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Image shows possible Valve VR headset [UploadVR: Half-Life VR game in development alongside]
- Thread starter Civilstrife
- Start date
Aside from a number of hardcore fans, literally nobody cares about Steam hardware. Their impact in the wider market is nonexistent
Even if its not Half Life, Gabe said they're working on 3 VR games in secret and they're "all in" on the technology. I seriously doubt they're all short silly games like most anti-VR people want them to be.
SteamMachines were a terrible idea, and they came way too late. If anything, they've forced Xbox and Sony to produce mid-gen iterations to ensure any second attempt at SteamMachines have no chance too. A Valve VR isn't really a comparable situation at all. It seems like FB are driving Oculus to avoid the high end, as best as I can tell, there are no rumours of a true Vive 2. The high end VR market exists, and they don't have a better alternative.
That's not to say it would be successful, but I don't think it's an apt comparison to previous hardware projects they've undertaken.
That's not to say it would be successful, but I don't think it's an apt comparison to previous hardware projects they've undertaken.
Impressive how literally everything coming from Valve's software division since 2011 is so hype breaking to me. I should be hyped about the prospect of a new Half Life game but knowing it's a VR thing just makes you forget its existence the second after reading about it.
I always said to myself that I'd build a monster powerhouse pc when anything new HL related is confirmed. Maybe that day will actually happen now
This is megaton. If it actually is a true sequel to Half Life, this would be enough to push VR into complete mainstream, and even if it is more of a related game it's still huge.
Good news. Might be enough to make me buy a decent PC down the road.
Agreed. Valve are not stupid. They have the resources to create something special for this, and they know that is needed for their platform to stand out. Whatever this will be it is going to be special.
Good news. Might be enough to make me buy a decent PC down the road.
Agreed. Valve are not stupid. They have the resources to create something special for this, and they know that is needed for their platform to stand out. Whatever this will be it is going to be special.
I think the exact opposite of your post is much closer to the truth. Steam Machines were a great idea and they came way too early. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the idea of a console-like PC designed for the masses. That's what both Sony and Microsoft consoles are.
They only ever make sense in a world in which you can produce a box for less which is better, and you can only do that towards the end of the console generation. Now the console generations are three years, instead of six, so there's no window in which to divert console gamers.
The proof is in the pudding, no one wants them.
You haven't addressed my point about SteamOS (which you said stalled out - it clearly hasn't), but okay.
I still disagree about all hardware, however. The Steam Machines were a dud (they offered nothing to no one and were overpriced - but I would never rule out looking at them again in the future as the wider hardware market changes), but the Steam Controller has done well; it has enough users (500k as of 2016 - probably more now) for many developers to justify making official profiles for it. I'd consider that a success, and it having an impact on the market, even if it's not displacing the dual stick setup any time soon.
With that in mind, there's nothing saying that Valve making their own VR headset and library to support it couldn't be a success. And hopefully things they've learned from their other hardware initiatives will feed into how the VR headset is created and released. Steam Machines were half-baked (due to the immaturity of SteamOS and lacklustre games library at the time), and flopped accordingly. The Steam Controller pretty much worked with every game out of the box, and is still sold and supported by developers and the community even today. Steam Link (and I'm talking about the device and the app) is a mixed bag, but it's clear that plenty of people use the technology and find it useful outside of the "hardcore fans", and with the app being pretty good on Android TVs now, I expect PC gamers will use it increasingly more.
And that's ignoring the logic that "x failed, therefore y will fail". You might as well say "PS3 did poorly compared to PS2, therefore PS4 will do poorly compared to PS3" back in 2012/2013, or "the Wii U failed, therefore so will the Nintendo Switch" back in 2016/2017, or that "PS4 is doing well, therefore PSVR will do well too" (and that's not me saying PSVR did badly - Sony seem happy with it as far as I can tell).
There's no causal link between other Steam hardware (or just initiatives) not doing well and whatever this VR headset is doing badly too. There are many other factors that will decide that. They all sink or swim on their own merits and availability, and Valve has shown a determination to keep plugging away at something until it gets to where it needs to be, even if it starts slow (see Steam Link and Linux).
Okay, so they Kickstarter development again after years of non-public activity. Their last boogeyman was Microsoft and Windows - that didn't pan out so they shut up about their OS for games games games. The last release was in January this year and saying "we're working on it" after months of radio silence shows that it's a niche product inside a company that only really cares about its storefront. These hardware initiatives are distractions.
Edit: also, where does their current Os live on the hardware survey? https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/Steam-Hardware-Software-Survey-Welcome-to-Steam
I don't see any proof. None whatsoever. We'll know if people want them if Valve ever launches an appliance-like PC for the living room.
