Is Kojima the M. Night Shyamalan of the gaming industry?

AuthenticM

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,736
So I just beat Death Stranding. I loved the gameplay; building infrustructure to link the various outposts is actually quite addicting. That said, the story is hugely disappointing, for a number of reasons I won't get into right now. And the "action" parts also sucked.

The last few stories that Kojima tried to tell have been disappionting to me. Death Stranding, Metal Gear Solid V, and Peace Walker as well. So for the last decade, Kojima has let me down in the story department, which is a giant shame, because I adored the stories of the first four Metal Gear Solid games.

This made me think about how I feel the same about M. Night Shyamalan. The man's first three movies, The Sixth Sense, Unbreakable and Signs, are all amazing and beautiful movies with great, human stories. Then the guy drank too much of his own kool-aid and went off the deep-end, and hasn't been able to tell a good story since. Split was the closest he came to being back to form, but even that does not approach the level of quality of his first three movies.

Kojima feels the same. Dude had it all earlier in his career, then, from many accounts, became imbued with his own ego, and stopped telling great stories.
 

Edgar

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,672
Kojima is Zack Snyder of video games. I prefer Zack Snyder over kojima 10 times out of 10 though
 

yuoke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,263
M night made the village, lady in the water, the happening, TLAB, and after Earth all in a row at one point.
 

ghostcrew

Spooking
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
9,997
United Kingdom
I think MGSV is on par with the early MGS games. I think it’s one of the best games of the generation. Probably top three for me.

Does anyone think that about modern Shyamalan movies?
 

Miamiwesker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,216
Miami
Kojima’s talent is game design, not storytelling. He is one of the greatest most influential game designers in history. MGSV might have the best mechanics of any third person action adventure. He made one of the most memorable horror games of all time from a demo! He made walking interesting.

The man is still excellent at what he does.
 

LoNe_eXiLe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
192
The better question is if the Keighley's are just an "I have famous friends" award show accompanied with the yearly Kojima slobfest...
 

JuicyPlayer

Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,826
Why is Kojima all of a sudden bad? Death Stranding is the only game ive seen of his where people are divided on. Metal Gear , Metal Gear 2 , Metal Gear Solid 1-5 , Boktai and Zone of the Enders were all decent games. Shyamalan has a lot more crappy movies than good ones.
 

Mobu

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,444
Why is Kojima all of a sudden bad? Death Stranding is the only game ive seen of his where people are divided on. Metal Gear , Metal Gear 2 , Metal Gear Solid 1-5 , Boktai and Zone of the Enders were all decent games. Shyamalan has a lot more crappy movies than good ones.
Shitting on Kojima gets easy internet points
 

VDenter

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,038
Kojima hasn't told a good story since MGS3 and even that is only good by video game standards. Even that is debatable.

But truthfully that doesn't matter because many of his games continued to have good gameplay past MGS3.

So i don't think this is a fair comparison at all.
 

Edgar

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,672
Kojima’s talent is game design, not storytelling. He is one of the greatest most influential game designers in history. MGSV might have the best mechanics of any third person action adventure. He made one of the most memorable horror games of all time from a demo! He made walking interesting.

The man is still excellent at what he does.
Honestly, I don't think you gave enough praise to kojima sama
 

DangerMouse

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,362
Why is Kojima all of a sudden bad? Death Stranding is the only game ive seen of his where people are divided on. Metal Gear , Metal Gear 2 , Metal Gear Solid 1-5 , Boktai and Zone of the Enders were all decent games. Shyamalan has a lot more crappy movies than good ones.
This. He's made so many GREAT games.
 
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Tatsu91

Member
Apr 7, 2019
1,094
I think MGSV is on par with the early MGS games. I think it’s one of the best games of the generation. Probably top three for me.

Does anyone think that about modern Shyamalan movies?
The gameplay in MGSV is top tier some of the best of the generation the story being half only being told through logs and codecs blew and then the true ending never actually coming fruition also blew so story wise it was a let down so far i am digging the story in DS though is it convuluted yes but overall i am enjoying it but i am only nearing the end of CH3 at 18 hours or so
 

Dust

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,658
The Happening is one of the worst movies to ever be put on the big screen. Kojimbo has not fallen that low yet.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,726
These "Is X the Y of videogames?" Threads are so tiring. People can share similarities (eg Kojima and Shamylan having early hits and disappointing follow-ups) without becoming *the person* of that industry. And, no, Kojima is far more beloved and respected in the videogame industry than Shamalyan is in the film industry, it's not even close. Every Shammy movie since Lady in the Water and The Village is met with eyerolls from film makers and most movie-goers or film enthusiasts. Every Kojima game is met with breathless anticipation. People expect Shammy movies to be stupid these days, where as the overwhelming majority of videogame enthusiasts expect Kojima games to be great even in this community. The reason we have Kojima threads is because it's so surprising that Death Stranding is so meeehhhh, or at least, even people who like it recognize this game probably won't appeal to most people or you like it inspite if some decisions Kojima made.

