with sailing couples who are like expert level - is that you will not see your wife until you hit the next port. Which can be weeks. Someone's gotta sail 24/7, you take shifts, one sleeps. Autopilot can hold the rudder but weather is totally on you. Just for starters.
Having a baby with you is almost certainly a total dealbreaker on the basis of medical access alone.
You do not have enough experience. You need to do several ocean crossings with bigger crews and boats first. Or you're gonna die.
It IS do-able, and i know a guy who grew up on a sailboat going up and down the African coast, being home-schooled all the way. He's a really interesting guy. But it takes such a rarified set of circumstances, money, skill and luck. One of the ocean-crossing couples I've spoken to gave me their best tips on how to rivet your hatches down when you pass Somalia in case you are fired upon by pirates. You really need to consider the scale of your dream.
Also you can't cross the goddamn ocean on a 30' boat, come on now, you need something like 50' to consider it, trust me on this. a 30' boat is for the great lakes.
So, I know people who have done this. I spent most of my childhood and teenage years at least once a week on a sailboat. Make sure you talk to other couples (specifically couples) who have made trips like this, live this lifestyle. It is definitely, definitely not for everybody. Most common thing – and this is with sailing couples who are like expert level - is that you will not see your wife until you hit the next port. Which can be weeks. Someone's gotta sail 24/7, you take shifts, one sleeps. Autopilot can hold the rudder but weather is totally on you. Just for starters.
Having a baby with you is almost certainly a total dealbreaker on the basis of medical access alone.
You do not have enough experience. You need to do several ocean crossings with bigger crews and boats first. Or you're gonna die.
It IS do-able, and i know a guy who grew up on a sailboat going up and down the African coast, being home-schooled all the way. He's a really interesting guy. But it takes such a rarified set of circumstances, money, skill and luck. One of the ocean-crossing couples I've spoken to gave me their best tips on how to rivet your hatches down when you pass Somalia in case you are fired upon by pirates. You really need to consider the scale of your dream.
Also you can't cross the goddamn ocean on a 30' boat, come on now, you need something like 50' to consider it, trust me on this. a 30' boat is for the great lakes.
Coincidentally, that's my dream as well. I've been saving for a couple years, on track to buy the boat in a little under a decade (I just had my first kid, no point in buying a boat now with a baby at home). I've been sailing since I was a kid, so this has been a lifelong dream.
Edit: the plan is for leisure sailing with the family from the time I buy the boat until the kids are in college (so about another decade or so), and then the long trip around the world. I would never think of starting off with such a trip, nevermind while my kids were still at home.
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Lots of good advice here. I would add that at the very least OP is going to need to do a few trips to the Caribbean and down to South America.
EDIT: Assuming he lives on the East Coast.
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All is lost
I hate this kind of thing. Nah, humans do a lot of dumb shit that shouldn't be allowable with their money
I hate this kind of thing. Nah, humans do a lot of dumb shit that shouldn't be allowable with their money
That was the most glaring red flag. Anyone who has dabbled in boats should know a little about cost and he seems insanely naive. Maybe if you were super experienced with boats and sailing.
Another thing I don't understand is why jump to "around the world" right off? Why not start off smaller? It sounds like the OP is in love with the the idea and not sailing.
I have to wonder if the wife is "ok" with the idea simply because in her mind he's never actually going to do it.
OP...this seems ill-advised.
And, that's not even getting into essentially abandoning your wife and child. It's not so much the leaving for a year (minimum), which is already bad. But, the fact that you're going to place them in constant stress fearing that at any moment you'll end up dead either through drowning, a storm, starvation, piracy, kidnapping, etc. Maybe wait until your kid is out of the house so at least your wife can join you on the journey and also get a TON of experience before deciding, "fuck it" and sail across the world.
And, that's not even getting into essentially abandoning your wife and child. It's not so much the leaving for a year (minimum), which is already bad. But, the fact that you're going to place them in constant stress fearing that at any moment you'll end up dead either through drowning, a storm, starvation, piracy, kidnapping, etc. Maybe wait until your kid is out of the house so at least your wife can join you on the journey and also get a TON of experience before deciding, "fuck it" and sail across the world.
minor note here – this is actually not true, there are GRIB apps for both macOS and iOS
I mean, I haven't done any investigative journalism on it, but it is what they claimed and they covered what they did to learn sailing after deciding to do it (they had been RV bloggers for several years leading up to moving to a sailboat.) They took classes and crewed on other boats to learn. Then they spent nearly a year in the Bahamas of relatively easy sailing before doing a longer passage.