The thing that bothers me about Valve as a company is that they become increasingly dishonest as a company in the 2000s, then cancelled a game that was promised, and then acted evasive about it for over a decade instead of owning up to it. What do I mean by dishonest? Well, most people know about stuff like HL2's E3 demos being complete bullshit. But the more worrisome behavior was how they handled the development of Half-Life 2: Episode 1, which was called Aftermath originally. They lied through their teeth all the way up to the reveal that Aftermath had been replaced by a series of episodes. They were flat-out lying about how far the game was in development. We know this because we have a bunch of leaked map files from that period which demonstrate that Valve began taking the project in a different direction without telling anyone and worse, lying in every interview and every press release, claiming that development was proceeding smoothly and that the game was entering its final stage of polish, which was complete horse shit and they knew it.
Most promised sequels that disappear do so because the money ran out. Genuine unfortunate circumstances. Valve are different. They have obscene amounts of money. There is a string of developers who would gladly accept Valve's money to make Half-Life 3. And this is another sticking point. When Valve's development culture fell apart, taking Episode 3 with it, the other Half-Life episodes went up in flames along. Arkane were working on Episode 4. Warren Spector worked on an unnamed HL2 episode with his studio Junction Point. All that petered out. Which was very unfortunate. In an ideal world, Valve would have paid a capable AAA developer to make Half-Life 2: Episode 3. But they didn't. They canned Episode 3 and Episode 4 and then stuck their thumb up their asses for the next decade as year after year, more singleplayer FPS talent bled away.
None of this had to happen. If Valve had never promised a continuation of HL2, this would have fallen into the same basket as Rare not wanting to make Banjo games anymore. But Valve did promise a continuation. And they failed to deliver, and have shown zero contrition for misleading people both past and present. I am extremely curious to see whether they make up for this with the Half-Life VR project.
I think Valve have gotten a rude wakeup call, Major publishers are ditching Steam. It's snowballing to some extent. Valve making new and exciting games that are exclusive to Steam is how Steam got traction in the first place.
Most promised sequels that disappear do so because the money ran out. Genuine unfortunate circumstances. Valve are different. They have obscene amounts of money. There is a string of developers who would gladly accept Valve's money to make Half-Life 3. And this is another sticking point. When Valve's development culture fell apart, taking Episode 3 with it, the other Half-Life episodes went up in flames along. Arkane were working on Episode 4. Warren Spector worked on an unnamed HL2 episode with his studio Junction Point. All that petered out. Which was very unfortunate. In an ideal world, Valve would have paid a capable AAA developer to make Half-Life 2: Episode 3. But they didn't. They canned Episode 3 and Episode 4 and then stuck their thumb up their asses for the next decade as year after year, more singleplayer FPS talent bled away.
None of this had to happen. If Valve had never promised a continuation of HL2, this would have fallen into the same basket as Rare not wanting to make Banjo games anymore. But Valve did promise a continuation. And they failed to deliver, and have shown zero contrition for misleading people both past and present. I am extremely curious to see whether they make up for this with the Half-Life VR project.
I think Valve have gotten a rude wakeup call, Major publishers are ditching Steam. It's snowballing to some extent. Valve making new and exciting games that are exclusive to Steam is how Steam got traction in the first place.
It's not the only post from a bygone era in this thread.
Some people here have a hate hardon for VR, some have a hate hardon for Valve and some have a hate hardon equally as big for both.
This news is like the perfect storm.
This is a strange post because Episode 4 and Spector's game were never announced. You weren't deprived of something you were promised.
Episode Three is fair enough, they said there would be one, and there hasn't been, and probably never will. But that's it. One announced game. You can't count the other two at all.
We aren't owed HL2:EP3/HL3. It's not like they're obliged to pass the project to another studio just because they don't want to make it.
I think the SteamOS stuff was Valve coming to the realisation that they released it too early. The number of users using it is a testament to that (and Steam Machines). That doesn't mean it's "stalled out". Valve have the luxury, with SteamOS at least, of building it up over time. I think part of its early release was a legitimate fear that Microsoft was going to close down the open nature of Windows; they had made statements that were openly hostile to Win32 apps in favour of the "Metro" apps on their closed storefront. Gabe himself even said that Linux was "mitigating" against Microsoft ever closing down Windows in a way that negatively impacted Steam. Thankfully, that hasn't come to pass yet, so the need to migrate to Linux hasn't surfaced. However, I still think it's wise for them to continue to mitigate, but they now have the luxury to roll out the OS at a more sustainable pace, and Proton is the next big (visible) step in that process. If they ever reach a point where the software experience is top notch, I wouldn't be surprised if Steam Machines were tried again, with Valve learning the lessons of the old ones.
Basically this. I don't think overpriced third party PCs with a half-baked software platform flopping was indicative of anything other than the fact that those devices were wholly unattractive. Where Valve hardware has been attractive, it's found its market and had an impact.
Ugh, looks very cool but I refuse to get hyped for something that may be released next year, in ten years or never.
In 2018? Eeehhhhhh....
I love HL so much, but it's not exactly relevant anymore.
