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Mar 22, 2019
811
Going to tokyo in April for 9 days - literally trip of a lifetime for me.

Saved up for years and had booked biz class return and staying at the hilton in central tokyo...really nervous now especially as its all non flex so think im going to have to cancel as this is only going to get worse before better.

Are travel companies under any obligation to honor refund requests in special cases like a global pandemic?
 

Deleted member 33082

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 14, 2017
355
I just read on the newspaper a quote from the director of the italian hospital which tests people Maria Gismondo.
Her statement goes like this: "we are at a point where an infection which is slightly worse than an influenza is mistaken with a deadly pandemy. This is crazy."

Well, tbh she is right. This is no ebola or marburg.
Most of the infected have mild or even no symptoms. Sadly it's part of our society that only the (relatively) few dead get the most attention in the news. Bad news are 'good' news.
Should we be alarmed and cautious? Absolutely but lets calm down a bit. Do not forget the thousands who got well again.
She's not right, she's a moron and other experts in Italy called her out on that.

From what we know, some 10% of infected would require hospital care, or even ICU.

If that is true, and if the virus affects some 10% of the Italian population (similarly to the flu) that's 600k people needing intensive care. Italy doesn't even have that many hospital beds, let alone ICU units
 

Deleted member 4614

Oct 25, 2017
6,345
I'm certain, this is just gonna spread all over europe very soon. And i don't even know how to get ready for something like this...
Going to tokyo in April for 9 days - literally trip of a lifetime for me.

Saved up for years and had booked biz class return and staying at the hilton in central tokyo...really nervous now especially as its all non flex so think im going to have to cancel as this is only going to get worse before better.

Are travel companies under any obligation to honor refund requests in special cases like a global pandemic?

If you cancel, no.

If they cancel, depends on if you have travel insurance and what the terms say I'm guessing.

It's up to you, but IMO I would probably go on the trip unless you're traveling with other people who are seriously afraid.
 

Deleted member 2802

Community Resetter
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
33,729
Going to tokyo in April for 9 days - literally trip of a lifetime for me.

Saved up for years and had booked biz class return and staying at the hilton in central tokyo...really nervous now especially as its all non flex so think im going to have to cancel as this is only going to get worse before better.

Are travel companies under any obligation to honor refund requests in special cases like a global pandemic?
They will review them for sure.
If there are enough cancellations it makes more sense to just cancel the flight instead of sending a mostly empty plane.

Im sure there is an algorithm for that
 
Mar 29, 2018
7,078
So according to this... COVID19 is now in a Pandemic Phase

... see now that wasn't so hard
The problem is officially declaring a pandemic will have massive ramifications, for worse as well as better. Like it could tank the economy more as speculation goes rife, could cause widespread panic and panic-buying that isn't productive, could cause political problems, etc.

It's not a decision to be taken lightly. Thus, WHO are very careful about it. They know just how massive it is.
 

Xbox FanFest

Banned
Dec 30, 2019
369
The Costa Mesa facility was a ridiculously horrible choice for this purpose, it was mind boggling to those of us who live near it. It isn't even a true medical facility, it is an old, all but abandoned and unfurnished psychiatric care residence. It was recently deemed by the state as too dilapidated to serve as an emergency homeless shelter. Made no sense to transfer COVID-19 patients there "within days."
Did the judge overturn it? I hope so. Golf course there, home depot and all the rest. And today a girl got back to work who's been in SK for the last 10 days.

I'm already dead.
 

Kendrid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,133
Chicago, IL
Going to tokyo in April for 9 days - literally trip of a lifetime for me.

I would not cancel. April 9th is still a decent amount of time and we have no idea what is going to happen. Maybe it has slowed by then, or maybe we have a true pandemic and your trip is cancelled for you. In the later case I'd assume full refunds would be in order.

That being said, a coworker was supposed to go to Tokyo 3 weeks ago and he had non-refundable tickets. Our company has ban travel to all of Asia so he called and the airline refund him 100%.
 

Nlroh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
78
Was WHO this slow in 2009? By now it's clear that the virus can't be contained. I don't understand why they're still with their "potential pandemic" narrative.
 

DrewFu

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Apr 19, 2018
10,360
Was WHO this slow in 2009? By now it's clear that the virus can't be contained. I don't understand why they're still with their "potential pandemic" narrative.
I suppose it depends what you mean by contained. China's daily reported cases have plummeted over the last week.
 