Like many things, sailing is hard and dangerous, but it's not something that can't be learned, especially in five years.
yeah I am all for people following their dreams and passions, but you waited that long why not wait until your kid is older and on her own feet. The wife could even join you then if she was up to it and if not at least she doesn't have to work and raise your daughter alone for a year.
until then you can get more experience.
until then you can get more experience.
User Banned (1 Week): Inflammatory Generalisation
I wonder how they celebrate International Talk Like a Pirate Day on the Somalian coast. Do people just treat it as a normal day?
Hey OP maybe look into a "sail over" or "sail away" - the terms vary - where you crew a sailboat being delivered from overseas. You can get paid for this and pick up experience with an ocean going crew. These jobs pop up when a buyer has a boatbuilder put a vessel together in like Cape Town and want it "delivered" to Maine or whatever. It would be almost zero money investment (again you can get paid for this) and only the trip time (a few months).
I'm not touching the family issue, that's your call. But I will say a solo ocean crossing is even more insane than normal.
I'm not touching the family issue, that's your call. But I will say a solo ocean crossing is even more insane than normal.
Lobster's ok. I ate it almost every day over a two-week period, and I genuinely got sick of it. With each cracked shell, it started to feel more and more like I was feasting on giant water cockroach. I know people eat insects, but I don't have the stomach or palate for that.
If images like eating lobster at sea are driving your dream to sail around the world, why not indulge in making those little reveries a reality now? You don't have to sail the world solo to live that out. I mean, on your solo sailing voyage around the world, where would you even get the lobster? You're going to set out traps? Buy lobster when you're on shore on your limited budget? Become bosom friends with a random fisherman somewhere between the Bahamas and Bora Bora who'll gift you with his best catch in exchange for the witty and heartwarming anecdotes you'll share with him?
When it comes to dreams, we connect hundreds of imaginary vignettes to those dreams, imagining these scenes and stories will play out in reality if we live out our dream. Or - even worse - we mistakenly believe that the only way these imaginary stories will happen is if we achieve this dream. Don't be seduced or deceived by your daydreams into setting goals that demand too high a price - like your life. These kinds of dreams won't even necessarily make those wishes you imagine come true.
Anyway, you're getting a lot of blowback in this thread, I hope it doesn't push you into accelerating your plans or developing more willful blindspots about the risks and dangers involves. Don't be more foolish than your critics and naysayers (myself included) by letting them propel you in a direction you're not ready for. Five years is a long time. A lot can happen. If you do manage to get your boat and make her seaworthy, maybe your dream will refine and better reveal itself. Maybe a couple of occasional weekends at sea every once in a while will be enough to fulfill you.
I hope you are bringing along someone more experienced. Sounds like a good way for your wife and kid to lose their husband/father.
This man is correct. You're not doing this in a 30' boat. One storm and you're F'd. Put the money you're saving into your kid's college account.
Not trying to be a dick but this sounds like an absolutely terrible idea. Your sailing experience is in no way at all enough to take on a task such as this. And that's not taking into account the fact that you'll be leaving behind a 10 year old. Even more so when you want to do this in a boat you bought for under $10k.
OP could spend 100k of his families savings and die at sea because he is chasing a silly fantasy leaving a wife and a 10 year old daughter to struggle for income, physical and emotional support and be forced to grieve?
User Banned (3 Days): Hostile personal attacks
In the spirit of understanding and reciprocity, I submit that MrPressStart (delusional/fucking around OP) and excelsiorlef (omnipresent hypocrite/scold) cease hostilities, meet in the middle, and settle for an understated single ocean crossing. The former will surely gain some experience, informing future choices...and we all get less excelsiorlef for a while. Not sure what's in it for her tbh. But bon voyage!
Don't abandon your family dude, your kids need a dad. The time for that was before you had kids, I'm sorry you didn't get to do it then but that's not on them. There's plenty I would have liked to do too, but you have responsibilities.
