Magic: The Gathering |OT| Throne of Eldraine - Will and Rowan's Excellent Adventure

jph139

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,935
Massachusetts
Wizards general game plan, across departments, seems to be fuck up -> be extremely transparent and apologetic about said fuck up -> fuck something else up.

So I'm not super confident
 

ZealousD

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,170
Like I said, they need to stop putting guest writers on these established characters. They have too little time to absorb the background information and they sure as heck can't read the temperature on how the community feels about these characters without being a part of that community.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,435
716
I don't know that there ISN'T something like this, but why aren't there Writer's Guides for each character for the authors to follow? Wouldn't be that hard to put together a profile with important characteristics, personality details, landmark events, and definite future paths to work toward. I am willing to bet there are at least 5 people on this board alone who could scrap something like that together from memory for at least three of the major characters each. It's just mindblowing how sloppy they treat their brand.
 
Oct 28, 2017
4,867
I don't know that there ISN'T something like this, but why aren't there Writer's Guides for each character for the authors to follow? Wouldn't be that hard to put together a profile with important characteristics, personality details, landmark events, and definite future paths to work toward. I am willing to bet there are at least 5 people on this board alone who could scrap something like that together from memory for at least three of the major characters each. It's just mindblowing how sloppy they treat their brand.
The people running the story department are idiots or apathetic. It’s the only explanation.
 

Beje

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,490
All my bets go on something related to Russia and/or China. With Ral+Tomik or Alesha they can do an "overwatch" and just bury the LGTB stuff in lore or additional media not published there but any relationship between main characters depicted in their star e-sports game might raise some eyebrows in those countries.
 

Alternade

Member
Oct 27, 2017
346
Yeah its got to be a fear of branching out globally with Arena and having some countries not allowing LGBT content. Doesn't make sense otherwise
 
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,196

* Mystery was intended to recreate the experience of Chaos Draft, but with a lower chance of getting a deck that just doesn't work.
* Mystery came from a request from Organized Play for a convention-only product.
* The playtest cards were inspired by Duel Masters' Black Box set, which included cards for months of the year, a designer's dog, and even Jace and Bolas.
* Even reprints need a ton of work to get them ready for a new printing. Printing them exactly as they had them recorded avoided that. They have print information going back to Mirage, which is why that was as far back as they went for reprints. The planeswalker symbol was added to help collectors.
I won't go into how all of them came to be. But I will mention three very important ones to me.

The first are the cards Bucket List, Bombardment, Pick Your Poison, Graveyard Dig, Wizened Arbiter, and Zymm, Mesmeric Lord. These are cards from the competitors of the Great Designer Search 3 that they submitted during the process. While they didn't get hired, I thought it would be a great nod to their hard work and dedication to get each of them a card printed. Congratulations on getting them through!

The second is Xyru Specter. What's up with this card? Well, when working on Dominaria, Richard Garfield sent me all of his designs and then I put the ones we chose into the file. But the most charming part of the whole thing is that they were all written like old-school Magic cards.
* As the project grew bigger, they realized they couldn't make this convention-only.
* Organized Play wanted something that would be exclusive to conventions, and the playtest cards seemed right for that. They didn't want these to be widely circulated, since they weren't playtested. They also weren't sure what the response would be: it was likely players would be upset about getting unplayable cards. Thus, the store version has foils reprints.
* They chose not to give artist credits for the playtest card doodles in order to not cheapen things for actual artists.
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,032
The other takeaway about the set is that they explicitly state that CFB is charaging $25 for drafts with Mystery Boosters, while they charge $20 for Throne of Eldraine. I can't find it via google, but that also is probably cheaper than Modern Horizons drafts were- the "MSRP" for this might be closer to $5-6 a pack than the $7-8 Modern Horizons was
 

ZealousD

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,170
The other takeaway about the set is that they explicitly state that CFB is charaging $25 for drafts with Mystery Boosters, while they charge $20 for Throne of Eldraine. I can't find it via google, but that also is probably cheaper than Modern Horizons drafts were- the "MSRP" for this might be closer to $5-6 a pack than the $7-8 Modern Horizons was
I've heard rumblings that the distributor price for Mystery Booster Boxes is slightly less than the distributor price for normal Standard Booster Boxes, but they have 24 packs per box. That would put us in the $5-$6 range. The perceived EV is very high with about $10-$15 per pack but a lot of these reprints are coming from cards with low supply or EDH play so that EV may come down quite a bit.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
6,698
I'm going to be honest, MTG was not a place I ever expected to see a character have a sudden and explosive bout of the Not Gays.

