Liam Neeson's real-life rape/revenge tale (See Staff Post)

[mutantmagnet]

Anyone have a link to a video interview because ...woof.

This really reflects poorly on Neesan's character even if he didn't go through with it. He was patrolling for a week and a half. Not a day, over an entire a week working out his anger before he realized he's walking around like a knob.

What makes this the worst thing possible is that he decided its ok looking for anyone random person to kill if they even got slightly confrontational with him during this period. He made the rape all about himself and instead of trying to deal with a specific person who leaned hard into past racists feelings to make someone pay for another person's actions.

This is the type of thing you confess to a priest, psychologist or your parent/significant other. If you go telling other people who aren't professionals or very close and committed to you you will be questioned on what's changed to prevent this racist self centered flare up to occur again.

Btw if you're not black please shut all the way up if you planned on excusing this.

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I don't think someone being black should get a pass for that. But you do you with your assumptions.

You're filling in the blanks of his intentions. He isn't doing a PSA on racial violence, he's trying to sell a movie.

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Dude clearly went off script and the reservation. Admitting a past desire to murder someone, anyone, is not how you sell anything.

 

[julian]

Yea, I was not pissed at this thread at first, but all the "BUT HE DIDN'T ACT ON IT!" posts are pissing me the fuck off.

Reading comprehension is at an all time low. Wandering the streets with the weapon to kill black people is MOST DEFINITELY acting on your racist impulses. If some poor black guy actually DID walk up to Neeson, he would be a murderer. Point blank.

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He's talking about how he felt and the actions he took to deal with those feelings (carrying a weapon on him). Do you really believe that over a whole week he never saw a black person? Despite coming off like he was actively looking? That doesn't make sense.

 

[marrec]

He acknowledges that having vengeful thoughts is harmful. Cool.

Anything about the racist aspect of it?

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Didn't say shit about it specifically, like I said earlier in the thread he's probably far more ashamed of the racist part of his racist violent fantasy. Either way he probably hasn't come to terms with that specific part.

Let's not pretend that there is any pretense of normalization to his anecdote though, he's seemingly well aware it was horrific.

 

[Bisha Monkey]

I genuinely think your average racist wouldn't even react like that

he's all the way fucked up

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No, they call the cops in the hopes that they will do their dirty job.

He seems really ashamed of his past self, the man isn't seeking forgiveness and seems he hasn't forgotten himself, he realizes it's a weight that will be carried for the rest of his life and the way to deal with it, it's shinning exposure to his irrational behavior by reflecting on it so that others don't spiral into the same path of hatred, in whatever version it may come. So I can really appreciate that.

 

[Volimar]

Do you know understand how fucking racist what Neeson said is? Because apparently neither does he and that's what people have an issue with.

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I think this is the crux of the argument. If he had made a strong statement on how wrong the racist aspect of what he did was, we'd all still side eye the hell out of him for doing it in the first place, but we wouldn't all be standing here waiting for him to address it adequately. Once his PR people get to him, we'll probably see it, but we'll see how it goes.

 

[Deleted member 1248]

But shit like this just creates this attitude that a person can never better themselves, which also doesn't help things and if anything makes people stay silent about shit that happened decades ago because we're just supposed to pretend it didn't exist and wokewash the past?

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This is a lie. You don't only better yourself because you're expecting a reward from others. You better yourself because doing the right thing is it's own reward. Otherwise you're just absolving yourself of responsibility for your own shit.

 

[Morrigan]

When he uses air quotes and says "black bastard", I feel like "black bastard" was not what he said in the story.

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Had the same thoughts. That's an euphemism all right

 

[MrBadger]

Thanks for keeping the principle of charity alive.

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Please elaborate? What am I doing wrong?

 

[Razmos]

Do they know it from within themselves? Have you confronted the darkest impulses within you and come out the other side? My own experiences, and the simplistic judgements of people in this forum, tell me that the majority of people have never bothered to engage in any kind of deep introspection.

