Iron Eddie

Banned
Nov 25, 2019
9,812
So they will get significantly less funding for their games?
State of Decay 3 is going to have a lot more funding than State of Decay 2 had.
ubisoft aren't exactly known for taking risks with their AAA either though. they release sure fire successes based on well established franchises that often follow wildly popular templates, and the experimentations typically are lower budget affairs. after all i'm not talking about studio's that make stuff like child of light or valiant hearts.

dishonored or prey however do not fall into either of those catagories. they're high risk, high budget flops. no console manufacturer is going to keep a studio open that consistently produces those. and gamepass is more than capable of producing flops. people can argue it increases variety and appeal of the service overall...and it does, at least in the sense that those games exist and will be on gamepass for the life of the service. but that doesn't mean MS have to keep them around making MORE content if it doesn't actually amount to meaningful engagement. netflix cancel shows all the time regardless of the variety they offer, views and/or budget. i don't see how anyone thinks MS won't do the same at some point.
Who exactly takes many risks nowadays? What has Sony announced? Gran Turismo, God of War, Ratchet, Horizon, Spiderman, the list goes on but with a couple of smaller new games like Kena. What has Nintendo announced? Animal Crossing, Mario, Zelda, Splatoon. What has Microsoft announced? Forza, Fable, Halo and some other new ones like Everwild and Avowed.

They all rely mainly on their known IP's, this is just facts. Ubisoft just released a huge new game, Immortals. Every new IP is a big risk and every time we see a new IP it is usually surrounded by at least 5 known IP's because that is their bread and butter. Arkane released mutliple Dishonored games too.

Why are we already talking about closures? They just bought them and now you want to talk about closures? Why can't people just be excited for the future instead of worrying about things not under your control? Microsoft bought Obsidian, they are working on a new IP, same with Ninja Theory, so why do you think Arkane won't be allowed?

Arkane is happy but you are worried about their future? That seems very strange to me.
 

biglo25

Member
Apr 28, 2020
2,859
I've got a PS5 and while I'm lucky to be able to play Deathloop, I was bummed to see MS buy Bethesda and lock down Arkane. But if it helps Arkane keep making the games they want to make, then good. I'll pick up a Series S by the time their next game rolls around.
if only more people had your kind of attitude.
 

Navidson REC

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,459
Prey on the Xbox Series X with 1440p@60fps is magical. You forget it was a last gen game.
So happy to read this! 1440p@60fps is such a great sweet spot, hope many games will aim for this in the future.

Prey always interested me (I actually really liked the original and was quite bummed when they canceled the sequel) so now I finally get to jump in "for free" and with an improved version to boot!
 

Pryme

Member
Aug 23, 2018
8,164
the best studio MS managed to acquire imo...but i'm still not convinced they'll even be around in a few years time. MS have a lot of studio's to bankroll now so i see closures in the future being an inevitability...and Arkane straddles that awkward line of "high budget, low popularity" which just sounds like a money pit. hopefully that isnt the case though, since they're like the only studio within that Bethesda buyout that i genuinely love.


Microsoft is spending billions to acquire studios for content for Gamepass and you're speculating they'll be closing them?

Even when you're aware that quality is a much bigger metric than retail success where Gamepass is concerned?

C'mon.
 

killerrin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,281
Toronto
One of the biggest benefits of Game Pass (that frankly isn't talked about enough) is the fact that it affords developers/artists creative freedom. They can take more risks than they normally would. I personally can't wait to see where this goes.

Its talked about all the time. Problem is that nobody believes it despite how often its said by the developers.
 

Nameless

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,493
This is certainly the hope. As much as I am looking forward to Deathloop, you can very much see it's attempting to find this middle ground between the Arkane house style and qualities general audiences find more palatable (more guns, bigger focus on action, multiplayer PvP component, etc...).

If the Game Pass model allows them to focus on pure Immersive Sims, which they do better than anyone in the business, I'd consider that a major victory.
 