I... honestly don't think I even expect to see that in like Gears of War these days.
 
Oct 28, 2017
4,867
The other takeaway about the set is that they explicitly state that CFB is charaging $25 for drafts with Mystery Boosters, while they charge $20 for Throne of Eldraine. I can't find it via google, but that also is probably cheaper than Modern Horizons drafts were- the "MSRP" for this might be closer to $5-6 a pack than the $7-8 Modern Horizons was
Do you know if limited fanatic includes these events?
 

TAFAE

Member
Aug 27, 2018
175
Michigan
Anyone watching the SCG Invitational? I missed the first 3 rounds, but it sounds like the emerging top tier in Pioneer at the tournament is Mono G Devotion (championed by Corey Baumeister, Brad Nelson, Todd Anderson, et. al.) vs. GB Hardened Scales (championed by Team Lotus Box). If that holds up, I wonder how much green they're going to have to carve out of the format to get things under control. 1 cmc dorks might end up being too strong.
 

Firemind

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,437
It's pretty hilarious green can do so much broken shit in a format where Lightning Bolt isn't even legal.
 
Magic Story - The Gathering Storm - Chapters 13-20 (end) New
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,196
Well, I suppose I should really get around to finishing The Gathering Storm. Previous summary post.
Chapter list

Chapter 13
* Vraska is back in Golgari HQ, planning a counterattack for when the other guilds come to their territory.
* Hekara is taken in by guards; she came to talk to her without Ral knowing. She asks her to join up with them again, since she's her own boss and can decide things for herself. But Vraska does have a boss, so she can't.
* In Orzhov HQ, Teysa confronts Kaya about how she's been forgiving debts. Kaya says they're a small percentage of the guild's operations, but Teysa says that doesn't matter.
* Ral is frustrated in his apartment. Tomik is too. They have sex, but then they verbally vent their frustrations. Before it can turn into a fight, they agree to have dinner.
* The Gruul are launching attacks across the Tenth District, more organized than they've ever been, possibly due to Domri's leadership.
* Ral plans the attack on Golgari territory to set up a node; it will be a difficult one, as it will have to be underground in a kraul hive.

Chapter 14
* Vraska admires the architecture of the underground kraul city of Grek'ospen, carefully built up over centuries. It will be ruined in the upcoming battle because Ral can't just leave things be.
* Kaya is amazed by how far the underground cities stretch. She came from a town of 100 people, and her plane had cities, but not like this. She's been to large cities on other planes since, but still.
* Vraska stands in the center of town, and Ral goes to talk to her. He stands far away from her, to avoid her gaze, so they have to shout their conversation.
* Diplomacy breaks down and Vraska raises her hand, seeming to give the order to attack. Ral does the same, but instead of attacking, the Golgari collapse the chamber's roof.
* Vraska arranged it so that her position wouldn't have anything fall on it, but Ral's forces are pinned by rocks and now beset by Golgari forces.
* As Vraska watches and takes part in the carnage, she realizes she was a fool to think she was anything but a killer. Bolas just showed her what she is. The bit of Jace inside her mind pushes back against this, but before she can mentally argue, an Izzet Mizzium Tank appears. Then more bizarre vehicles, including mechs, show up.
* Vraska has zombies attack Ral, wearing him down until he runs out of electricity.
* Kaya fends off Golgari foes, but then is attacked by an Orzhov assassin, hoping to take her out in the chaos.
* Aurelia rescues Ral from Vraska.
* Xeddick the telepathic kraul mentally holds off Aurelia until Vraska can flee, and Aurelia kills him.
* I have to say, this chapter did a much better job describing a big battle than the WAR novel ever did.