I think you're missing the point of what I'm saying a bit. Valve imploding -- and they did implode, losing all focus and direction, unable to create the kind of games they once did -- internally took out their partner developers, too. It'd be like Elder Scrolls VI disappearing and Bethesda refuse to talk about it. And then a few years later we discover that Obsidian were working on their own Elder Scrolls game, and when Bethesda killed Elder Scrolls VI, they also killed the other game because reasons. And then there was a third game that seemingly died from neglect. The other things are just insult to injury. When you discover just how terribly run the company in question is that not only were they incapable of delivering a product, but they weren't even capable of paying other people to do their jobs for them. It's a symptom of a much deeper problem with Valve's internal culture which, like I said, comes back to them lying through their teeth about everything. It's ironic that Gearbox developed the (excellent) Half-Life expansions, because Valve are really not that dissimilar to Gearbox in terms of being completely untrustworthy when asked direct questions.
There are parallels to STALKER 2. Game was announced. Game was in development. Company owner had some kind of midlife crisis and decided he wanted to go race motorcycles instead. The development team wanted to keep making the game, but he essentially killed the company to stop that happening because... pettiness or something. Now he wants to make the game, almost a decade after he killed it. And some fans are not particularly forgiving.
If you announce a game, "I got bored/I wanted to go race motorcycles" is not a very good reason to cancel it, particularly if your co-developers wanted to keep making it. Crytek would dearly love to make Crysis 4. I would dearly love to play Crysis 4. But they don't have the money. I accept that justification. (Bearing in mind that Cevat Yerli cancelled an unannounced open world third person shooter called Redemption because A: The GFC severely hurt their finances, driving them to place all their eggs in the Crysis 2 basket, and B: playertesters kept complaining that the game was about protecting a little girl and not focused on shooting dudes, and this caused him to become severely disillusioned with videogames as an art form.)
Half life 3 finally comes out & maybe less than 50k people play it due to it being locked behind a VR headset.
That would be hysterical.
That would be hysterical.
I wouldn't be surprised if it's the equivalent of that Batman Arkham VR game. The one thing that give some hope is that this is Valve we're talking about, and they surely know that releasing anything Half Life that isn't amazing will be counterproductive and arguably damaging to the product and their brand.
Well not niche, it'll do well, but I can't see it being some sort of turning point for VR.
But again, your outlook appears to be that they are obligated to have these games made. They are not. If they're not happy with them, for whatever reason, that's their decision.
Dota 2 was 2013, then it was three years before The Lab, but they were very busy with hardware and platform work. Then Artifact is this year, and Valley of the Gods is next year.
How have Valve imploded?
Around the time of Portal 2, Valve announced they were done with single player focused projects like that. And it's not just them, AAA single player games are dying. Outside of the platform holders, who have consoles to sell and platform portfolios to bolster, there's... R*... A few of the Japanese publishers are hanging in there, but that's pretty much it.
In terms of games, the shift in Valve's focus has been aligned with the rest of the PC developer industry.
Moreover, I just wholly disagree with your concept that those games were canned because of no good reason. You just don't know that to be the case. The fact that you highlight HL2's development being a shitshow is all the evidence to the contrary. Their standards for Half-Life are higher than their capacity to build games. I think it's ultimately that simple.
EDIT: Junction Point's HL game was cancelled because they sold to Disney.
I always expected the next set of Valve big games with a new technology. Portal 3, HL3 and hopefully L4DVR would all be perfect in VR.
These will be the barrage of AAA killer apps that will make people buy a $$$ headset, so far VR doesn't have that yet.
These will be the barrage of AAA killer apps that will make people buy a $$$ headset, so far VR doesn't have that yet.
HL3VR is still probably like 5 years out.
The only thing hysterical here is the fact that you think it would sell such a low amount.
No it's not. Stop this right now. It's going to be some "hang out in Gordon's garage in VR" bullshit.
Pump the brakes, people.
There's around 6 million Vive and Oculus users. That and valve making HL3 exclusive would push even more units, think it would do better then you think.
I'm guessing you haven't tried VR yet? Maybe you have, but it's disingenuous to call it a box on your head. It'd be like calling a TV a box that people stare at.
Even Valve's short experiences were on par with some smaller VR games. Valve has 3 full games in development, and I have little doubt they will be good sized games.
Why wouldn't they be? They positioned themselves to be market leaders in technology multiple times before
I expect to be a tech demo with Half-Life.... Which will eventually be used to concept Half-Life 3 VR! Time to dream.
Anyone who played the lab knows that valve put a lot of love and care into even their short experiences, and I imagine anything they do with their half life brand will not be half assed in any way
It won't be the half life 3 people want but it will be good regardless
It won't be the half life 3 people want but it will be good regardless
A HL VR game has very obviously been in development and teased for quite a long time. The question has always been if it would ever see fruition. Looking more likely, but as ever this is Valve. Things can be changed any time, so don't get too excited yet
Also, I highly doubt this will be "HL3". Personally, in a different medium such as this, it better to do something different.
Also, I highly doubt this will be "HL3". Personally, in a different medium such as this, it better to do something different.
Bring back Adrian
I believe it. VR is the only way to make a Half-Life game that wouldn't be a disappointment after all this time, because it would have different expectations. It's a great opportunity for Valve to define what a big-budget VR shooter can be, and have a fresh spin on elements like character interaction and physics without having to make a massive leap in technology to impress again.