Their views of themselves are simple and they judge others accordingly. But the reality is the average person is capable of extremes of behaviour and becoming aware of that is a deeply life altering experience which a person carries with them.

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Going through a traumatic event isn't going to turn me into a racist murderer or would be murderer though.

I know myself well enough to know that I would never actively want to kill anyone unless it was for self defense.

Going "I know I could kill someone if I was super angry" is not normal. Resorting to violence when angry is not normal or acceptable.

It's toxic to believe that violence is ever acceptable at all

 

[Principate]

Do they know it from within themselves? Have you confronted the darkest impulses within you and come out the other side? My own experiences, and the simplistic judgements of people in this forum, tell me that the majority of people have never bothered to engage in any kind of deep introspection.

Their views of themselves are simple and they judge others accordingly. But the reality is the average person is capable of extremes of behaviour and becoming aware of that is a deeply life altering experience which a person carries with them.

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I'm sorry but no, not everyones first reaction to recieving extreme trauma from someone of another races is to blaim their entire race. Racists do that. People who didn't consider people of an other race as human or equal do that.

It's a nice easy barometer to explain to your real feelings towards them.

 

[Charamiwa]

No matter how sorry or changed you are, there are some things you should probably take with you to the grave.

 

[Nepenthe]

Let's not pretend that there is any pretense of normalization to his anecdote though, he's seemingly well aware it was horrific.

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We're all aware it was horrific. The answer black folks want is what he did to reconcile those racist thoughts.

Until we get an answer we're not obligated to give a shit.

 

[Slayven]

psh. easy to say that when you were never in those shoes. Not everyone can stick to their ideals and principles and rationale when dealing with something like rape so yeah, you can say whatever you will not do when something horrible happens to your loved ones which don't mean a thing since you haven't experienced it nor are you in it.

people are so up on their high horses it's ridiculous. guy admitted he had clouded judgement and people in here are dogpiling on him for being irrational at a time of pain. if you're at your lowest, being racist is not the most horrible thing you can think of doing. a lot of people think about way more horrible thoughts. no one is excusing that, at all.

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A week looking to lynch people is not "clouded judgement", that is something deep rooted

 

[prophetvx]

This is a lie. You don't only better yourself because you're expecting a reward from others. You better yourself because doing the right thing is it's own reward. Otherwise you're just absolving yourself of responsibility for your own shit.

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What sort of reward would one expect from mentioning this in an interview?

It clearly hasn't worked.

 

[SurrenderDorothy]

He acknowledges that having vengeful thoughts is harmful. Cool.

Anything about the racist aspect of it?

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Nah, people here just keep sliding by that point.
A week fam, a whole week looking for a black man to kill.

 

[Corky]

Had the same thoughts. That's an euphemism all right

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it's in the recording

 

[thecouncil]

Dude is probably in all these action revenge movies to satisfy his urge to kill people. The whole thing fucking fits. Probably disappointed that he's not exclusively killing black people though.

 

[jack_package_200]

 

[Nepenthe]

A week looking to lynch people is not "clouded judgement", that is something deep rooted

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You're saying you haven't had that perfectly normal reaction before? Hmph, yeah right. ERA is so full of angels.

 

[Morfid_Plays]

All of us have an implicit bias against dark-skinned people. It's unsurprising that extreme trauma and anger will turn this bias into racial violence.

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What the fuck is wrong with you

 

[Morrigan]

it's in the recording

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We are referring to the time where the incident occurred, not the interview.

 

[SurrenderDorothy]

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Oh man, what did Viggo Mortensen do?

 

[thecouncil]

When he uses air quotes and says "black bastard", I feel like "black bastard" was not what he said in the story.

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Had the same thoughts. That's an euphemism all right

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it's in the recording

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Doesn't mean he isn't thinking it. (Hint: He absolutely is)

 

[ishan]

(See Staff Post)

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where is this? its not modded into the op?