Chapter 15
* Ral's forces captured the Golgari city, but there's difficulty getting equipment and parts down there to construct the node.
* Tomik comes to Ral's office in Izzet HQ, a first. He's there on guild business. He's worried about assassins coming after Kaya; Teysa would become guild leader after that. Ral's only concerned about whether Teysa would maintain their alliance if that happened. Tomik leaves.
* Kaya is refusing the food Teysa sends to her, worried about poison. She gets a note warning her that her guards were replaced by men who would capture her, and that she should meet with the notewriter.
* She phases through the ground, having checked before that there was an old man's personal chambers below, but there, she finds several armed soldiers and mages waiting for her. The mages prevent her from phasing out, using magic they previously used to bind spirits, forcing her to fight them with daggers. Since they wanted to capture her alive, she defeats them and escapes into the hallway, where she encounters soldiers who didn't get the memo about not killing her.
* Kaya flees, then is let into a storage room where Bolas is waiting, in the form of a man in shadows. He says he'll help her as long as she helps him destroy Ravnica. She decides it isn't worth it. He asks about her plane with its broken sky. She says she'll find another way to fix it.
* She arrives at the stables, where Tomik is waiting. He's the one who wrote the note.
* Thrulls surround them, but then Ral comes to the rescue. Ral and Tomik kiss.
* Tomik has some useful information to share.
* Later, Kaya willingly goes up to Teysa and the hierophants opposed to Kaya. Kaya lists the details of the hierophants' contracts with her and declares them in breach, making them keel over in pain. She orders the guards to arrest Teysa, and thanks to their contracts, they have to.

Chapter 16
* Ral and Tomik talk. Ral wasn't fully committed to him, but he wants to be now.
* Ral dreams of the past. He makes a new Accumulator, far less dangerous than the acid-battery based ones he used before, but still not what he'd like.
* Bolas talks to him. He suspected Ral was a planeswalker, so he set things up so he would spark and be in his debt.
* Ral rejects him, and decides to head back to Ravnica, where he'll find a place, even if he doesn't know what.
* Vraska thinks about what happened. Since she took over, thousands of Golgari have died and an ancient city was ruined, and Xeddick was dead. It probably would have been better if he didn't unlock her memories, so she wouldn't feel so bad. She's still working for Bolas regardless.
* Bolas talks to her in the form of a possessed Boros soldier. He already has someone assigned to destroy the nodes, so he wants her to stop Ral from activating the Planar Beacon. Vraska doesn't want to waste soldiers and will kill Ral on her own. Bolas is pleased and dispossesses the soldier, who starts screaming. Vraska kills the soldier.

Chapter 17
* Ral meets with Lavinia in a bar, for the first time in a while.
* She says Bolas is coming to Ravnica tonight.
* At Izzet HQ, Ral gives the order that they're activating the nodes now. They don't have time to fully test them. Niv-Mizzet is ready and standing by.
* Lavinia confronts Tezzeret (this being his first appearance in this story). He captures her with constructs. She insists that Azorius spy thopters saw this, so Azorius soldiers will come any moment. He laughs at this.
* The node in Izzet HQ starts exploding. There was a surge in power coming from the Azorius node; Dovin Baan betrayed them.

Chapter 18
* Bolas arrives, with an army behind him coming through the Planar Bridge. Note that it's night here, while it's morning when he's shown arriving in WAR.
* Niv-Mizzet orders Ral to activate the Planar Beacon. He'll hold off Bolas as long as he can.
* Niv-Mizzet sets up a death flag and finds himself enjoying the wind on his wings as he flies. He hadn't had time for such indulgences in ages.
He was misshapen, to Niv-Mizzet's mind. Standing on two legs, with his face flattened and broad, human-like mouth and features. There was entirely too much of the human about Bolas for the Firemind's taste.
* Hey, Niv-Mizzet has the same complaints as some people here!
* Niv-Mizzet activates several power stores he set up around the city and gathers the energy into himself. He fires it into Bolas.
* We get a DBZ style scene of Bolas being covered in smoke so Niv-Mizzet thinks he won, but Bolas turns out to be mostly unharmed.
* Bolas and Niv-Mizzet exchange hundreds of spells, the ricochets killing tons of people.
* They get in close and start grappling. Bolas is disappointed that they would act like beasts.
* Niv-Mizzet bites him, which makes him bleed.
* Bolas explains how powerful he used to be as a planeswalker, and he wants to return to that glory.
* They clash with spells again, and Niv-Mizzet realizes he won't be able to outlast Bolas. It's sobering, because throughout all of this planning and scheming, he assumed Bolas made an error in thinking he could actually defeat him.
* Niv-Mizzet realizes the only possible advantage he has is knowledge of the city. He flies away, and Bolas flies after him; inelegantly, in Niv-Mizzet's opinion.
* Niv-Mizzet throws Bolas into a Simic zonot, an enormous hole going into the undercity and the ocean below. Niv-Mizzet destroys the buildings and makes them fall on Bolas. He ignores the screams of the dying people.
* Bolas survives this, having surrounded himself with void magic that destroys everything it touches. Niv-Mizzet feels a strange unfamiliar emotion, and realizes it's fear.

