Is it just me, or are the advantages of PC gaming diminishing?

Clay · Jul 9, 2019

The benefits definitely seem more niche. Looking back it's hard to believe we put up with the image quality of most PS3/360 games. PC at that point was like a whole generation ahead, I remember being amazed when I briefly played games on a friend's PC and saw something I was used to playing in sub-720p at 30fps in 1080p with AA at 60.

Now average console image quality is way better. The fps thing is still true, but I think a lot of people don't really care. Personally I'm fine with 30fps is fine as long as there's no drops. 60fps is always preferable all else equal, but it's not something I care about enough to drop hundreds of dollars on a gaming PC.

Ultrawide monitors seem very cool, that actually is something I'm actually considering building a PC in the next couple years for, and I doubt consoles with get that functionality any time soon. Again though, I don't see that being something that's worth the price for most people.

So yeah, PCs are obviously still preferable for the hardcore enthusiast but I agree that the benefits are less appealing than they were 5-10 years ago.

z1ggy · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Consoles have the better reviewed games, the better HDR Support, the better ATMOS support. It's a much better median for Home Theater Gaming thats for sure.

But if framerate is the end all be all, I can see why you'd prefer PC. But it feels to me like framerate is a an easy cop out for PC Gamers when the stuff I mentioned above is better on consoles.

🤣

Anyways, just ignore free online, modding, open platform, that you can actually do a lot of shit on PC that consoles cant even dream of (from making and recording music, to making films, to set up a company, to pay services, etc etc), regional pricing, actually competition for prices, refresh rate, gsync, emulators, backwards compatibility and so on.

JudgmentJay · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Consoles have the better reviewed games, the better HDR Support, the better ATMOS support. It's a much better median for Home Theater Gaming thats for sure.

But if framerate is the end all be all, I can see why you'd prefer PC. But it feels to me like framerate is a an easy cop out for PC Gamers when the stuff I mentioned above is better on consoles.

Really? You think "better HDR support" (no longer true) and "better ATMOS support" outweigh better framerate, better graphics, VRR, mods, emulation, the ability to choose whatever input method you want, and a catalog spanning decades? ATMOS is literally nothing. I have an ATMOS setup and I couldn't care less when games support it.

Rylen · Jul 9, 2019

z1ggy said:
🤣

Anyways, just ignore free online, modding, open platform, that you can actually do a lot of shit on PC that consoles cant even dream of (from making and recording music, to making films, to set up a company, to pay services, etc etc), regional pricing, actually competition for prices, refresh rate, gsync, emulators, backwards compatibility and so on.

I'm more of a single player gamer and don't have time for modding. Like I said home theater gaming is more my thing, I have a PC hooked up to my OLED for those rare occurrences when PC gets the same bells and whistles as consoles (HDR+Atmos) + better frame rates like in Forza Horizon 4.

But overall for me, console suites my style of gaming and game taste better (single player games, split screen with friends and family, no time for modding)

PinballRJ · Jul 9, 2019

Free online would only be worth it if cheating wasn't a thing

z1ggy · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
I'm more of a single player gamer and don't have time for modding. Like I said home theater gaming is more my thing, I have a PC hooked up to my OLED for those rare occurrences when PC gets the same bells and whistles as consoles (HDR+Atmos) + better frame rates like in Forza Horizon 4.

But overall for me, console suites my style of gaming and game taste better (single player games, split screen with friends and family, no time for modding)

Weird, i have not only my SNES, PS3 and PS4 hooked to my main TV but also my PC. So you went the route of "its just my taste" after you talked that shit about FPS and PC gamers cop out.

Also didnt know single player gamers couldnt use mods! because im a single player as well and i use them quite often.

zerocalories · Jul 9, 2019

Anyone that thinks that consoles are reaching parity with pc gaming doesn't really understand/or care about high fps/high frame rate gaming

Rylen · Jul 9, 2019

JudgmentJay said:
Really? You think "better HDR support" (no longer true) and "better ATMOS support" outweigh better framerate, better graphics, VRR, mods, emulation, the ability to choose whatever input method you want, and a catalog spanning decades? ATMOS is literally nothing. I have an ATMOS setup and I couldn't care less when games support it.

What do you mean better HDR Support is no longer true?

The list of HDR games here

https://www.xbox.com/en-us/games/xbox-one/xbox-one-x-enhanced-list#tabletitle

Is nearly twice as long as the list of Native HDR Games here

https://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_games_that_support_high_dynamic_range_display_(HDR)

JudgmentJay · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
What do you mean better HDR Support is no longer true?

