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Deleted member 45211

User requested account closure
Banned
Jun 19, 2018
492
All four of these comedians have aged horribly, but Seinfeld probably the least so. Something to be said about being bland as hell I guess.
This is kinda backwards, if you're talking about the comedy. A lot of Seinfeld's bits, while I can appreciate them, assume a kind of everybody-is-fundamentally-the-same-deep-down-inside utopia. And if you're referring to him as a person, he's a firm believer in meritocracy, and that if there's a lack of diversity in comedy it's because the talent lies with white males.

Louis CK the person has "aged" the worst, since we found out he's assaulted women then called them liars and encouraged the destruction of their careers. But his comedy has aged the best -- he points out how women have shit much harder and are under constant threat of violence by men (guess he would know?); he was always quick to point out white privilege and make it a centerpiece in many bits; stopped using "f-" and "n-" slurs years ago; and much more.

I'm not advocating for "separating the artist from his work." But I am saying that if you showed these four comedians' work to young American urbanites who have never heard of them (ha, that's probably not as hard to do as it sounds) then CK's would be the least aged and Seinfeld would be the most.
 

crimsonECHIDNA

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,510
Florida
Didn't Jerry recently also say that comedy suffers as "political correctness" rises?

Or something akin to that?

I want to say he said that in context to not wanting to do stand up shows on college campuses. Which on one hand, does come across as old man yelling at young people but on the other "cancel culture" can go a little overboard at times.
 

Falconbox

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,600
Buffalo, NY
I want to say he said that in context to not wanting to do stand up shows on college campuses. Which on one hand, does come across as old man yelling at young people but on the other "cancel culture" can go a little overboard at times.

ah, that's what it was. Yeah, I'd imagine some campuses would be tough.

Though Jerry's comedy was never really risque or anything, and IIRC he usually refrained from cursing in general. He probably wouldn't face too many issues himself.
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,018
I guess it would be meaningful in how you decide to frame the conversation. If we're just talking about the so-called sacredness of comedy you can admit that the joke is funny and nothing else matters; I still find it so. If we're arguing about whether or not jokes can and should have ramifications that create lines in the sand, then it's a go-to example.
The ramifications part isn't a really a burden on comics the way some might think it is. It's a burden on someone like Chris because he's black, not because he's a comic. That argument isn't about really comedy at all, and it actually misses the point of what most comedians are doing when they take apart various subjects. The differences between these four guys is all about style. Jerry seems like the corny one because he works clean, but they all make the exact same observations, just in wildly different ways. There's even a point in that convo where Louis does one of Chris' old jokes in Jerry's style and it still works.
 

Deleted member 32561

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 11, 2017
3,831
It's from 2011, yes.
At the same time I've seen nothing to suggest CK or Gervais have changed their tune or will apologize. They're both still assholes, after all.
It's not my place to decide wrt Chris Rock if he's done something wrong, but... mmmmm....
 

8byte

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt-account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,880
Kansas
So is this the play now for celebrities? Dig up old footage and try to burn their careers?

Can't wait for some of you to see Raw or anything Richard Pryor did and make a thread about it.
 

Darksol

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,704
Japan
I loved that panel. And shows like The Green Room for that matter. Anytime there's comedians talking craft I'm happy. But this is quite ancient.
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
So is this the play now for celebrities? Dig up old footage and try to burn their careers?

Can't wait for some of you to see Raw or anything Richard Pryor did and make a thread about it.
Ah yes Louis CK will be ruined after this.
 

Kirbivore

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,935
TBF, Rock rescinded that bit and said he'd never do it again because he felt it gave white people an out.

SO COLOR ME SHOCKED TO SEE THIS SHIT.

I'm pretty sure this was after he was given shit by other black comedians (and Bill Cosby) from his infamous Black people hate black people more skit.
 

8byte

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt-account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,880
Kansas
Ah yes Louis CK will be ruined after this.

I mean i'm not talking about just him (and genuinely couldn't care less about him in particular).

Chris Rock, Kevin Heart, Chrissy Teagan, James Gunn...it just feels like every day we have a new thread about a new celebrity who said something shitty 5-10 years ago that flew under the radar, so now we want to hold them accountable and demand an apology. It's weird.

If they say something NOW...I'm all for it. But these crusades of trying to find any piece of media from the past of celebrities to start a movement just really doesn't feel like someone looking for justic. It looks like people with a beef trying to burn down someone's career. It's bizarre.

At the end of the day what does this accomplish? It's not like any of these people are suddenly going to become better humans because these things they said voluntarily got their second limelight under a new hashtag.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,314
Congrats on finding this super obscure comedy special that aired publicly on HBO and spread around the internet for years after the fact.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,990
Chris Rock coonin' it up shouldn't be surprising to me but I'm still surprised. That shit was painful to watch.