 

[Gustaf]

A week looking to lynch people is not "clouded judgement", that is something deep rooted

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of course it was deep rooted, it was northern ireland 30 years or so ago

 

[Deleted member 3925]

All of us have an implicit bias against dark-skinned people. It's unsurprising that extreme trauma and anger will turn this bias into racial violence.

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What the fuck...

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

He's talking about how he felt and the actions he took to deal with those feelings (carrying a weapon on him). Do you really believe that over a whole week he never saw a black person? Despite coming off like he was actively looking? That doesn't make sense.

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I don't know, you tell me:

Northern Ireland has a pretty rough history with racism. From a 2004 article:

Northern Ireland, which is 99% white, is fast becoming the race-hate capital of Europe. It holds the UK's record for the highest rate of racist attacks: spitting and stoning in the street, human excrement on doorsteps, swastikas on walls, pipe bombs, arson, the ransacking of houses with baseball bats and crow bars, and white supremacist leaflets nailed to front doors.

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Ninety-Nine percent white.... And this is in 2004. I can imagine it was even more homogeneous in the 1970-80s.

So yea, I imagine even if he did see a black person, the one or two he saw never walked up to him.

 

[Deleted member 52442]

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VIggo is fine isnt he

 

[astro]

I am all for forgiveness and redemption if properly earnt.

But if you can't understand why black people are having an issue here you really need to engage your empathy and shift your perspective a little more.

Liam didn't adequately address how fucking racist and horrible that was beyond a "well, you know, it was awful" which, imo -given how fucking brutal his intent was - needs a LOT more focus.

And why the fuck did he drop this? What good did it do anyone?

I'm sure he's spent a while with the guilt of it, but he shouldn't just shrug the story off moments after dropping it. It deserves far, far more focus than that if he feels the need to over-share.

And this is assuming he actually does feel remorse over it, maybe he's internalized it in a way that he comes out as the hero and hasn't really leanrt a thing. This is highly possible too.

 

[mutantmagnet]

An aspect not really being covered here is the spectacular lack of consideration (on Neeson's behalf) for the actual victim, who has had potentially their experience shared with the world without their consent. How many rumors and innuendos will now be circulating among women are are or were previously in Neeson's life?

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I'm still floored how inconsiderate he was of the victim at the time. He couldn't even be bothered to find out the specific person that may have harmed her.

"black or white?"

"Black? Time to get my revenge on."

*stews for a week and a half looking for trouble*

 

[uzipukki]

Oh man, what did Viggo Mortensen do?

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it was something about the movie Green Book. Cant remember the specifics tho.

 

[StarCreator]

where is this? its not modded into the op?

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At the top and bottom of the thread to the right-hand corners there is a "Staff Posts" button, if any are present in said thread.

 

[Surfinn]

So I'm just catching up with this thread, here are my thoughts. I read the article, listened to the memories he recalled. Couple things:

1. Being interviewed for a fucking movie is not a good platform for confessing the desire for a racially motivated hate crime.

2. He didn't address his blatant racism when expressing his remorse, it's just about the needless violence and revenge.

People don't just earn a fucking "they've changed" by retelling a story and feeling bad about something. If you harbor extreme racism in your brain, you need to address it and actually show that you've taken real steps to change as a person.

So people throwing out "what's the big deal, he's grown" need to fucking check themselves or provide actual, hard evidence of it.

 

[Betty]

It's toxic to believe that violence is ever acceptable at all

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Even in self defence?

 

[Deleted member 9241]

I dated a girl whose sister was violently attacked and her father did something very similar (except it was 2 black dudes and 1 white dude). I read this and immediately flashed to that story. Much like Liam, the father looked back in hindsight and was both embarrassed and ashamed of himself. But he totally prowled the location where it happened basically praying anyone meting the description would start something with him. He said it took him around 3-4 days before the rage left him enough that he realized what he was doing was ludicrous. I found the story shocking because the guy was a goddamn saint and was actually quit timid TBH. You could tell he felt responsible for not protecting his daughter and he just took that impotent rage to the streets.

