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Ian Henry

Member
Oct 29, 2017
416
Pretty sure that will be touched on in the story, given the scene with him looking at the vase.

Also remember that's it been a long long time since GoW 3 and Kratos has been wandering ever since. Also that Kratos is teaching his son to be a merciless ruthless killer, while his son struggles against Kratos' teachings. Having someone to protect doesn't mean he has to be a good person.

You kept it 100 with that lol. It kind of reminds me of the way he treated Pandora. When she went into the portal, you would think that Kratos would save her but he goes to beat up Zeus. Due to being full of vengeance and stubborn, the person that he sworn to protect ends up dead because of his selfishness. That was probably my only reason for disliking GOW III despite it being my fav GOW game. It just made made me mad how it was executed.....but then again, Pandora was kind of annoying lol.
 
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Osiris397

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,455
It makes no sense, and even if they explained it in-game I cant imagine

It's one thing to be skeptical, but come on you seem like an irrational fan of a different platform and/or a have completely different taste than people that are actually interested in God of War, which is fine...until you just start throwing your sour grapes response in here. The point is before you judge something that's going to be immensely popular whether you like it or not because millions of people are going to love it, just maybe you shouldn't telegraph your bias by implying "I don't care how plausible the story is going to be it's going to be a bad game, no matter what."

With another mythical god head with wings hanging off Kratos' belt like a trophy, the combo system thus far, the mythical axe you can throw and recall at will it still looks very much like God of War.
 

Ian Henry

Member
Oct 29, 2017
416
Kind of? I remember rolling my eyes so hard when she started talking about how hope was all we had left or something.

Lol......In my perspective, I felt that it was encouraging but near the end......you can tell it was getting way too forced given all the bullshit that went down.
Retrospectively, when you think about it she was like a pre-TLOU Ellie, in a way to humanize Kratos. However, with the impact and release of TLOU, you start to realize that Pandora was everything wrong with child companions in gaming.
 
Oct 26, 2017
20,440
Cory has talked an extreme amount about redeeming Kratos and that's one of the few things we know about the game other than no camera cuts.

https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...rector-cory-barlog-on-nihilism-and-fatherhood

https://www.polygon.com/e3/2017/6/2...-barlog-interview-sony-quest-to-redeem-kratos

Cory seems to not take Kratos' long list of horrific crimes that seriously and seems to want Kratos to be around for like 5 more games (as he refers to the first 8 games of the series as "season 1" for Kratos several times), but we will see. Maybe this will be like The Last Jedi or MGS2 except more extreme.
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,655
Cory has talked an extreme amount about redeeming Kratos and that's one of the few things we know about the game other than no camera cuts.

https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...rector-cory-barlog-on-nihilism-and-fatherhood

https://www.polygon.com/e3/2017/6/2...-barlog-interview-sony-quest-to-redeem-kratos

Cory seems to not take Kratos' long list of horrific crimes that seriously and seems to want Kratos to be around for like 5 more games (as he refers to the first 8 games of the series as "season 1" for Kratos several times), but we will see. Maybe this will be like The Last Jedi or MGS2 except more extreme.
How do you get the impression that he's not taking that past seriously. It sounds like they're taking it very seriously
You talked a little bit about Kratos maybe not growing up, but realizing the world is more than just himself. When you play first three games, Kratos is an asshole. He's a dick. He doesn't think about the consequences of his actions. I'm curious how you're approaching the idea of giving him the space to learn. Isn't it also possible that he's just a monster? Maybe he's just a bad person.

Barlog: There's always that possibility, but I think what's interesting [as a storyteller] is to be able to take a character all the way to the brink, to take a character to the point where they're wholly unlikable. They are anti-hero in some way, but I think it's interesting to even just look at this feeling of like—how can you bring them back from the brink? How can you redeem them in some ways?

Think about the life Kratos has had. As a child, before—spoiler alert!—Deimos [Kratos' younger brother] was taken, he was alright. Even for a Spartan, he had a pretty decent life. But everything started stacking up, bad things started happening to him.