Is Kojima the Marcus Mariotta of videogaming?

Is Rajon Rondo the Hideo Kojima of the NBA?

Is Bethany Frankel the Hideo Kojima of Real Housewives of New York in the same way that John Madden is the Luann De Leseps of NFL commentators?
 
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Mobu

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,444
These "Is X the Y of videogames?" Threads are so tiring. People can share similarities (eg Kojima and Shamylan having early hits and disappointing follow-ups) without becoming *the person* of that industry.

Is Kojima the Marcus Mariotta of videogaming?

Is Rajon Rondo the Hideo Kojima of the NBA?
Is Madoka the evangelion of anime?
 

Baconmonk

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
4,812
If you ignore all the stuff that make his games videogames, I guess maybe.

KojiPro has consistently made very detailed games with very intentional interactivity. DS is no different, and I feel like the studio's games have gotten better with time. The open world approach to MGSV provided more options than any other in the series, but none were usually 'best' but rather your style or what the situation at hand required. I feel like DS is the same on this way, as even near the end no single traversal style is 'best'. You need to approach every delivery individually if you want the best rankings, or maybe you go out of your way to set up a bunch of zip lines to ease the return trip.

I can understand not liking Kojima's storytelling style, and I do agree it isn't the same as MGS1-4. But if you're trying to say KojiPro is past their prime and only making shlock, I wholeheartedly disagree.
 

Arm Van Dam

Member
Mar 30, 2019
2,973
Illinois


Kojima doesn't stoop down to this plus he didn't make the worst fucking adaptation of Avatar the Last Airbender or make a sequel which fucks over two movies at the same time.
 
Jul 10, 2018
249
Honestly the Kojima hate here is a bit much. He isn't a great writer, but there's so much more to a development process than writing and he has his hands on every single facet of his games. He excels in game design but his detractors only talk about his storytelling and writing all the time and never want to give him credit for areas does excel at.
 

Jangowuzhere

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,274
Nope, it's the opposite

Kojima was making great games, and now he's making some of the best stuff in the AAA industry.

I think it's very dismissive to compare him to M Night. MGSV is arguably the best action game this generation.
 

cw_sasuke

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,739
Trump, Musk, and Kojima are the holy trinity of ERA hatred.
Add Ninja and we have a ERA party.

But it's not just era but the western media in general...the Podcast discussion surrounding DS were ridiculous. People were really reaching and looking excuses to paint Kojima as some crazy Japanese maniac with a God Complex and would use the everything to built that narrative for the audience.

I assume that the attention he gets pisses of some people in the media...him getting that big Sony check and being able to design the game he wants to makes some people feel insecure about themselves lol.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,697
The Gang never tried to meet Kojima, so until that happens he can only dream of rising to the same level as M Night.
 
Jan 15, 2018
569
I don't think you can compare them, Kojima popularized an entire genre, pushed forward the way stories are told in games, and then went on to create many of the most famous games of all time. Even Death Stranding, which is proving to be his most divisive game, is by and large still pretty acclaimed. Even though he definitely has an ego (what acclaimed auteur doesn't?), it hasn't hurt his or his studios output.
 

Havel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
76
MGS 1-3 are some of the most beloved and revered games in the industry.

Can you say the same about M. Night and any of his works in the movie industry? Some of his early movies were decently recieved, but not to a genre defining extent.
 

♡♪!?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,023
He's the Steven Moffat of video games. Mostly known for one franchise, Doctor Who or Metal Gear, comes across as talented guy with critical success but with a bit of their head up their arses at times. Lol that's the best comparison I can do.
 

Figboy

Associate Game Designer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,412
Los Angeles, CA
I'm legitimately curious about when it became the in thing to hate on Kojima? Like, when did that start, exactly? He's consistently made some incredible games, and while I've only played a few hours of Death Stranding, it's clear that he's created something different. It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it's an intriguing game and concept.

He's a talented game designer, with a penchant for infusing his work with his eccentric world view. I don't understand the need to hate on him at the level I see in every thread about him. If you don't enjoy his work, just don't engage with it. I can't stand Michael Bay or Zack Snyder, so I don't waste my time consuming their content, and I certainly don't go out of my way to shit on them in every thread related to them. I guess I just feel like my energy could be spent towards discussing things that don't make my blood pressure rise or put me in a foul mood.
 
Oct 28, 2017
8,117
Kojima's resume speaks for itself.

As MiamiWesker already astutely pointed out, he is one of the best and most influential game developers of all time.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,602
He hasn’t had nearly the amount of flops M Night has had so no?
I loved the story of DS. Wacky, over the top, mysterious, idk I really enjoyed it.