I'm around #9700 with an estimate of "November 2019" - though I'm sure it had previously said mid-November. As I said, I haven't received an email update from them, it just turned up in the mail unexpectedly.
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Mcable "Classic" dongle
- Thread starter T002 Tyrant
- Start date
I got minimal difference with Pokemon. The filter doesn't work so well for that game, but it makes a big difference on Zelda and Fire Emblem.
I'm still making changes to my AV setup since I haven't been using consoles for a long time, but I ordered the cheapest 4x2 HDMI Matrix switcher I could find and it does exactly what I was hoping for with the mClassic:
A 2x2 HDMI matrix box should have been all that I needed, but all the devices I could find were actually HDMI switchers/splitters that duplicate the same input on both outputs, not true matrix switches which can send different inputs to each output.
With all devices going into an HDMI switch, everything can be routed into input 1 on the matrix switch. Inputs 2 & 3 are not used, since that would require switching both outputs.
If you don't need anything more than 1080p60 passthrough, older 4x2 matrix devices are not that expensive now; but you need a true matrix switch, not a "switcher/splitter".
It may not be ideal for all games, but switching resolution all the time is too much trouble.
It's a shame that consoles lack a "native res" output option, so that a game could switch the output to 720p if that's what it was actually rendering in.
A 2x2 HDMI matrix box should have been all that I needed, but all the devices I could find were actually HDMI switchers/splitters that duplicate the same input on both outputs, not true matrix switches which can send different inputs to each output.
With all devices going into an HDMI switch, everything can be routed into input 1 on the matrix switch. Inputs 2 & 3 are not used, since that would require switching both outputs.
- Input 1 is sent to both outputs 1 and 2.
- The mClassic is routed back into input 4 (though any would work).
- Switching output 1 between inputs 1 and 4 now toggles the mClassic processing on and off for all connected devices with a single command.
If you don't need anything more than 1080p60 passthrough, older 4x2 matrix devices are not that expensive now; but you need a true matrix switch, not a "switcher/splitter".
Since the Switch has games that render natively at 1080p when docked, I've been leaving it set to that.
It may not be ideal for all games, but switching resolution all the time is too much trouble.
It's a shame that consoles lack a "native res" output option, so that a game could switch the output to 720p if that's what it was actually rendering in.
This thing works great for PS3/XB360/WiiU and their 720p games. Even PS1/PS2 classics on PS3 and Wii games on WiiU (480p) get good improvements.
One great added benefit is that it takes a RGB limited signal like from the Wii U (that does not have an option to output RGB full) and makes it RGB full, which is great for me since I play games on computer monitors and some of them only support RGB full.
For the 1440p peeps, I did get a 1440p image on an Asus PG279Q (1440p) and Asus MG24UQ (4k).
One great added benefit is that it takes a RGB limited signal like from the Wii U (that does not have an option to output RGB full) and makes it RGB full, which is great for me since I play games on computer monitors and some of them only support RGB full.
For the 1440p peeps, I did get a 1440p image on an Asus PG279Q (1440p) and Asus MG24UQ (4k).
You know, I'm not actually sure what it's doing with the Wii U. It seems like it may not be affecting the levels, but fixing an EDID issue on the output instead?
I don't have the tools required to identify exactly what is happening, but something weird is definitely going on with the Wii U's output in general:
- When I try to capture the Wii U directly I'm getting bizarre results, like the console has its levels double-compressed to 30-218 rather than 0-255 or 16-235 (that washed-out capture is set to "partial" color range on the capture card).
- Capturing via the mClassic corrects it to 16-235; not 0-255 (card is still set to capture "partial" color range).
Even stranger: if I connect up the output to an HDMI splitter I still get these weird results from the Wii U when trying to capture it, with a direct connection using 30-218 and the mClassic using 16-235; but the picture on the TV remains unchanged with either. That's why I'm thinking it must be an EDID/metadata issue.
The output from the system or the mClassic is never 0-255 (full) for me though. It's only 30-218 (double-compressed) via a direct connection or 16-235 (limited) via the mClassic.
I have since found that the matrix splitter I bought doesn't like whatever the output is from the mClassic when it's upscaling 480p to 1080p via the Wii U either.
720p to 1080p works, and 480p to 1080p works via the Switch, but 480p from the Wii U results in a black screen when scaled to 1080p via the mClassic.
Unfortunately I have nothing to diagnose these issues, because none of the equipment I have here will tell me technical details of what format is being sent over HDMI.
I have a suspicion that the mClassic is dropping the chroma resolution, as many of the cheaper HDMI matrix switches state that only "RGB/YUV 4:4:4" is supported, and 4:2:2 is not (the one I bought does not specify) but I really have no way to tell.