Chapter 19
* Ral heads for the Planar Beacon. Azorius is doing nothing to help with the chaos in the streets. Boros is trying to help, but Gruul is taking this time to riot. Ral sees that the missing Azorius soldiers are all guarding the Beacon.
* Kaya joins up with Ral, followed by Hekara.
* A Rakdos parade follows behind Hekara, and they fight the Azorius guards. Oddly, they Azorius are completely flabbergasted by this when you'd think this would be a normal thing.
* The named characters get in and start climbing up the building. Tezzeret's constructs are waiting for them. They destroy them.
* Lavinia and Vraska are in the Beacon room waiting for them, Lavinia now wearing armor and under Bolas's mind control.

Chapter 20
* Ral wants to knock out Lavinia, not kill her. However, she has a lightning ward and his electricity won't work on her.
* Typo. "It would use up much of the power left in his accumulator, and probably kill Lavinia if he didn't gauge the discharge just write."
* Bolas, through Lavinia, explains that Ral would want to fight Tezzeret, while he wouldn't want to fight Lavinia, which is why he sent her.
* Lavinia knocks Ral to the ground and is about to skewer him, but Hekara takes the blow and dies.
* Ral grabs Lavinia and is able to find and pull off Tezzeret's mind control device. The bit of Bolas's spirit flies out of her and threatens to just possess someone else, but Kaya destroys it.
* Vraska hits Kaya on the head and faces Ral. She thinks that no matter what she does, Bolas will win, so there's no point in resisting. Golgari's only chance is to join with him; he could betray them, but that's all she has.
* Using Izzet equipment, Ral drains power from the storm outside and becomes super charged. His blast seems to erase Vraska from existence, but she planeswalked away.
* Ral activates the Planar Beacon.
* Meanwhile, the kraul death priest Mazirek is assassinated by Rakdos performers, requested by Vraska through Hekara.
* Tezzeret meets up with Bolas, who to his surprise, is pretty badly hurt. However, he feels himself quickly enough. Bolas carries Niv-Mizzet's skull, scoured of flesh.
* Tezzeret reports that the Beacon was activated, and Bolas smiles, saying that everything's going as planned.

And that's it. Overall, a pretty good novel, though brought down heavily by the fact that everything has to be resolved by another author, who doesn't do nearly as good a job. Plus, you know, the fact that this was not just released after the sequel, but wasn't completed until after the book for the next set after was released.
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,032
B&R predictions for tomorrow? I’m leaning towards them banning 4 cards, with none of them being Oko

-Veil of Summer
-Nissa, Who Shakes the World
-Hydroid Krasis
-Once Upon a Time

They REALLY don’t want to ban cards from the most recent set,but they know that they will have to hit one of Oko/Goose/OUAT, and will decide on OUAT cause it’s going to end up banned in multiple formats anyway
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,435
716
I’d threaten to quit if they fail to ban Oko but I basically already have. Oko needs to go, full stop. It’s winning in Legacy and Vintage. It has no place in Standard. It was a mistake.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,839
Oko and Once Upon a Time need to go. The biggest problem with standard is not just the power level of Oko but the sameness of the experience.
 

Poodlestrike

It's salt.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
5,837
"Unfortunately, we will have to delay the B&R announcement indefinitely, as the team seems to have been turned into 3/3 elks."
 

Izzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
291
I'm predicting two cards. 3/4 cards feels like you just kick green to the curb and it can hang out with White for the next 2 months. But it's gonna take more than 1 card to move the needle from green.

Oko has gotta be numero uno. There's just too much heat on that card to ignore it. And you have to allow other decks to be able to play, you know, creatures.
OUaT is clearly the worst of the remaining cards. It enables too many broken starts with practically no downside. If it survives then just craft your favorite simic food or G/x adventure deck because that's gonna be the rest of the meta.
 