Leeness

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,948
Well, it sounds like it wouldn't be called "pandemic" anyway as they don't use that word anymore. "Public Health Emergency of International Concern" is the term now.
 

Typhon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,167
I'm traveling to Dallas in a couple days, national flight. Would it be overly paranoid of me to wear a face mask in the airports?
 

Garchia3.0

Member
Dec 20, 2018
1,859
A general overview of where we're standing right now:

RpwhtHj.png
 

feline fury

Member
Dec 8, 2017
1,563
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/02/covid-vaccine/607000/

The Harvard epidemiology professor Marc Lipsitch is exacting in his diction, even for an epidemiologist. Twice in our conversation he started to say something, then paused and said, "Actually, let me start again." So it's striking when one of the points he wanted to get exactly right was this: "I think the likely outcome is that it will ultimately not be containable."
Lipsitch predicts that, within the coming year, some 40 to 70 percent of people around the world will be infected with the virus that causes COVID-19. But, he clarifies emphatically, this does not mean that all will have severe illnesses. "It's likely that many will have mild disease, or may be asymptomatic," he said. As with influenza, which is often life-threatening to people with chronic health conditions and of older age, most cases pass without medical care. (Overall, around 14 percent of people with influenza have no symptoms.)

Lipsitch is far from alone in his belief that this virus will continue to spread widely. The emerging consensus among epidemiologists is that the most likely outcome of this outbreak is a new seasonal disease—a fifth "endemic" coronavirus. With the other four, people are not known to develop long-lasting immunity. If this one follows suit, and if the disease continues to be as severe as it is now, "cold and flu season" could become "cold and flu and COVID-19 season."


At this point, it is not even known how many people are infected. As of Sunday, there have been 35 confirmed cases in the U.S., according to the World Health Organization. But Lipsitch's "very, very rough" estimate when we spoke a week ago (banking on "multiple assumptions piled on top of each other," he said) was that 100 or 200 people in the U.S. were infected. That's all it would take to seed the disease widely. The rate of spread would depend on how contagious the disease is in milder cases. On Friday, Chinese scientists reported in the medical journal JAMA an apparent case of asymptomatic spread of the virus, from a patient with a normal chest CT scan. The researchers concluded with stolid understatement that if this finding is not a bizarre abnormality, "the prevention of COVID-19 infection would prove challenging."
Good article from James Hamblin at The Atlantic
 

DrewFu

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Apr 19, 2018
10,360
edit: nvm
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
1,086
I'm traveling to Dallas in a couple days, national flight. Would it be overly paranoid of me to wear a face mask in the airports?
For what it's worth, I just flew nationally in the US into a major airport and there were maybe 2-3 people out of thousands who were wearing face masks. Not many people are wearing masks. Of course, if you're sick, you should wear a mask. The better thing for you to do, rather than wear a mask, is to take wipes with you and wipe down the seat/armrests/tray table.
 

DrewFu

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Apr 19, 2018
10,360
I really don't believe 40-70% of the world will get it within the year.
Yeah that number seems like complete and utter absurdity. Currently in China, it is has only affected roughly .00006% of their population (based on official numbers). Even if the actual number is much higher, the % is still infinitesimally small.

edit: as pointed out, it's .006%
 
Last edited:
Oct 27, 2017
1,710
I would not cancel. April 9th is still a decent amount of time and we have no idea what is going to happen. Maybe it has slowed by then, or maybe we have a true pandemic and your trip is cancelled for you. In the later case I'd assume full refunds would be in order.

That being said, a coworker was supposed to go to Tokyo 3 weeks ago and he had non-refundable tickets. Our company has ban travel to all of Asia so he called and the airline refund him 100%.

I am in the same boat have a trip planned and paid for april 26th - may 8th, im just waiting around, I figure worst case it gets cancelled due to the epidemic otherwise im still going.
 

Deleted member 2254

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,467
I am in the same boat have a trip planned and paid for april 26th - may 8th, im just waiting around, I figure worst case it gets cancelled due to the epidemic otherwise im still going.

A friend of mine from Hungary should be coming here in the middle of March, Milan out of all places, and we're supposed to watch a Serie A match in Milan. All of these things seem unlikely now.
 
May 26, 2018
24,129
User warned: Ignoring staff post with regard to fearmongering
40 to 70 percent of the population of the entire planet, with a 2-3 percent mortality rate, let's go with 2.5%...