Ronnie Poncho

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
2,182
Arkane are the greatest beneficiaries of Game Pass and I'm glad to see them talking about it. Arkane have never been that commercially successful but are critically adored (and by me) - so Game Pass is perfect for them.

Can't wait to see what they come up with - small experiences (like Death of the Outsider) rather than big games I expect.
 

driqe

Member
Jan 21, 2021
511
Being an Xbox studio means you are subject to making small scale AA games, no more big-budget games for you lol
 

Iron Eddie

Banned
Nov 25, 2019
9,812
Do we know exactly how much to say that Arkane is going to get a similar amount of funding as undead labs?
I would imagine Arkane will be left to do what they were already doing, Microsoft is not going to reduce the scale of people who work there. I find it absurd some are acting like "now" they are in jeapordy. That time was prior to the acquisition so are people coming out of the woodwork now to speak about their concerns?
 

Tovarisc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,586
FIN
This is certainly the hope. As much as I am looking forward to Deathloop, you can very much see it's attempting to find this middle ground between the Arkane house style and qualities general audiences find more palatable (more guns, bigger focus on action, multiplayer PvP component, etc...).

Deathloop is basically that game concept that they had prototyped years ago realized into end product with some changes (setting etc.). NoClip doc about studio touched on that concept, name of it escapes me atm.
 

Deleted member 7051

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,254
Being an Xbox studio means you are subject to making small scale AA games, no more big-budget games for you lol

That's honestly fine and probably a good thing for the industry in the long run. Smaller budgets means less pressure to deliver a game that'll sell millions of copies in the first week, which in turn means less stress for developers. With a lower requirement for profitability, games can also become more experimental than they have been for a long time. It's no secret that the inflated budgets of games have made things worse.

I'd rather play ten games that cost $10m to make than one that cost $100m.
 

ToadPacShakur

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,488
Lol we got a game director at an Xbox-owned studio talking about how GamePass benefits them and and allows them to make the creative games they are known for. But instead of talking about that we got people saying they'll shut down in a few years?

I just woke up, so I'm just wanting to make sure I'm reading this correctly
 

KORNdog

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
8,001
Arkane is happy but you are worried about their future? That seems very strange to me.

studio acquisitions have left a bitter taste in my mouth and i'm simply cautious of the results.

we've seen it too many times already with the likes of Pandemic and Visceral or Maxim, or with MS's own Ensamble or Lionhead. or Sony with SCE Studio Liverpool or Evolution studios...the list is too long frankly. and sure, some of these buyouts last longer than others so are an easier pill to swallow. but they all prove you're only as good or as valued as your last game...and MS WILL close some of the studio's they've just acquired, because at the end of the day they're in this to make money. and throwing 70 million at a studio to make something niche that no-one is interested in isn't a good way to do that...gamepass or not.
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
Being an Xbox studio means you are subject to making small scale AA games, no more big-budget games for you lol
That's honestly fine and probably a good thing for the industry in the long run. Smaller budgets means less pressure to deliver a game that'll sell millions of copies in the first week, which in turn means less stress for developers. With a lower requirement for profitability, games can also become more experimental than they have been for a long time. It's no secret that the inflated budgets of games have made things worse.

I'd rather play ten games that cost $10m to make than one that cost $100m.
It would take literally 5 seconds of thought to put together that this isn't remotely true.

Halo Infinite, Gears 5 & 6, Starfield, Fable, Perfect Dark, Elder Scrolls VI, etc.. etc.. are not "AA" games.
 

Anno

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,052
Columbus, Ohio
FWIW I hope a number of XGS studios do work on a lot of smaller, more creative stuff. Like Obsidian currently has at least two small projects going, right? I want more of that, and Arkane would be a good studio to do it I think.

That said, assuming all XGS studios are going to have to do that is pretty silly.
 