The list of HDR games here

https://www.xbox.com/en-us/games/xbox-one/xbox-one-x-enhanced-list#tabletitle
Is nearly twice as long as the list of Native HDR Games here

https://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_games_that_support_high_dynamic_range_display_(HDR)

Sorry, I thought you were referring to the fact that Windows used to not be great at HDR. Anyway, the fact remains that you seem to care about a couple of extremely specific features that make a tiny difference vs a large list of features that make an actual difference. I'd give up HDR and Atmos in every game for all time for even one item on my list above.

It's pretty funny that you accused PC gamers as "copping out" when they cite framerate as an advantage. I'd describe what you're doing with HDR and Atmos as the exact same thing. The only difference is framerate actually matters.

Earvin Infinity · Jul 9, 2019

PinballRJ said:
Free online would only be worth it if cheating wasn't a thing

Cheating is a thing in paid online on console too. All you gotta do is Google search hackers / cheaters on PS4 and Xbox One and you've got lots of people complaining about cheaters in various games. Don't act like because you pay for an online subscription for peer-to-peer connections doesn't mean there aren't any players cheating in online games.

packy17 · Jul 9, 2019

PinballRJ said:
Free online would only be worth it if cheating wasn't a thing

Literally has nothing to do with online being free or not. People pay (sometimes big) money for their cheats. And with AC software getting better, it's not as prevalent as it used to be.

Rylen · Jul 9, 2019

JudgmentJay said:
Sorry, I thought you were referring to the fact that Windows used to not be great at HDR. Anyway, the fact remains that you seem to care about a couple of extremely specific features that make a tiny difference vs a large list of features that make an actual difference. I'd give up HDR and Atmos in every game for all time for even one item on my list above.

It's pretty funny that you accused PC gamers as "copping out" when they cite framerate as an advantage. I'd describe what you're doing with HDR and Atmos as the exact same thing. The only difference is framerate actually matters.

You have your preferences, and I have mine. For my preferences, consoles is the better choice.

Spark · Jul 9, 2019

Coi said:
I'm with you OP!
PC gaming it's B tier. And it always be. It has better graphics and that's it. It doesn't have all the support from companies, it doesn't have any real good exclusive (or at least a good mainstream exclusive), and the "free online" at least for me it's a dumb argument since I can play online on console for just $5 a month, like buying a coffee.
Just let PC gamers think that they market it's relevant. We all know that's not true. Just imagine a world without PC gaming... Yeah, no one cares.

I'm 90% sure this thread is a honeypot to weed out low effort users. Third console warrior banned due to this thread right?

Spark · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
You have your preferences, and I have mine. For my preferences, consoles is the better choice.

A startling diplomatic revelation, after you called PC gamers preferences of a higher frame rate a 'cop out'. Or did you forget that?

Sandersson · Jul 9, 2019

PinballRJ said:
Free online would only be worth it if cheating wasn't a thing

I dont think I have encountered a single cheater in my life (bar Demon's Souls and Dark Souls 1.)

BobbeMalle · Jul 9, 2019

There's no reason to console war over this, both platforms have pros and cons.
And no, there are no diminishing advantages. Hell, i think this is the best time to jump into PC Gaming.
Hardware is getting better and better for the same prices, well maybe not for RTX 2080 Ti :)
If i had to chose, i would chose PC over consoles any day, but i own consoles and i can understand their appeal.

blueredandgold · Jul 9, 2019

The most egregious thing I find is for all the talk of the PC platform's ability to reach such high levels of fidelity and performance every console generation....the games for the most part are still tethered to - and therefore governed by - the specs in those consoles that are currently out and saying they are the best possible, whichever year that might be.

I'm showing my age but it's one of the reasons I don't understand the urgency around cross-play, for example - literally having a more level playing field that enables greater connectivity at the expense of what was once an arms race to get more bang for more bucks.

I think it was XCOM 2 - all of things - that made waves because it was PC-exclusive if only for a time. But for that time, there was no forsee-able date in the future for other platforms.

Rylen · Jul 9, 2019

Spark said:
A startling diplomatic revelation, after you called PC gamers preferences of a higher frame rate a 'cop out'. Or did you forget that?

It's what I believe based on my preferences.

Personally I can't really tell a difference between locked 30 FPS and locked 60 FPS.

It's varying frame rates that irk me a bit.

Firefly · Jul 9, 2019

blueredandgold said:
The most egregious thing I find is for all the talk of the PC platform's ability to reach such high levels of fidelity and performance every console generation....the games for the most part are still tethered to - and therefore governed by - the specs in those consoles that are currently out and saying they are the best possible, whichever year that might be.