If no one develops immunities, in a single year it's roughly equal to the casualties of World War 1 and 2 combined. That's absurdly catastrophic.

How in the fuck? That can't be right. Someone please correct this.
 

Deleted member 4614

Oct 25, 2017
6,345
40 to 70 percent of the population of the entire planet, with a 2-3 percent mortality rate, let's go with 2.5%...

If no one develops immunities, in a single year it's roughly equal to the casualties of World War 1 and 2 combined. That's absurdly catastrophic.

How in the fuck? That can't be right.

Just spitballing here, but 2% of the population isn't going to die even in the worst case.

If the news keeps getting worse and worse, people will isolate themselves and the spread will stop.
 
May 26, 2018
24,129
Just spitballing here, but 2% of the population isn't going to die even in the worst case.

If the news keeps getting worse and worse, people will isolate themselves and the spread will stop.

For total safety, that'd be on the order of a month straight of total isolation for everyone in the world, if you factor in the incubation period of 14-28 days and how long the virus lasts on solid surfaces (4-5 IIRC.) Humans would probably rather get sick and spread the virus slowly than subject themselves to planetary hermitdom.
 

DrewFu

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Apr 19, 2018
10,360
40 to 70 percent of the population of the entire planet, with a 2-3 percent mortality rate, let's go with 2.5%...

If no one develops immunities, in a single year it's roughly equal to the casualties of World War 1 and 2 combined. That's absurdly catastrophic.

How in the fuck? That can't be right. Someone please correct this.
Again, just based off the official numbers, it has only affected roughly .00006% of China's population. So 40-70% of the globe seems ludicrously dumb to me.

edit: as pointed out, it's .006%
 
Last edited:

Allard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,941
For total safety, that'd be on the order of a month straight of total isolation for everyone in the world, if you factor in the incubation period of 14-28 days and how long the virus lasts on solid surfaces (4-5 IIRC.) Humans would probably rather get sick and spread the virus slowly than subject themselves to planetary hermitdom.

We also don't know for sure if its 'reinfecting' or the virus is somehow lingering after the worst complications pass as a couple of those studies have shown from China. We also don't know how this virus, if its spreads uncontrollably (which I think it will after a point) will do each nations health infrastructure. The places showing lower rates at the moment might just be because each 'possible' infected are getting direct and immediate supervision for all things considered a smaller amount of cases. If it hits a point where literally everyone could get it what does that do to our infrastructure in getting the help people need? Hopefully a vaccine will be coming sooner then later, because from what it sounds like that is the only way to really mitigate the effect this could end up having on the populace.

Again, just based off the official numbers, it has only affected roughly .00006% of China's population. So 40-70% of the globe seems ludicrously dumb to me.

Swine Flu started out in a similar way and is now a seasonal virus that morphs so we have no 100% immunity to it, the only reason we don't talk about it as much as it turned out to be only slightly more fatal then the normal flu virus.
 

Kendrid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,133
Chicago, IL
Ah yes, do nothing.



WaPo last week: Trump has told advisers that he does not want the administration to do or say anything regarding the Coronavirus outbreak that would further spook the markets. He remains worried that any large-scale outbreak could hurt his reelection bid.
 

xMM4nsonx

Member
Nov 1, 2017
225
As someone with health issues and recent lung conditions those comments are hard to swallow.

I know. My uncle had a stomach cancer. And now he is in locked in his home. I've also grandpa and grandma with serious healt issues (ictus and
septicemia). I beg you pardon if my words hurted you. All the best for you: I hope you can stay safe.
 

Metalgus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,090
Which is why we, as a family, are slowly building a food reserve. NOT panic buying, but getting a little extra each time we shop. Should the worst happen, we can then avoid crowded supermarkets and towns and therefore help ourselves and others, by removing ourselves from likely infection routes, which works both ways. Living in rural Devon in the UK means the risk is very low, but why not take a few precautions 'just in case.'

i think Ill do that as well. Are you buying mainly canned goods or frozen items as well? Frozen is great, until power goes out. Though I wouldnt think an epidemic would result in power outage.Im on city drinking water so I might get a couple of 4 gallons (not too environnementaly friendly though).
 

Ryu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,316
Goes to show what interests Trump the most. Stock market is so overrated, it was better when only speculants were talking about it. It's a disaster that this shit has to be brought up every tweet. "But muh stock market". So absurd this world. I want to go back. No one would've cared about it.