We truly are a product of our environment. Our environment influences so much. But I don't think we are irretrievably affected.

So it's philosophy. The idea of nihilism, that Kratos is completely irredeemable, is incongruent with how you'd like to believe how people work.

Barlog: Absolutely, absolutely. How he is, how everybody is. [pause] Everybody has that arc in their life. I think it's within all of us to make bad decisions, to take the wrong road, but there's always a possibility of—maybe it's a small move. That's the thing about Kratos.

He doesn't necessarily have to become a good person.

Barlog: He's not going to become a paladin going around and saving the world, but the reality is that—this is a backstory. The first eight games are a backstory to this interesting character who's now unfolding, to take this opportunity to say "Hey, this isn't a reboot. This isn't a starting over. This is chapter two. Chapter one, Greece. Chapter two, Norse mythology."

As we progress in, we suddenly see this potential list of mythologies that he could start interacting with, and the difference effects. How he affects this mythology, how he interacts is so different than how everything went in Greece.
 
Oct 26, 2017
20,440
People reach the brink when they do a few crimes, that can be part of the arc of their life of being a better person.

Not when they kill like 4 million people.

Kratos is far past the brink.
 

GNTsquid

Member
Oct 30, 2017
228
Chicago
It's one thing to be skeptical, but come on you seem like an irrational fan of a different platform and/or a have completely different taste than people that are actually interested in God of War, which is fine...until you just start throwing your sour grapes response in here. The point is before you judge something that's going to be immensely popular whether you like it or not because millions of people are going to love it, just maybe you shouldn't telegraph your bias by implying "I don't care how plausible the story is going to be it's going to be a bad game, no matter what."

With another mythical god head with wings hanging off Kratos' belt like a trophy, the combo system thus far, the mythical axe you can throw and recall at will it still looks very much like God of War.
Dont get me wrong, i like action games of this type and maybe the game play is good but I think any reason to explain why he's suddenly in a totally different pantheon would be nothing but silly.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,440
Silicon Valley
Dont get me wrong, i like action games of this type and maybe the game play is good but I think any reason to explain why he's suddenly in a totally different pantheon would be nothing but silly.
That's fine. Videogames don't always have to be exactly like real life. It's not as if these mythological Gods actually existed, right? In God of War, the different geographical regions of the world are ruled by different Gods and their ilk. That is how David Jaffe and SSM imagined it and how they are pushing through to it, even if some of us wished for this to happen sooner.
 

RedFoxx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
64
You're statement on Norse mythology is purely anecdotal. I'm not angry about them changing the mythology; I'm confused. The change makes little sense. Who is the Norse god of war anyway? Who are Frigg, Balder, Tyrr, Njord? If you asked most people these questions and gave them the answers they'd say, who and I've never heard of them. That's a stark contrast from Kratos seeking vengeance against Aries the Greek god of war (which most people have heard of), and usurping the god of war moniker.


As I stated earlier, I missed the end credits. When he died; I cut the game off disgusted. I just learned he wasn't dead from you all. Now, I feel even more convicted about where the direction of the game is going. My 17 year old self is definitely different from my 37 year old self, but I'm still on the same planet, still in the same universe, still in the same dimension. We can't say the same of "Kratos."

The hyperbole in your post is off the charts. WoW! How can you say I have no idea where the game is going, when the main character literally jumped out of one mythology into a completely different one? Kratos and "Kratos are two different people, and I should be okay with this? Most people are ignorant of Norse mythology, you act as if someone should feel ashamed for not studying the subject. I'm all for gaining knowledge, but maybe most people don't know anything outside of Marvel's take on Asgard, because the subject matter doesn't hold the interest of its readers. Since you're the resident expert on Norse mythology, can you explain to me who the Norse god of war is and the potential reasons why Kratos has decided to completely jump from Greek mythology to Norse mythology to clean house...oh and give his son a tutorial lesson while doing so?