Good news though, the cops found the guys and all 3 were convicted after my girlfriend's sister and a handful of other female victims testified against them in court.

 

[Carolina Reaper]

where is this? its not modded into the op?

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Look at the the threadmarks for this thread.

 

[Deleted member 33533]

You're right, I'm playing Devil's Advocate but it's something I personally do in a lot of threads concerning a wide array of subjects. Maybe I'm being naive or misguided but I do this to help me work through my own thoughts, it's certainly not because I give a shit about Liam Neeson.

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I realize you say you don't care about Liam Neeson but you are still effectively going to bat for him in your effort to work through your own thoughts. If anything that just makes what you're doing here worse - I could almost understand your motivation if you just loved Liam Neeson movies and didn't want to believe he was a bad person. I wouldn't agree with that motivation but I could see how it would blind you to the actual racism at hand and how serious it is. Instead, you're just dismissing racism for the sake of it. When accounts of racism by black people are always doubted and and accounts of racist behavior by white people are always given the benefit of the doubt, do we really need your Devil's Advocate here? Do we really need yet another voice dismissing the reality of racism? Work out your thoughts on your own. There's a lot to process there, clearly.

 

[jack_package_200]

Oh man, what did Viggo Mortensen do?

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Used the N word at a Green Book q&a

 

[stupei]

I think a lot of people in the thread want to believe he's reformed because it's an insane story to just drop like that and it feels like it only makes sense in the context of remorse. Because if he's still that violently racist, what is he even doing? It feels impossible to make sense of, especially so for white people who don't have to confront, face, and contextualize that kind of racism on the regular.

But people trying to bully or coerce others into feeling a certain way or forgiving when there is zero obligation or need to offer a random celebrity your forgiveness are acting very gross and also clearly misunderstand a lot of the concepts of remorse they're talking about. Remorse isn't actually about receiving forgiveness. No one is obligated to give it to you and the expectation of forgiveness negates the remorse entirely because it proves it is self-serving.

White people do need to own our racism, but people of color are under no obligation to forgive us for any of it. You're not owning your shit just so you can get a treat and a pat on the back.

Love how some people think his racism was borne out of his friend being raped when his first reaction to hearing about it "What colour was he?", which I'm sure is the first thing on the minds of all non-racists when they hear their friend was raped.

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This was the part that stood out for me as the most crazy racist in a story that's pretty crazy racist.

 

[Deleted member 26526]

And romesh hits it outta the park !

 

[pizoxuat]

Men and women are raped and sexually assaulted every day and don't go around hoping to murder someone with their attacker's skin color, so don't act like his fucking bystander manpain is uniquely horrible and justifies his bullshit.

 

[DOBERMAN INC]

So he would stand outside pubs eyeballing black people hoping they would start something and then he'd try to kill them?
This isn't some red mist moment, it's a pre-planned act that luckily never came to anything.

 

[Kongroo]

Do you know understand how fucking racist what Neeson said is? Because apparently neither does he and that's what people have an issue with.

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You're losing your shit over an interview where Liam Neeson shares an experience where he acted in a racist way and clearly regrets it. I get exactly what you're saying. The problem with this toxic way of thinking is that it fucks over any chance for people to rehabilitate properly. So while I agree with you that he didn't condemn strongly enough, he's making a great first step.

Let people grow or you're condemning us to a culture where people internalize and rationalize their racist beliefs instead of renouncing them. The lack of nuance is just stunning.

 

[Razmos]

Even in self defence?

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Sorry, I meant violence isn't acceptable as a reaction to anger specifically

 

[Deepwater]

You're losing your shit over an interview where Liam Neeson shares an experience where he acted in a racist way and clearly regrets it. I get exactly what you're saying. The problem with this toxic way of thinking is that it fucks over any chance for people to rehabilitate properly. So while I agree with you that he didn't condemn strongly enough, he's making a great first step.

Let people grow or you're condemning us to a culture where people internalize and rationalize their racist beliefs instead of renouncing them. The lack of nuance is just stunning.