Games are developed to scale on PC too. High end market was always a minority. People still mention Crysis but scaled back to low made it look like Far Cry.

pswii60 · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Consoles have the better reviewed games, the better HDR Support, the better ATMOS support. It's a much better median for Home Theater Gaming thats for sure.

But if framerate is the end all be all, I can see why you'd prefer PC. But it feels to me like framerate is a an easy cop out for PC Gamers when the stuff I mentioned above is better on consoles.

As I've mentioned in this thread, I bought a gaming PC a couple of months back, I own Pro/X/Switch, I'm a console gamer for the last 20+ years. And you're totally wrong about "Home Theater Gaming". Because games look so much better on my OLED with my gaming PC than the X it's unreal. Jaw droppingly so. It's the gaming PC that can use every single one of my OLED's pixels on every game. It's the gaming PC which can use the full refresh of my OLED, including 120hz for pristine motion without any blur. And HDR is just fine contrary to whatever you've heard.

Obviously Sony's first party games are only on PlayStation. Nintendo's on Switch. But for everything else PC destroys the other platforms from a game selection and technical standpoint.

As for ATMOS, that threw me a little. It's true that the X currently has more games supporting it than the PC, but you also stated that console has the better reviewed games compared to PC, so you can't have been referring to the X then, and Pro doesn't support ATMOS so I'm left confused by which platform you actually mean. And if you rate ATMOS above 60fps and native 4k etc then we have very different priorities when it comes to gaming tbh.

Serious Sam · Jul 9, 2019

Guys guys guys, have you tried owning a gaming PC and consoles? It's pretty great setup without compromises and you don't need to fight on internet forums about your platform of choice like children.

Solaris · Jul 9, 2019

Serious Sam said:
Guys guys guys, have you tried owning a gaming PC and consoles? It's pretty great setup without compromises and you don't need to fight on internet forums about your platform of choice like children.

No, I am emotionally invested into my preferred platform and need to be a cunt about it and dismiss the others.

blueredandgold · Jul 9, 2019

Firefly said:
Games are developed to scale on PC too. High end market was always a minority. People still mention Crysis but scaled back to low made it look like Far Cry.

Totally, I made sure to leave the word 'scale' out of what I was trying to articulate on purpose. That base point is still just that, an entry level that guarantees a maximised return. As 'high end' has changed definition so to does our idea of what constitutes modern standards.

I'm lucky(?) that I am able to for the most part sample most of what the current market has to offer but still need to make a judgement call on what would be of value to me - I don't have the time for gaming that I used to, so I don't see upgrading anything I have in the forsee-able future..

mario_O · Jul 9, 2019

When AMD comes back with high end GPU's, and RDNA is looking really good, prices should be better. Leaving Nvidia alone all these years has been horrible for consumers.
AMD's Ryzen CPU's have also helped with prices.

XuandeXun · Jul 9, 2019

Serious Sam said:
Guys guys guys, have you tried owning a gaming PC and consoles? It's pretty great setup without compromises and you don't need to fight on internet forums about your platform of choice like children.

Yeah, I have. Until my children moved out, and then I could send off the childrens' gaming devices with them.

Not a fan of console wars either, but I couldn't resist.

On a more serious note, consoles today and consoles 3+ generations ago are/were targeting entirely different audiences. My tastes haven't changed that much, but I can praise most older consoles while also saying that there's little on offer today for my tastes. Meanwhile, PC is gaining far more new games than it loses to backwards incompatibility.

Sandersson · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Personally I can't really tell a difference between locked 30 FPS and locked 60 FPS.

Yeah... thats not true though is it. Unless you need glasses and for some reason you decide to game without them.

Arthands · Jul 9, 2019

Coi said:
Keep begging for console exclusives to come to PC.

the thing is...PC has console exclusives from each consoles too. Street Fighter 5, God Eater, Yakuza, Disgaea etc from PS5, Halo, Gears from XBox, Octopath, GRIS from Nintendo.

Ganransu · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Personally I can't really tell a difference between locked 30 FPS and locked 60 FPS.

The drop is more noticeable than the climb. For me at least.

Try playing exclusively on PC for 6+ years then go to console, the difference is day and night. I was in the "I can't tell the difference" camp(sorta, I understood the difference in response time even if I struggled to tell one from another) until that one time when I decided to get into Bloodborne after all those years on PC...