OP, I'm probably going to sound harsh with this but the reality is you are likely going to get yourself killed doing this.
Putting aside the family issue, I'm afraid you seem to be VASTLY underestimating the dangers involved with your "plan".
1. The Storms Problem
Yes technology can absolutely help with predicting storms ahead of time. No it is not fool proof, and no matter how careful you are, you may find yourself caught in one if you're unlucky. Sometimes the only sign of a storm that's about to develop literally on top of you is the wind literally dying down and stopping briefly, which can be hard to tell when in motion.
If you get caught in a storm with your level of experience, you are likely going to capsize and die. Depending on the size of the storm, there is literally nothing a team of professional sailors could do, let alone one inexperienced person could. Even if you manage to retain your calm during one and start doing everything you can, there's a good chance you will either be too slow because you're one person, or it won't matter.
Also with your budget your boat will likely be small and way more likely to be flipped in even gentler storms.
2. The Route Problem
One of the other biggest dangers your going to find is choosing the safest route. One thing to remember is that not all oceans are safe. Piracy is an absolutely real thing, and certain regions of the world have severe issues with it. And regardless of how safe you're being, if you are in one of those regions, there's a decent chance of being attacked by pirates. Hell pirates in the Somalia region were known to attack ships up to 1,200 miles away from shore.
And realistically speaking you're going to have two choices for a route. Going through The Gulf of Aden which WILL lead to waters that are known to be infested with pirates, or the long route down to the Cape of Good Hope, which is infamous for incredible buffets of wind. Here's a quote from a sailing expert on the idea of taking the long way btw:
And as such, based on your aforementioned skill level, the latter is absolutely not an option you'd want to take, but the former is incredibly dangerous.
Oh and that's not say piracy is only in that region mind you, there have been cases of it in south american waters as well as several other places. And being armed wouldn't fix the issue either. They often have automatic weapons, while you yourself could be in a load of trouble for carrying weaponry into another country's waters.
3. The logistics Problem
Your current budge is completely out of wack. Boats are expensive, supplies are expensive too. This trip will take a long ass time, and it will require a ton of resources to keep you alive. You need to plan out water supplies, where to restock it (unless you can afford proper water purifier which would likely double your budget right there), where to get your food (because while fishing is an obvious choice, it can be unreliable, and if you're on your own you're likely to be way less effective).
And this isn't going into medicines that you would need, fishing supplies, cooking supplies etc.
4. The Injury problem
If you are alone, ANYTHING that goes wrong can fucking end you. Tripped in an inconvenient place on the boat and broke your shin? Have fun trying to radio for help! Fall off your boat during rough weather with nothing to stay afloat or signal for help? Good luck getting rescued, maybe if you're lucky someone will find the empty boat at some point in the next few months.
Get sick with an illness? Hope you have the proper medications and can keep it together long enough to find some shore somewhere to hopefully get help in case it gets worse.
Literally anything goes wrong during at least of year of this travel, and it has a significantly high chance of getting you killed because YOU'RE ALONE.
TLDR:
Doing this alone with your level of experience has a huge chance of getting yourself killed. If you insist on circumnavigating the world, it would be recommended that you get a few experienced sailors with you for the trip, who will then be able to properly advise on how to prepare, what type of boat is needed, how much provisions, where to go etc.
Circumnavigating the globe alone is not some "fuck it we'll do it live, this is the best way to learn moment", sailing is a fantastic hobby that can be very fulfilling, but it needs the proper respect and time.
To put it another way, what you're suggesting is the equivalent of earning your provisional scuba diving license and then declaring that your going to dive Egypt's Blue Hole where an estimated 130-200 people including experienced divers.
This trip idea is possible, but not with your current experience and budget/plan.
Putting aside the family issue, I'm afraid you seem to be VASTLY underestimating the dangers involved with your "plan".
1. The Storms Problem
Yes technology can absolutely help with predicting storms ahead of time. No it is not fool proof, and no matter how careful you are, you may find yourself caught in one if you're unlucky. Sometimes the only sign of a storm that's about to develop literally on top of you is the wind literally dying down and stopping briefly, which can be hard to tell when in motion.