I'm not saying there isn't reasoning, but as I stated in my original post, I don't want to be bullshitted. There's some explaining to do here, and you seem to be of the opinion, that nothing needs to be explained. I'm fine with a reboot, my issue with the direction is just be open and concise about it. I doubt few people have an issue with God of War going in a new direction, but just call it what it is, and don't try to sell me a new formula labeled as the former.

Is the plot of the game that Kratos is cursed by the Norse God of War (whichever they may choose as even in Greek myth there are multiple gods of War you can use, Ares is just really popular) and seeking revenge? You don't know. Are these worlds and myths intertwined? Yes, they have said so. Why does he have a son? You have to play the game to know. Why is he in this world? You have to play the game to know.

Is this going to be bullshit? Maybe. Or you could like it. Instead, you have now created this scenario where we are all supposed to go along with "hey, they should've just changed the character" when if they had just created the same character and named him Ben in Norse myth, the issue would have also been that it was just a Kratos reskin with the same brutality.

Then you have the whole myth jumping thing that's supposedly an issue, but Percy Jackson and that whole set of book across Egyptian, Greek, Roman, and Norse myth are really popular stories. Who cares if most people only care about Tom Huddleston? If the story is good, then just watch it play our. If it doesn't hold your attention, then you can say you are right.

Do I know who the God of War is in Norse myth? Nope. Why? I don't read Norse myths. I also don't read Greek myths, but ya know Wonder Woman just came out and had Ares in it. God of War is based on vengeance on Ares. Percy Jackson is based on vengeance on Ares. Like, pick a Greek myth fiction story and it's woefully overused how often Ares is the, or one of the, antagonist.

I'm using hyperbole because that is what you're doing. Oh, they're just selling you mixed goods cuz they recycled the name. No it's the story of the Greek God of War in the Norse kingdom. What is he doing? He is making a journey with his son. Where is he going? Don't know yet. Why is he here? Don't know yet. How will he escape? Don't know yeT. Will he try? Don't know yeT.

That's my whole point. You know all of two factual things about this game and truthfully it seems like you more or less hate God of War III and that's really your issue more than this game.
 

Braaier

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
13,237
Of course, and I guess it kind of bugs me that the only reason this game is called GOW is because of business concerns.

I'll admit I like the fact that old angry Kratos is gone, but I just haven't felt any hype about this Last of Us looking take on the franchise.
I agree with you. I hated kratos in the past games, but I really enjoyed the gameplay. Now the crazy combos are gone and there's a likeable kratos? Wtf. Not my god of war. Wish they had used a new character.
 

Deleted member 36493

User requested account closure
Member
Dec 19, 2017
4,982
What I'm curious about (and what has yet to be answered) is Kratos' relationship with the Norse gods. He has no history with them like he did with the Greek gods, so if he automatically hates them for no reason then less has changed than we may think.
 

LordBaztion

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,824
Lima Perú
Personally, I don't like it, at least the combat, I think it lacks the fluidity of previous games, it seems there are to many cutscenes interrupting the flow if the combat.

I guess the focus on story is better as I find Kratos annoying and bland but I have the feeling that they are trying to do TLOU. I can imagine your emotional event at 80% of the game.

The seeting looks great.

Ultimately I'm not too interested in the game because what I like of the series were those epic set pieces larger than life and didn't seem to be in this game.
 

Adamska

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,042
Kind of impressed people are so angry at Kratos trying to act more low-key and normal. He saved the entire human race by the end of GOWIII at the cost of his own life, he died a hero regardless of how bad things were around him. Not only that, he single-handedly dispatched the capricious gods that were manipulating humans, one by one. Sure, his was a quest of revenge, but it still had a happy ending for humans. It's very, very clear that this game presents Kratos in something of a clean slate; he's done bad and brutal things, but he also saved the entire world, so he's earned the right to be seen in a new light and to be judged as a character on the events of this new game, not the old ones.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,767
Just playing Ghost Of Sparta and Chains of Olympus should tell you why Kratos hated the gods. As a child they stole his brother from him because they believe that a marked warrior will destroy olympus. The marked warrior was thought to be Deimos because he had a birth mark like Kratos's tattoo. Then he later found out that they did not kill Deimos but instead tortured him. Then he was killed infront of him after finding him a couple of minutes later.