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"You are actually the problem with racism, just so you know"

 

[TelluricTokoro]

can't say I'm surprised.

Neeson is a white man, after all.

 

[Betty]

Sorry, I meant violence isn't acceptable as a reaction to anger specifically

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Fair enough, and i'd agree.

 

[Ketkat]

psh. easy to say that when you were never in those shoes. Not everyone can stick to their ideals and principles and rationale when dealing with something like rape so yeah, you can say whatever you will not do when something horrible happens to your loved ones which don't mean a thing since you haven't experienced it nor are you in it.

people are so up on their high horses it's ridiculous. guy admitted he had clouded judgement and people in here are dogpiling on him for being irrational at a time of pain. if you're at your lowest, being racist is not the most horrible thing you can think of doing. a lot of people think about way more horrible thoughts. no one is excusing that, at all.

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If it's necessary for someone to have gone through this in order to explain this to you, then please listen. I have been sexually assaulted, and the pain that I felt and the irrational thoughts that I had were very real. Those thoughts ranged from blaming myself, to being scared of being in that part of town in case he was there which led to me staying inside for a while. But, that's the thing about those thoughts, I never once jumped to hating all men because of this man despite hating him with every fiber of my being. He's a terrible, shitty person but even through all of my fear and pain, it was always about either me or him.

Not everyone is going to react the same way that I did, and it's honestly hard for me to judge people who do want revenge against their attackers or people who have hurt their loved ones. But, that isn't what Neeson did here. I wouldn't have been happy if anyone in my family/friends had hurt my attacker and ruined their lives over someone as terrible as him, but I would have been genuinely upset if they went out looking to beat up any random men they find just because a man was the one to do this. It goes beyond just being irrational and comes from a place of hate to want to go out and stalk the streets looking for any black man that you can find just to feel better about that awful powerlessness.

Liam Neeson acted from a horrific position of racism, and there is no justifying that or finding that understandable to me. People aren't on high horses for judging that either, because the man was a genuine danger to others around him and they have every right to be upset that he could have murdered some random person.

 

[weekev]

I don't believe "once a racist/always a racist" in all cases but this is a pretty extreme case, don't you think? This isn't your average case of diet racism or racist thoughts like "Oh I used to cross the street when a black person was walking towards me on the sidewalk but I realized my own racism and stopped doing it." This is someone who went out for an extended period of time fully intending to target and kill a random black man. That IS abhorrently racist.

The fact is that Neeson did not bother to address this racism of his. I don't see why we should give him the benefit of the doubt by default and wait to see his next statement which will almost most assuredly be damage control. Why do white people always get that default confidence when they say or do racist things? Let him prove he's changed and grown instead of rationalizing his actions and giving him the benefit of the doubt. Just look at the people in this thread who are closing gaps in the story themselves to excuse or forgive Neeson instead of taking what he said at face value.

When white people say or do racist things, we're always waiting for more answers to see if it truly was racist or if they are still the same as they were then. When black people are persecuted for racist reasons, we ask to wait for more answers to see if it was truly racist while we by default try to find some other explanation. Just compare the immediate defenses and forgiveness for Neeson here compared to the doubt surrounding Jussie Smollett's assault and whether or not it was a hate crime or if it even happened as he said it did. Liam Neeson is a white man who's also a famous movie star so of course he's gonna have people forgive him off the bat even with a half-hearted account of what he did and no proof that he's changed. I, however, can't default to "he's changed since then, it's not once-a-racist-always-a-racist" here, especially as a black man. I simply can't afford to.

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Whilst I get your point I think his interview was more focussed on the extreme thought of violence that his mood was driven to by a traumatic experience suffered by a loved one. I don't think he has fully considered how race drove his hatred and seems more disturbed by the thoughts of violence than the reality that his hatred is also racially motivated.

 

[Deepwater]

How can you expect white people to renounce racism if non white people dont accept them with open arms!