Starlatine

533.489 paid youtubers cant be wrong
Member
Oct 28, 2017
30,628
era: games are too expensive to produce these days we would gladly take smaller games if it meant no crush and no pressure on the devs!
also era: ewww all the games are going to be AA now i'm not too happy about this
 

Bradbatross

Member
Mar 17, 2018
14,508
I think Arkane are about to become the darlings of the Xbox base, so I have no concern about them, in fact I'm looking forward to seem them finally get the attention they deserve. They just need to keep doing what they love.
Yea, given the quality of their games I'm not sure how anyone could be worried about Arkane under Xbox. Now that the barrier to try their games is so low I think they'll be one of Xbox's most successful studios.

I would've never bought Prey, but I played it on Game Pass and it's one of the best games I've played in the last few years.
 

canderous

Prophet of Truth
Member
Jun 12, 2020
8,894
I think with a good variety of games you will end up with a game pass library that is greater than the sum of its parts. Yes, certain titles will be the gateway drugs into the service, but other games (like Arkane games) can be the games that make you stay subscribed after getting in. They are the chocolate inside the tootsie pop. All the games support each other in terms of the overall success. Maybe Arkane games cannot exist long term (on their own) without the support of juggernauts like Elder Scrolls or Halo. The reason Deathloop had a moneyhat deal was probably because it was the only way they could mitigate serious risk due to the reliance on sales numbers. It sounds like Microsoft told Arkane to keep doing what you do and we will make sure people play your games.

I'm an optimist though (and obviously a game pass shill, which tends to happen once you embrace it as your primary method of consuming games).
 

oldboss

Shinra Employee
Member
Nov 9, 2017
1,399
I'll be finishing Prey soon. This game is mindblowing.
Then I'll go on to Dishonored 2, because I won't be ready to say no to the immersive sim itch I need to scratch.
 

Iron Eddie

Banned
Nov 25, 2019
9,812
studio acquisitions have left a bitter taste in my mouth and i'm simply cautious of the results.

we've seen it too many times already with the likes of Pandemic and Visceral or Maxim, or with MS's own Ensamble or Lionhead. or Sony with SCE Studio Liverpool or Evolution studios...the list is too long frankly. and sure, some of these buyouts last longer than others so are an easier pill to swallow. but they all prove you're only as good or as valued as your last game...and MS WILL close some of the studio's they've just acquired, because at the end of the day they're in this to make money. and throwing 70 million at a studio to make something niche that no-one is interested in isn't a good way to do that...gamepass or not.
Issues surrounding Arkane selling games was an issue prior to Microsoft, were you vocal about it then or are you just speaking now because you don't like that the publisher was looking to sell? Microsoft is not your worry, your worry was about the health of Arkane before and since then the publisher was looking to be sold so you can be upset all you want about the acquisition but that is not even relevant because the concerns were more profound before, not now.

Let me ask, what platform did you play your Arkane games on?
Do you currently use Game Pass?

Those 2 questions are what's actually relevant, not what you think about acquisitions.
 

Pryme

Member
Aug 23, 2018
8,164
and MS WILL close some of the studio's they've just acquired, because at the end of the day they're in this to make money. and throwing 70 million at a studio to make something niche that no-one is interested in isn't a good way to do that...gamepass or not.

And you've just read an article with the words from a dev talking about how Gamepass exposure has led to more people enjoying their game.

I've seen you express tons of interest and excitement in Deathloop which Is made by Arkane, so I'm not sure why you're out here with a theory that their future games will be unpopular.
 

KORNdog

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
8,001
Issues surrounding Arkane selling games was an issue prior to Microsoft, were you vocal about it then or are you just speaking now because you don't like that the publisher was looking to sell? Microsoft is not your worry, your worry was about the health of Arkane before and since then the publisher was looking to be sold so you can be upset all you want about the acquisition but that is not even relevant because the concerns were more profound before, not now.

Let me ask, what platform did you play your Arkane games on?
Do you currently use Game Pass?

Those 2 questions are what's actually relevant, not what you think about acquisitions.

i''ve been worried about Arkane surviving since the previous gen started...that hasn't stopped just because MS bought them and the "magic" of gamepass has entered the equation...i'm not that naive.

and i've played Arkane games across PC/360 and PS4.

and i sub to gamepass as and when there is content on there i want to play. much like any other "cancel anytime" sub services.
 