Then you have his daughter which he found and wanted to stay with but could not because a goddess wantwd to destroy the world.

You also have the gods making him kill his mother by turning her into a monster.

The rage was building inside of him since he was a kid and it really makes it more tragic. If the god did what they promosed then the destruction of olympus would not have happened.

Completely agreed with this.
 
Oct 25, 2017
56,807
Kind of impressed people are so angry at Kratos trying to act more low-key and normal. He saved the entire human race by the end of GOWIII at the cost of his own life, he died a hero regardless of how bad things were around him. Not only that, he single-handedly dispatched the capricious gods that were manipulating humans, one by one. Sure, his was a quest of revenge, but it still had a happy ending for humans. It's very, very clear that this game presents Kratos in something of a clean slate; he's done bad and brutal things, but he also saved the entire world, so he's earned the right to be seen in a new light and to be judged as a character on the events of this new game, not the old ones.
And even than it doesn't seem to be forgotten or anything. The entire first half of the 2017 e3 trailer is filled with dialogue of ppl apparently taunting him of his past, where he comes from, his son questioning him, his face when he looks at the vase and sees himself, the scared face he makes when his son says he knows the truth. They aren't trying to cover anything up and paint him as a good guy at all so idk where ppl got that from
 

Lappe

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
1,651
Kratos is probably my all time favourite video game character, and I personally don't see anything wrong with the direction, to be honest this is my dream God Of War.
A more narrative-driven game with more open areas, and slower more grounded combat.

Edit.

And It's fiction, anything the writers want to happen can happen, and that's great. Regarding the sudden change of scenery for Kratos.
 

KushalaDaora

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,838
I was always under impressions that the Greek gods only have influence over Greek and it's surrounding area. So when Poseidon died, the sea rage only affects Greek Sea. When Hermes died, the plague only affects Greek cities. When Helios died, the clouds only stopped the sun from shining Greeks.

Also, having just finished God Of War 3 a year ago, the new GOW feels like builds upon the final arc of GOW3, referring to Kratos/Pandora dad-daughter relationship (he wants to sacrifice her to fuel his revenge only to change his mind at the last second) and Kratos's redemption of undoing all the disaster he caused by sacrificing himself.
 

ChapterBlack

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
510
Kratos is a bigger character turn than Luke in TLJ. There is no reason for this to be god of war at all- it looks closer to horizon at this point
 

ClubNorth

Banned for having an alt account
Member
Jan 17, 2018
142
"And here I thought your kind were suppose to be so enlightened, so much better than us"

what does this mean?
 
Nov 8, 2017
6,341
Stockholm, Sweden
I think the new mythology is a fantastic idea, norse mythology is awesome and criminally rare in videogames.
And it seems like they are putting in effort to reinvigorating the gameplay loop, while still staying true to it's roots, and as for changing Kratos personality, good riddance his only defining character trait was anger.
Sometimes change is necessary and for the better.

I just couldn't get enough of Krato's brutality and brashness. I can identify with the character on so many levels

kxeOydf.gif
 

Heid

Member
Jan 7, 2018
1,815
They should have 100% called it something different.

Son of War, Father of War or something. Given that they might visit Mayan/Egyptian mythology in the future, maybe Gods of War.

Keep the logo/symbol. Keep Kratos' face on the front cover. How badly would sales really be hurt :/
 

Ghost Slayer

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,407
They should have 100% called it something different.

Son of War, Father of War or something. Given that they might visit Mayan/Egyptian mythology in the future, maybe Gods of War.

Keep the logo/symbol. Keep Kratos' face on the front cover. How badly would sales really be hurt :/
A lot? Its a well known brand so there is no reason not to use it.
 