If you get caught in a storm with your level of experience, you are likely going to capsize and die. Depending on the size of the storm, there is literally nothing a team of professional sailors could do, let alone one inexperienced person could. Even if you manage to retain your calm during one and start doing everything you can, there's a good chance you will either be too slow because you're one person, or it won't matter.
Also with your budget your boat will likely be small and way more likely to be flipped in even gentler storms.
2. The Route Problem
One of the other biggest dangers your going to find is choosing the safest route. One thing to remember is that not all oceans are safe. Piracy is an absolutely real thing, and certain regions of the world have severe issues with it. And regardless of how safe you're being, if you are in one of those regions, there's a decent chance of being attacked by pirates. Hell pirates in the Somalia region were known to attack ships up to 1,200 miles away from shore.
And realistically speaking you're going to have two choices for a route. Going through The Gulf of Aden which WILL lead to waters that are known to be infested with pirates, or the long route down to the Cape of Good Hope, which is infamous for incredible buffets of wind. Here's a quote from a sailing expert on the idea of taking the long way btw:
And as such, based on your aforementioned skill level, the latter is absolutely not an option you'd want to take, but the former is incredibly dangerous.
Oh and that's not say piracy is only in that region mind you, there have been cases of it in south american waters as well as several other places. And being armed wouldn't fix the issue either. They often have automatic weapons, while you yourself could be in a load of trouble for carrying weaponry into another country's waters.
3. The logistics Problem
Your current budge is completely out of wack. Boats are expensive, supplies are expensive too. This trip will take a long ass time, and it will require a ton of resources to keep you alive. You need to plan out water supplies, where to restock it (unless you can afford proper water purifier which would likely double your budget right there), where to get your food (because while fishing is an obvious choice, it can be unreliable, and if you're on your own you're likely to be way less effective).
And this isn't going into medicines that you would need, fishing supplies, cooking supplies etc.
4. The Injury problem
If you are alone, ANYTHING that goes wrong can fucking end you. Tripped in an inconvenient place on the boat and broke your shin? Have fun trying to radio for help! Fall off your boat during rough weather with nothing to stay afloat or signal for help? Good luck getting rescued, maybe if you're lucky someone will find the empty boat at some point in the next few months.
Get sick with an illness? Hope you have the proper medications and can keep it together long enough to find some shore somewhere to hopefully get help in case it gets worse.
Literally anything goes wrong during at least of year of this travel, and it has a significantly high chance of getting you killed because YOU'RE ALONE.
TLDR:
Doing this alone with your level of experience has a huge chance of getting yourself killed. If you insist on circumnavigating the world, it would be recommended that you get a few experienced sailors with you for the trip, who will then be able to properly advise on how to prepare, what type of boat is needed, how much provisions, where to go etc.
Circumnavigating the globe alone is not some "fuck it we'll do it live, this is the best way to learn moment", sailing is a fantastic hobby that can be very fulfilling, but it needs the proper respect and time.
To put it another way, what you're suggesting is the equivalent of earning your provisional scuba diving license and then declaring that your going to dive Egypt's Blue Hole where an estimated 130-200 people including experienced divers.
This trip idea is possible, but not with your current experience and budget/plan.
There's a lot of very helpful advice and commentary in this thread... some of it.... not so much.
You do sound like you need to work up to it, you should get experience under your belt with many smaller trips first. This will be very dangerous and you do need to get proper training and experience under your belt. Whatever you feel like over-preparing will be, double it. Remember that you have a wife and child that will be without you if something goes wrong.
You do sound like you need to work up to it, you should get experience under your belt with many smaller trips first. This will be very dangerous and you do need to get proper training and experience under your belt. Whatever you feel like over-preparing will be, double it. Remember that you have a wife and child that will be without you if something goes wrong.
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I actually know a Japanese guy who tried this kind of trip. He almost made it but came into boat problems on the last leg basically. Anyway, he told me at the time the base minimum cost (and he was being tight) was like 12 million yen , 100k USD.
And some of the "contributors' in here are fucking shameful. Would love to see if you would speak to someone like that in real life.
And some of the "contributors' in here are fucking shameful. Would love to see if you would speak to someone like that in real life.
If something horribly unforeseen happens, fuck it...right? My wife and daughter will understand.
It baffles me that people would take risks like this AFTER starting a family.
You don't "I don't give a fuck" it with a wife and small child in your life.