Cecil · Jul 9, 2019

The advantages of the platform has always been that it's the one free platform, with games that you don't see on other platforms, and that becomes what you want it to be.

Nothing of that has changed.

Bede-x · Jul 9, 2019

pswii60 said:
If you're using an Xbox One controller then yes, as games just support that natively. It just works for me on everything.

But does the client itself support that? Can I navigate the interface with a joypad, like Steam's Big Picture mode or Xbox'x Game Bar? If so, I'll try it out.

DvdGzz · Jul 9, 2019

It's the opposite for me. Now that Gamepass is on PC, I can have access to that, Steam, mods, free online, and Indy games that are probably never coming to console. I think I will get a PC instead of Scarlet next gen, I only wished Sony had their own version of Gamepass and put it on PC too.

Deleted member 22585 · Jul 9, 2019

Don't agree at all.

Reshade is amazing and can make a huge difference
Mods significantly enhance a lot of games
Cheat engine helps you get rid of stupid stuff like inventory weight management in rpgs
Significantly better visuals with high-end hardware, especially now at the end of the console cycle
High fps and Gsync / freesync are incredible
Way more options in general, mouse controls for shooters
No online paywall
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay shorter load times with good SSDs. Sure, you can use SSDs in consoles, but they are faster in a PC.
Additional stuff like Nvidia Shadowplay or RTX for those with new cards
Etc.

I feel like there are no diminishing returns. There are a lot of advantages and improvements all the time. Sure, prices are high but it is worth it for me.

pswii60 · Jul 9, 2019

Bede-x said:
But does the client itself support that? Can I navigate the interface with a joypad, like Steam's Big Picture mode or Xbox'x Game Bar? If so, I'll try it out.

Yes Playnite has full controller support for its interface.

Danteyke223 · Jul 9, 2019

I am actually really soured on the console experience for the past three or four years, and I am now moving to PC Gaming. The amount of load times, patches, and how Sony and MS does not fully utilize my internet download speeds is kinda disappointing. Console gaming is now a real hassle for me and I cannot wait for next year when I'm building my PC. I also do not trust what Microsoft and Sony are saying about load times. Sure it sounds good, but they are just going to be around 500USD consoles, and most of MS's catalogue will be on PC so I might just a get a PS5 when it becomes cheap for those Sony exclusives.

Oh and i hate their noise levels, Xbox One X is mostly ok, but you can't just pick them apart like PC's to clean them

Anomander · Jul 9, 2019

I've been a long time Playstation-only owner, but since I bought a decent PC I can't imagine playing any 3rd party games on PS4 Pro at 30fps. So at this point I'll only use consoles for exclusive games, unless PS5 gives me framerate choice. I had hoped PS4 Pro would provide such option but it has been one of the most disappoint purchases I've had to date.

AYZON · Jul 9, 2019

To me the advantages have always been that 1. Its not limited to gaming and I can do whatever the shit I want with it and 2. I can mess around with games if I want to. (Reshade, Mods, Config edits, creating my own mods and so on)

Bede-x · Jul 9, 2019

pswii60 said:
Yes Playnite has full controller support for its interface.

Hot damn, I guess even Epic Store isn't enough to dimish PC advantages then. Thanks a lot, will install it when I get home tonight :)

Quample · Jul 9, 2019

Hardware pricing may not be as good as it was before the crypto boom, but I think that's about it. Everything else is as good or better. Console centric devs are actually making good PC ports these days.

Edit: also, PCVR.

pswii60 · Jul 9, 2019

Bede-x said:
Hot damn, I guess even Epic Store isn't enough to dimish PC advantages then. Thanks a lot, will install it when I get home tonight :)

Just FYI, 4.74 is the latest stable version on the main site, but you can try out the beta here which includes an improved interface: https://github.com/JosefNemec/Playnite/wiki/5.0-beta-testing

Aztorian · Jul 9, 2019

Yup, customised a new rig in 2015 for 1200. In november 2018 I started to notice the first struggles on High settings in videogames. Checked prices for a upgrade and switched back to my PS4. Been gaming happily on it since then and I am not slightly wanting to go back to my pc een though theres a huge backlog on it.

Javier23 · Jul 9, 2019

Rylen said:
Consoles have the better reviewed games

Like, I could give a rat's ass about platform warring lmao, but if you honestly believe this that just tells me you are missing out. You should explore the market of PC exclusives even if just out of curiosity.

TheAdmiester · Jul 9, 2019

I feel the exact opposite of the OP to be honest. Yes, launchers might be messy, but the total control over your games is an absolutely gigantic advantage, not to mention the infinite scalability of hardware and brute forcing.