At the same time, going through this splitter is allowing me to capture the output from the mClassic at higher resolutions. Still no 1440p, but I can get 1080p captures now instead of it dropping to 720x480.
I was also surprised to find that adding anti-aliasing to a 1080p game like Luigi's Mansion 3 is almost invisible on my 1080p TV.
My TV uses a VA panel which does weird things with its subpixels (as all VA panels do) and that seems to mask most of the effect. Meanwhile it's a very clear improvement on my 1440p IPS monitor; despite the sharpening artifacts. I wish the device only did anti-aliasing without any sharpening/contrast "enhancements".
The difference between the two seems most noticeable when the image is being upscaled, so it probably matters more for people with 4K TVs.
Direct capture, scaled 4x.
Please ignore the aliasing on the red backpack; that's because my card only captures 4:2:2, and OBS does not do proper chroma upsampling.
I don't use capture equipment nor do I have tools to properly measure the RGB levels, but all I know is this: my Wii U only outputs RGB limited, so if I hook it up (without mclassic) to a monitor that has the option to change between limited and full, I have to change it to limited to get the proper picture. And if I use my Wii U on a monitor that only supports rgb full, then the image is washed out. Now I put the mclassic into the mix, and I get proper non-washed out picture from the Wii U on my rgb full monitor. This is across multiple monitors I've tested.
Also works the same with my NES classic, which only outputs rgb limited, now works great on a rgb full only monitor. For PS3 and 360, I set it to rgb limited in their respective settings with the mclassic to connect to a rgb full monitor.
I'm gonna try the mclassic with a newer console (i.e. Switch, PS4) and see how it behaves with those now.
Also works the same with my NES classic, which only outputs rgb limited, now works great on a rgb full only monitor. For PS3 and 360, I set it to rgb limited in their respective settings with the mclassic to connect to a rgb full monitor.
I'm gonna try the mclassic with a newer console (i.e. Switch, PS4) and see how it behaves with those now.
Thats huge! I am considering on getting the USB version. Heard you have to set your switch to 720p for best results...Pokemon:
Nah, I set mine to 1080p.
Setting it to 720p looks blurry for me.
Thinking of getting this, but it's a whooping $25 of shipping to my country. Is this launching on regular shops, Amazon and all that later on?
The stock cable apparently won't do 4K. They recommend you don't use it.
Yes, I saw it on Amazon.com
I guess I'll wait to see if it appears on co.uk or .es
The mCable it's on those sites as I investigated.
mCable is the old version. mClassic is the new & improved device.
I believe the 4K support is only for bluray movie content that's played back at 24fps, and the mClassic will scale that to 4K 24fps. For the regular 60hz game signal, 1440p is the max it will be scaled to.
So if I use the stock Switch cable or a new one, the outcome is the same for games? 1440p?
No need for cable? I'm confused lol
Don't know if it's too late, but you do not need a new HDMI cable. This talk was going around when the mClassic launched, and I ended up contacting Marseille about it before my pre-order shipped -- a Marseille rep confirmed to me that they themselves use the standard Switch HDMI cable for all of their captures (even at 1440p). I've been using the standard cable since launch (on a 4K TV that doesn't support 1440p, like most) and still get the results you're supposed to get.
Related, this thing is great for Pokemon Sword and Shield -- looks super clean.
I'm really contemplating on buying this, especially with the 15% black friday sale.. Is it really worth it guys? I'm only going to use this on the Switch
I got my mClassic at launch for my Switch. My 4K TV doesn't have a 1440p mode, so I just leave it at 1080p.
I've noticed an improvement in image quality for a lot of 3D games. Nothing massive, but the image quality is cleaner. The games that get the biggest improvements, from what I noticed, are MUA3, FETH, DQXI S and Luigi's Mansion 3. BOTW looks better but not massively better.
I've noticed an improvement in image quality for a lot of 3D games. Nothing massive, but the image quality is cleaner. The games that get the biggest improvements, from what I noticed, are MUA3, FETH, DQXI S and Luigi's Mansion 3. BOTW looks better but not massively better.
Eh. Why not.
OP
OP
I just got a 4k TV, now with the right settings and adjustments Switch games can look great, but the mclassic is really making these games shine!
ordered one for delivery today, to try out on my Wii U for Wii and N64 backwards compat games (namely Skyward Sword and Paper Mario right now). Have an LG OLED 65" G7p from a couple years ago. Any tips are appreciated - for your info, I have all game systems going into one 4K HDR 4:4:4 switch to output to one HDMI. Wondering if I should just put the MClassic on the input of my TV. Systems:
Xbox One X
PS4
Switch
Wii U
NES/SNES classic
Don't want to mess with my 4K native resolution games much.