ClubNorth

Banned for having an alt account
Member
Jan 17, 2018
142
Man i can't wait for the Polygon articles

"God of Colonialism?: God of War promotes Greek Hegemonic ideas."

"the game shows Kratos, a Greek Spartan physically dominating the Norse Pantheon subconsciously showing a Greek colonial logic over the Scandinavian other"
 

Thirty7ven

Banned
Jan 18, 2018
527
It's understandable if you are put off by such a big departure, but it looks like it was a much needed risk for the character and the franchise.

It looks like a new generation of God of War, instead of a linear extension of what came before. It's very exciting, and the only way for Kratos to be reborn in the eyes of the player.
 

FFNB

Associate Game Designer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
6,183
Los Angeles, CA
Interesting.

I've been a fan of God of War since the original, and I was pleasantly surprised at the new direction the series is taking. And I didn't even have franchise burn with the old direction. I could Blades of Chaos my way through Ancient Greece until the cows come home, but GoW 3 felt like a great conclusion to that part of Kratos' life.

I like that this new series is set in a different mythology, which I remember David Jade saying back in the day that his plan was to one day have Kratos wreaking havoc through all sorts of mythologies. I feel like this is a realization of that concept. Also, it's video games, so I just go with the flow, especially when God of War is involved. It seems like a lot of creative liberties are being taken with this new series, and the world is in a new age of gods and monsters. God of War was never an accurate portrayal of Greek history and fitting into a particular historical timeline in our real world history.

In the God of War universe, it seems like the age of Greek style gods is over, and the Norse style gods have grown from those legends of Kratos' exploits. The thing is, Kratos isn't dead, and has found himself a few millennia into this new age, where his exploits have been no doubt told and retold and shaped this new land. And now he has to live in it, with his son, and who knows where that's going to go?

Perhaps in another portion of the world, an Egyptian themed mythology has sprung forth, and in another part of the world, Ancient Japan, Ancient China, Mayan, etc etc. they aren't 100% accurate versions of the mythologies we know from our world, in the same way the original God of War games weren't accurate to Greek mythology, but it doesn't matter. GoW isn't taking place on our world, so the devs can have fun with it.

As a long time fan, I'm super stoked about the new game.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,440
Silicon Valley
Ultimately I'm not too interested in the game because what I like of the series were those epic set pieces larger than life and didn't seem to be in this game.
You've played it? Or just haven't paid much attention?

latest


God-of-War1.jpg


God-of-War.jpg


EDIT - And if it makes you feel any better, Cory Barlog has also confirmed huge boss battles and set pieces a few times over the past year.
 
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ClubNorth

Banned for having an alt account
Member
Jan 17, 2018
142
What happens when the kid finds out about Kratos killed his previous family?
 

¡Hip Hop!

Member
Nov 9, 2017
1,837
Sony chickened out. They said GoW 3 was the end of Kratos' story. It's a safer bet keeping the same recognizable character instead though.
 

Paltheos

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,679
You've played it? Or just haven't paid much attention?

EDIT - And if it makes you feel any better, Cory Barlog has also confirmed huge boss battles and set pieces a few times over the past year.

None of what you posted are set pieces. Your first picture is of a wide environment, and the other two are graphically intensive character models. Disregarding the last two because... huh (what do they have anything to do with set pieces?), God of War set pieces aren't just big environments you can explore. They're a mountain strapped to a titan wandering the desert that you can climb, or a 100 foot tall statue come to life to fight you across an entire city. Epic encounters or scenarios hyped up to the thing of myth (much like how the old games are framed). I think what epitomizes the feeling of a 'God of War set piece' is wandering around a dungeon for a while only to discover that where you are and what you're doing is part of something (literally) bigger and then actively pursuing that specific objective that's now been made clear to you.

The trailers for this game are very clear that this is not the same style of game as the previous entries' and it's a style that I'm just not personally interested in. ... That doesn't stop me from popping in from time to time though. :(