Take GTA 4 for instance, it ran like shit on PC when it came out. Now though, I can go back to it, patch it up with graphics mods so it looks better than before, AND run it way better than before. If I go back to it on 360, it's still stuck in 2008 and 25ish FPS.

As time goes on I find myself sticking to my PC more and more, and consoles less and less. Any new game I want, I get on PC. Right now I have a PS4 and an Xbox One X, both are rarely used - the PS4 is purely a GT Sport machine and the Xbox is purely a backwards compatibility machine (until emulators on PC surpass it).

elyetis · Jul 9, 2019

Aztorian said:
Yup, customised a new rig in 2015 for 1200. In november 2018 I started to notice the first struggles on High settings in videogames. Checked prices for a upgrade and switched back to my PS4. Been gaming happily on it since then and I am not slightly wanting to go back to my pc een though theres a huge backlog on it.

I have a hard time following the logic there.

Aztorian · Jul 9, 2019

elyetis said:
I have a hard time following the logic there.

Don't feel like paying a load of money to upgrade my PC so I can play on high settings with good fps again. I had a PS4 for exclusives, but now it's my primary console for games, when it used to be PC.

Ganransu · Jul 9, 2019

Aztorian said:
Yup, customised a new rig in 2015 for 1200. In november 2018 I started to notice the first struggles on High settings in videogames. Checked prices for a upgrade and switched back to my PS4. Been gaming happily on it since then and I am not slightly wanting to go back to my pc een though theres a huge backlog on it.

... I've also bought my PC in 2015, for less than you have. I was pleasantly surprised when Sekiro was able to run at max with no frame loss.

Though I guess Sekiro isn't exactly the most demanding game ever? What game have you played that struggled to stay on high? Let's see if it's time for me to upgrade.

Shpeshal Nick · Jul 9, 2019

I gave PC Gaming one last try when I bought an Alienware laptop a couple of years ago.

i7, 1060 6GB, 16GB DDR4, SSD/HDD combo. It was a pretty good laptop at the time and I paid $2000AU for it. Too much work though. Had to fiddle with too many games to get them running properly, the hardware itself wasn't overly reliable and then of course the countless launchers.

All that and yet only a year or so after buying it, I was already starting to find games I couldn't experience at 1080/60 with high settings.

Completely not worth the cost or effort involved.

Deleted member 35048 · Jul 9, 2019

Ganransu said:
... I've also bought my PC in 2015, for less than you have. I was pleasantly surprised when Sekiro was able to run at max with no frame loss.

Though I guess Sekiro isn't exactly the most demanding game ever? What game have you played that struggled to stay on high? Let's see if it's time for me to upgrade.

I too made my rig in 2015, and Monster Hunter World and Apex Legends both default to low/medium settings in Geforce Experience (although they default to high with default settings with subpar performance). Sekiro though runs fine (some dips in some areas but nothing dramatic).

elyetis · Jul 9, 2019

Aztorian said:
Don't feel like paying a load of money to upgrade my PC so I can play on high settings with good fps again. I had a PS4 for exclusives, but now it's my primary console for games, when it used to be PC.

II mean I get what happened, I just don't get the logic behind "it cost too much to upgrade my PC, so I'll make my console which didn't upgrade itself either, my new primary platform".

My computer still has a 2016 CG, while it mean that I can't max out as many option as I could 3 years ago, it's power relative to my ps4 and switch is still the same.

Deleted member 50374 · Jul 9, 2019

Shpeshal Ed said:
I gave PC Gaming one last try when I bought an Alienware laptop a couple of years ago.

i7, 1060 6GB, 16GB DDR4, SSD/HDD combo. It was a pretty good laptop at the time and I paid $2000AU for it. Too much work though. Had to fiddle with too many games to get them running properly, the hardware itself wasn't overly reliable and then of course the countless launchers.

All that and yet only a year or so after buying it, I was already starting to find games I couldn't experience at 1080/60 with high settings.

Completely not worth the cost or effort involved.

That's about three times I spent on my PC with similar performance, of course it's not worth the cost.

It is really still very puzzling to hear that since people can't play at 1080/60fps high, they prefer 900p/30fps at medium (but more like low with smooshing) settings.

texhnolyze · Jul 9, 2019

themuzzotheory said:
It is really still very puzzling to hear that since people can't play at 1080/60fps high, they prefer 900p/30fps at medium (but more like low with smooshing) settings.

The biggest mystery of this forum.

Is it just me, or are the advantages of PC gaming diminishing?

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