Xbox One X
PS4
Switch
Wii U
NES/SNES classic
Don't want to mess with my 4K native resolution games much.
Here are my tips for you:
- Switch - Leave it at the default 1080p output. Lowering it to 720p softens the image and lessens texture detail in lots of games, and even games that render closer to 720p natively look the same or even better if you let the Switch upscale it first to 1080p before the mClassic does its thing.
- Wii U - For Wii U games, feel free to use wither 720p or 1080p output. The majority of games on the Wii U were 720p at best, but there are a handful that rendered at native 1080p like Smash and Mario Kart. I'd say leave it on 1080p for Wii U games.
- Wii games on Wii U - This one is important. Set your Wii U's system output resolution to 480p before playing Wii games. This makes a HUGE difference because the mClassic is allowed to upscale that untouched native 480p image to 1080p cleanly, completely bypassing the Wii U's very poor Wii game scaling that introduces chroma artifacting, ringing, etc.
- Xbox One X and PS4 - Don't route these through the mClassic. It can't pass through HDR or 4K/60.
Thank you!!
ScOULaris I wonder if that 480p issue also applies to Wii U digital versions of Wii games, since it doesn't reboot into Wii menu?
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Wii U scales Wii game even if 480p -> 480p, doesn't it? I remember some RetroRGB comparisons.
No. If the Wii U is set to output at 480p then Wii games are not being scaled. There might still be a subtle sharpening filter being applied by the Wii U, however.
yeah it looks WAY better if you change the output to 480p and let the MClassic upscale. The annoyance is if you want to play Wii U games you have to take the 2 minutes it takes to navigate and change the options just to get it back to 1080p
Yeah, it's frustrating that it's so slow to change the video output options on the Wii U.
I've said it before, but I wish that consoles had a "native" output option instead of scaling everything to a fixed resolution.
I generally leave my Wii U set to 720p as that's what the majority of games used, and switch it to 480p for Wii games.
The new HDMI matrix switcher I ordered just arrived, and it does work with 480p, so that makes it a lot easier to do comparisons with Wii games now.
Switching is quite slow though, and I have to manually adjust the capture resolution each time, so it's still a laborious process.
Works well for just using the TV and being able to toggle the mClassic on/off via a remote though.
EDIT: It's this switcher: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MYRX22F/
I'm not convinced there isn't something in my setup adding lag though, but I'm currently running everything through a switcher, matrix switch, and then a splitter, and I don't have a latency tester to identify any potential causes.
It could just be that I haven't used my TV for a long time now, and it's worse than I'm used to.
You need to output 480p if you want the mClassic's image processing to work correctly. It won't do much at all if you output 1080p.
I'm not seeing a meaningful difference in overscan in my captures via HDMI, just a slight difference in where the image is positioned - with the 1080p output being pushed to the top of the screen.
What is noticeable though, is that outputting a 480p signal to the TV causes it to decode with BT.601 as intended, while outputting 1080p causes color to be decoded with BT.709 so it looks wrong.
It was good to see that sending the mClassic a 480p signal converts from 601 to 709, so colors look correct when it's handling the scaling to 1080p rather than the Wii U outputting 601 colors in a 709 output.
Here's a few captures for comparison. Endless Ocean 2, 480p output, mClassic off/on:
Another Code: R
480p output, mClassic off/on:
1080p output, mClassic off/on:
As you can see, the mClassic doesn't really do a lot when the output is set to 1080p.
I do wish that I had an original Wii with the WiiDual HDMI mod installed though, but I haven't been able to source a new white Wii system that is guaranteed to be compatible with it, and the costs of getting the system modded are high.
I also wish the mClassic's sharpening was optional. Its anti-aliasing can be effective, but there are better options for sharpening an image.
EDIT: Added captions to images.
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Yeah that makes sense, I was just confirming what Jegriva was asking about 480p Wii vs Wii U.
Some more Wii U captures.
Metroid Prime 2, 480p, mClassic off/on:
Unfortunately the view is constantly swimming about in Prime 2 so I wasn't able to get a 1:1 comparison.
Skyward Sword, 480p, mClassic off/on:
I don't know if the awful dithering in the sky is just how the game is, or if that's an artifact of running on the Wii U.
EDIT: Added captions to images.
Metroid Prime 2, 480p, mClassic off/on:
Unfortunately the view is constantly swimming about in Prime 2 so I wasn't able to get a 1:1 comparison.