Hero Prinny

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,192
I'm so glad to hear this. Every time an Arkane game underperformed I was afraid the worst would happen. One of the my favorite developers, and I want them to thrive.
Jaja GREAT MINDS THINK ALIKE BREH!! Couldnt have said it better myself. Man, its such a great time to be a freaking gamer. 🤙
 

Rowsdower

Shinra Employee of The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,163
Canada
Great to hear. I adore Arkane, so hoping Game Pass works for them. I've been worried they would be shut down all though last gen.
 

KORNdog

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
8,001
I've seen you express tons of interest and excitement in Deathloop which Is made by Arkane, so I'm not sure why you're out here with a theory that their future games will be unpopular.

because i've expressed the same interest and excitement about dishonored 1/2 and prey and they're massive flops.

my personal interest level in a game doesn't have any bearing on how popular a title is...unsurprisingly.
 

dodmaster

Member
Apr 27, 2019
2,551
There's nothing really to this article, apart from the headline.

If by some miracle of insanity, either studio head is reading this thread and is open to considering random new game ideas, I'd like an open world Dishonored game at some point in the future, thanks. So much of that world left to explore.

*edit, also both Arkane studios are the two best first party Xbox studios by a wide margin. This bears repeating.
 

Vex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,213
Game pass fucking STAYS in the news as of late!!!

Game pass this, gamepass that. MS is taking over... And you almost HAVE to pay attention to every gamepass announcement!

MS has struck gold with this service! They have become very AGGRESSIVE. Almost violent with gamepass.
 

Sydle

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,446
I'm half way through Prey but I'm already convinced Arkane should get a blank check to make whatever they want.
 
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StudioTan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,836
ubisoft aren't exactly known for taking risks with their AAA either though. they release sure fire successes based on well established franchises that often follow wildly popular templates, and the experimentations typically are lower budget affairs. after all i'm not talking about studio's that make stuff like child of light or valiant hearts.

dishonored or prey however do not fall into either of those catagories. they're high risk, high budget flops. no console manufacturer is going to keep a studio open that consistently produces those. and gamepass is more than capable of producing flops. people can argue it increases variety and appeal of the service overall...and it does, at least in the sense that those games exist and will be on gamepass for the life of the service. but that doesn't mean MS have to keep them around making MORE content if it doesn't actually amount to meaningful engagement. netflix cancel shows all the time regardless of the variety they offer, views and/or budget. i don't see how anyone thinks MS won't do the same at some point.
Cancelling a show is not the equivalent to closing a studio. It might mean not making a sequel to a game that didn't take off instead.

However to use your own Netflix analogy they also will keep making prestige movies that are never going to be as popular as something like Stranger Things. Not everything needs to be super popular, I have no doubt Arkane will continue to make quality games which what I'm sure Microsoft is most worried about.
 

Pulp

Member
Nov 4, 2017
3,023
Really happy for Arkane! Must be very nice indeed to be able to focus more on creating rather than return profits
 

Iron Eddie

Banned
Nov 25, 2019
9,812
i''ve been worried about Arkane surviving since the previous gen started...that hasn't stopped just because MS bought them and the "magic" of gamepass has entered the equation...i'm not that naive.

and i've played Arkane games across PC/360 and PS4.

and i sub to gamepass as and when there is content on there i want to play. much like any other "cancel anytime" sub services.
because i've expressed the same interest and excitement about dishonored 1/2 and prey and they're massive flops.

my personal interest level in a game doesn't have any bearing on how popular a title is...unsurprisingly.
Well then you should feel ok, Sony threw money at them and now Microsoft will throw even more support. What you seem to be ignoring is the biggest piece of the puzzle, their publisher wanted to be sold and Microsoft was the best option out there. This is why your timing is very poor to be bringing it up here now with your concerns all while Arkane expresses how Game Pass gives them more options.
 