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SigmasonicX

SigmasonicX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,196
Oko has way too much attention to not ban.
Autumn's Veil being banned in Pioneer but not Standard would be really weird. It's getting banned in Standard too.
Once Upon a Time is probably getting banned in Standard and then in Pioneer in the afternoon.
 

ZealousD

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,170
Oko has to get banned. I would not expect more than one other green card getting banned. It is a possibility but I think WotC will try to play it more safe.

If I were to pick a dark horse candidate for a ban, it would be Edgewall Innkeeper. Innkeeper fits the mold of a proactive ban like Rampunap Ruins or Rampaging Ferocidon where Wizards might ban a card in a Tier 1.5 deck in anticipation of it becoming an unstoppable Tier 1 deck.
 

TheYanger

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,540
Once Upon a Time has to go, but I think they'd be wary of banning both a 30+ dollar mythic and a 15-20 dollar rare at the same time, which is sad.

I'm sure there are metrics about how players lose trust in the company if they buy a single that gets banned for lots of actual dollars, but surely the metrics that show how bad it is for the long term profitability of the game are also showing how bad it is NOT to ban busted cards regardless.

Ultimately, there are other good cards in Eldraine, clearly, the packs should still sell and the next tier of cards will increase to absorb the cost of the boosters, ideally.
 

Fiddler

Member
Oct 27, 2017
199
I think Oko, Veil and once upon have to go to make non green decks have a chance in Standard. Anything green will still be strong thanks to questing beast, nissa and hydroid crasis but there needs to be room to let other decks breath in the early game. Just banning one or two of these cards won't change greens clear dominance.
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
9,898
Oko and Once Upon a Time need to go. The biggest problem with standard is not just the power level of Oko but the sameness of the experience.
Once Upon a Time absolutely needs a ban. One of the stupidest cards ever printed, and if you just ban stuff from Green ramp then Edgewall Inkeeper takes over the format.
Oko has to get banned. I would not expect more than one other green card getting banned. It is a possibility but I think WotC will try to play it more safe.

If I were to pick a dark horse candidate for a ban, it would be Edgewall Innkeeper. Innkeeper fits the mold of a proactive ban like Rampunap Ruins or Rampaging Ferocidon where Wizards might ban a card in a Tier 1.5 deck in anticipation of it becoming an unstoppable Tier 1 deck.
An Innkeeper ban is unnecessary if Wizards also hits Once Upon a Time, since that card's pushing the consistency of turn 1 or 2 Innkeeper way up.
I haven’t bought one card from this stupid broken pushed power creep ass set.
I'd have been nice if the power creep wasn't all concentrated in one color.

I don't think it's a coincidence that virtually all the busted cards from the past year have been colorless, blue, or green.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,435
716
I'd have been nice if the power creep wasn't all concentrated in one color.

I don't think it's a coincidence that virtually all the busted cards from the past year have been colorless, blue, or green.

It's a nice coincidence that ban day is my birthday.
Well they needed to buff the color pie sections that are traditionally weakest /s

Also happy birthday! Let's hope we all get what we want for it :)
 
B&R update - Oko and friends New

Izzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
291
Hipsters of the coast is reporting Oko Veil and OUaT banned in standard, waiting on mothership confirmation since it looks like the page isn’t live yet.

Edit: confirmed!


Oko banned in brawl, wrenn and six banned in legacy

Narset restricted in vintage
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
9,898
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/november-18-2019-banned-and-restricted-announcement?ilovepizza

Ho boy.

Oko, OUaT, and Veil banned in standard.

Oko banned officially in Brawl.

Wrenn and Six banned in Legacy.

Narset, Parter of Veils restricted in Vintage.
Well they needed to buff the color pie sections that are traditionally weakest /s

Also happy birthday! Let's hope we all get what we want for it :)
Thanks! Looks like I got what I wanted!
 

Bigkrev

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,032
Way better than I expected, but this part in the play design article has me worried

Outlier cards aside, Throne of Eldraine is in range for our new normal as far as marquee set strength is concerned. It's on the high end of that range, but within it. Our hope is the power level of the coming sets are in the same league, and we do not intend to keep raising the power level of our marquee sets over time.
Depending on what you classify as "outlier" cards, Eldraine is an absurdly powerful set full of messed up things, and I think that if Oko wasn't in this set overshadowing everything else, we would be complaining about Fires, Lovestruck Beast, Questing Beast, Bonecrusher Giant, Guilded Goose (which may be an outlier card) etc.