Skyward Sword, 480p, mClassic off/on:
I don't know if the awful dithering in the sky is just how the game is, or if that's an artifact of running on the Wii U.
EDIT: Added captions to images.
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- Anything below 1080p will scale up to 1080p.
- 1080p will scale to 1440p.
- 1440p will scale to 4K.
I have been unable to get the mClassic to output 1440p either to my 3440x1440 monitor, or to my 4K capture card. It's possible that there is a way to force the upscaling with extra hardware, but I'm not that concerned about it.
1080p in / 1080p out still applies the anti-aliasing, as I've demonstrated in previous Luigi's Mansion 3 captures:
Some games on Switch are only rendering 720p, so it may be preferable to set the console's output to that when playing those games. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is one example of this, which I've been meaning to get captures of.
Overall I have mixed feelings about how the mClassic looks. The anti-aliasing can be effective, but sometimes ends up smoothing things over too much, and I dislike the sharpening it applies.
I feel that it still ends up mostly being an improvement though, particularly when viewed at TV distances - and especially when upscaled beyond 1080p (even if the mClassic is not doing the scaling).
This is highly dependent on your display's EDID information though.
- Anything below 1080p will scale up to 1080p.
- 1080p will scale to 1440p.
- 1440p will scale to 4K.
I have been unable to get the mClassic to output 1440p either to my 3440x1440 monitor, or to my 4K capture card. It's possible that there is a way to force the upscaling with extra hardware, but I'm not that concerned about it.
1080p in / 1080p out still applies the anti-aliasing, as I've demonstrated in previous Luigi's Mansion 3 captures:
Some games on Switch are only rendering 720p, so it may be preferable to set the console's output to that when playing those games. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is one example of this, which I've been meaning to get captures of.
Overall I have mixed feelings about how the mClassic looks. The anti-aliasing can be effective, but sometimes ends up smoothing things over too much, and I dislike the sharpening it applies.
I feel that it still ends up mostly being an improvement though, particularly when viewed at TV distances - and especially when upscaled beyond 1080p (even if the mClassic is not doing the scaling).
alright thanks
i got the mclassic mailed to me about two days ago and I tried to install it just now, but I'm having issues installing already. I'm getting a burry image on my tv. Anyone experience this? I did turn it on to the first green LED light after and its blurry.
Do I need an HDMI splitter for it to work on the Switch? This is something that should be addressed on the manual that comes with the cable. I couldn't even find any youtube videos on installing it on the switch. Am I the only one who had problems installing it on the Switch??
Do I need an HDMI splitter for it to work on the Switch? This is something that should be addressed on the manual that comes with the cable. I couldn't even find any youtube videos on installing it on the switch. Am I the only one who had problems installing it on the Switch??
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Use the included hdmi extension, don't try to shove the mclassic dongle directly into the dock. If you've got a mcable instead just buy a short HDMI extension from eBay or Amazon.
Yeah I just saw that... I re edited my message. I just noticed it still looks blurry/more pixelated even with the extension..
edit: Just noticed the display on my screen is reading 720 X 480 at 60fps and sound is turned off. WTF. When I plug it out it goes back to normal settings. I don't know why its doing this. I have my switch on HDMI 2 and it works fine without the mclassic when I do so.
Looks like someone from page 11 is experiencing this too:
This issue hasn't been addressed.
edit: I don't know I said it was working. It still hasn't. Customer support things hdmi cable is busted, even though it still works normally without mcclassic. I'm not going to buy another hdmi cable for this. I am ready to just return it at this point. Really frustrating. If I knew something like this would happen, I obviously wouldn't have gotten this
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Wow this really sucks. The mclassic just isn't working for me at all. I was going back at it with customer service for a week now and I still couldn't fix the 480p downscaling resolution issue. They though it was my HDMI cables, so I bought one from Amazon, and that wasn't the issue. Then they suspected the HDMI extender male female cable, and the replacement just came today, but I still has the same issue.
It's either the TV (an Auria brand 1080p tv close to 10 years old) or the mclassic itself. All I know is that I'm not going to spend an extra hundred dollars for another tv just to see this thing work. I'm really dissapointed and frustrated. I couldn't see anywhere in my TV settings for anything regarding scaling either.
I need to send this back.
It's either the TV (an Auria brand 1080p tv close to 10 years old) or the mclassic itself. All I know is that I'm not going to spend an extra hundred dollars for another tv just to see this thing work. I'm really dissapointed and frustrated. I couldn't see anywhere in my TV settings for anything regarding scaling either.
I need to send this back.