JohnLennon

Member
May 16, 2020
4,144
the best studio MS managed to acquire imo...but i'm still not convinced they'll even be around in a few years time. MS have a lot of studio's to bankroll now so i see closures in the future being an inevitability...and Arkane straddles that awkward line of "high budget, low popularity" which just sounds like a money pit. hopefully that isnt the case though, since they're like the only studio within that Bethesda buyout that i genuinely love.
If this were true, then why is virtually every Xbox studio actively hiring more employees right now? The job postings are only increasing for Xbox studios since the purchase, not decreasing. I'm not convinced at all that there will be closures. On the contrary, I see big growth. If the Zenimax acquisition encourages more jobs, more creativity and better games, I see zero downside.
 

Lowrys

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,724
London
Fuck yes, give me all those immersive sims without the need for huge sales figures.

Game Pass should be great for Arkane.
 

Arctic Chris

Member
Dec 5, 2017
2,187
Ottawa Canada
I have to admit that I was not very familiar with Arkane before I purchased a XSX and Game Pass. I have now played through Dishonored and Prey, both with FPS Boost and those are outstanding games. The only reason I have not finished playing Dishonored 2 is that I am waiting for that game to also have FPS Boost. I will definitely be playing everything Arkane releases in the future.
 

cyrribrae

Chicken Chaser
Member
Jan 21, 2019
12,723
Side note, I read the interview on press start, then their deathloop interview, and this is the first time I've actually heard the premise of the game laid out. And now I'm 1000% more interested (lol). If this is Outer Wilds with shooty shooty bang bang, I'd be very pleased..

they're still a business that requires games to succeed. if a studio is failing to bring in crowds (which arkane games are consistently bad at), what use is it to keep them operating? especially when that budget could be used elsewhere?
ubisoft aren't exactly known for taking risks with their AAA either though. they release sure fire successes based on well established franchises that often follow wildly popular templates, and the experimentations typically are lower budget affairs. after all i'm not talking about studio's that make stuff like child of light or valiant hearts.

dishonored or prey however do not fall into either of those catagories. they're high risk, high budget flops. no console manufacturer is going to keep a studio open that consistently produces those. and gamepass is more than capable of producing flops. people can argue it increases variety and appeal of the service overall...and it does, at least in the sense that those games exist and will be on gamepass for the life of the service. but that doesn't mean MS have to keep them around making MORE content if it doesn't actually amount to meaningful engagement. netflix cancel shows all the time regardless of the variety they offer, views and/or budget. i don't see how anyone thinks MS won't do the same at some point.
Dub. Bull. Down.

All of your concerns are exactly why this is great for Arkane, Microsoft, and game pass. Arkane makes intricate, involved, (likely expensive), critically acclaimed, discourse driving, but ultimately low selling games. This is a disaster. A sustainability nightmare. How do you justify keeping a studio open that can't pay the bills? Well. You can't.

Unless your metric ISN'T sales. Arkane games are innovative and intricate - making them often hard to grasp and hard to market, BUT spawning a particularly devoted fanbase that has stuck with them wherever they go and isn't shy about evangelizing. Arkane games are critical darlings that often come up in discussions from games media and gaming influencers (to a lesser degree).

All of that is perfect for Game Pass. The people who sub for Arkane will definitely show up. They may even just purchase the game outright. Then, they'll evangelize to their friends - just pay $1 or $10 or $15, you HAVE TO try this out! And while we're here, maybe we try all these other games. And well, we know all these other games are coming, maybe we just stay subscribed.

It turns a dedicated following into steady ongoing income. And it turns general enthusiasm into paying customers. If Arkane ends up shutting down in 10 or 15 years, it'll be IN SPITE OF game pass, not because of it.
 

driqe

Member
Jan 21, 2021
511
It would take literally 5 seconds of thought to put together that this isn't remotely true.

Halo Infinite, Gears 5 & 6, Starfield, Fable, Perfect Dark, Elder Scrolls VI, etc.. etc.. are not "AA" games.
I was being sarcastic, but it is kinda funny to see the narratives on Game Pass change so often