Nigga doesn't even flinch at the hard -er's coming from CK and Gervais.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,953
Houston
CK has been saying it for forever and a day how are people just now noticing?

Also people calling him white when got the half white part of his features showing and not his half Mexican side. Nikka didn't even speak English as his first language
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,764
CK has been saying it for forever and a day how are people just now noticing?
The contentious bit is that Chris Rock gave him and Gervais an out, not necessarily that CK said it. That bit is indeed also old.

Also people calling him white when got the half white part of his features showing and not his half Mexican side. Nikka didn't even speak English as his first language
Louis CK is a white man in this space and time.
 

Spinluck

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
28,528
Chicago
You know, I am not giving Chris a pass on this, but this entire thing where people dig deep into a person's past and rake them through the coals for shit that is done and over with is pretty pathetic. Looking at it on a case by case basis, there can be exceptions, but yes... Sometimes people miss the mark and fall short. These incidents whether isolated or sparse do not define a person...

If everyone had a camera on them 24/7 I am sure we can find things like this to judge them by and call them a hypocrite. This clip is old, but people are shocked it exists. Like yes, a person famous did some bullshit in the past. Move on.
 

Swab

Member
Oct 25, 2017
112
This is apalling... It's sad what passed for "comedy" years ago (and even today.) Just absolutely disgusting words and ideas bandied about, and they just brush it off with "it's just jokes" as if they aren't in a position to effectively communicate a message using humor that doesn't dehumanize people.
 

Benita

Banned
Aug 27, 2018
862
How the fuck is Rock catching more heat than Louis or Ricky for this?

Chris Rock can do and say whatever the fuck he wants when it comes to that word.
 

Nacho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,125
NYC
Woah, weird that this is resurfacing now. I remember back in the day watching this and specifically remember the dialogue online being completely different.

It comes off to me like 2 guys who know each other and are willing to push buttons. It's misguided for sure in the larger context of, well you're on a show and being broadcast.

For historical sake https://www./threads/talking-funny-hbo-show-with-gervais-seinfeld-rock-louis-ck.426619/
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,018
You know, I am not giving Chris a pass on this, but this entire thing where people dig deep into a person's past and rake them through the coals for shit that is done and over with is pretty pathetic. Looking at it on a case by case basis, there can be exceptions, but yes... Sometimes people miss the mark and fall short. These incidents whether isolated or sparse do not define a person...

If everyone had a camera on them 24/7 I am sure we can find things like this to judge them by and call them a hypocrite. This clip is old, but people are shocked it exists. Like yes, a person famous did some bullshit in the past. Move on.
I agree. The people who go digging for old dirt are only doing it in response to people who get caught doing new dirt. The agenda at play is transparent as fuck.
 

Kewlmyc

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
26,754
This is from like 8 years ago and is pretty well known.

Digging up old footage just to point at it and be shocked seems highly pointless. If this was from this year, sure, but almost a decade on a special that is readily available? This is the same shit that got Gunn fired.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,764
This clip is old, but people are shocked it exists.
Because Rock years before that apologized and nixed a routine where he said there's a difference between black people and niggers because it inadvertently gave white people a pass. If we didn't have that context, it would be an "Of course he'd do that" moment, completely unsurprising.

Note: I don't have a strong dog in this fight nor do I think Rock should apologize. Comedians gonna comedian. Just thought he would've learned by now. I also never saw the film.
 

Ukraine

Banned
Jun 1, 2018
2,182
That was a pretty good special. And I still think that Seinfeld is a fraud. ;) If not for Larry David that show would have been shit. And it aged way worse than this special.
 

16bitnova

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,702
I can understand why it may shock people, especially in todays world, but this just looks like friends talking shit.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,764
I guess I learned it is okay for Mexicans to say the n word.
It's also further weird to take a man who self-identifies as white and talks about the ills of white fragility and privilege and call him Mexican when it's convenient. Having "Obama is white too" flashbacks.
 

Sandfox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,743
Some folks have an issue with the word period. Even Snoop Dogg tried to start a movement back in the day by saying "Nephew" instead.
The issue people have seems to be more about Rock not getting angry and telling them to stop. Rock is getting called some very offensive things online with his "blackness" being questioned.
 

Deleted member 9100

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,076
That was a pretty good special. And I still think that Seinfeld is a fraud. ;) If not for Larry David that show would have been shit. And it aged way worse than this special.

Seinfeld the show aged worse than a special from a few years ago where white comedians toss around the N word?

Care to explain how?
 

IggyChooChoo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,230
Also people calling him white when got the half white part of his features showing and not his half Mexican side. Nikka didn't even speak English as his first language
IIRC, Louis CK's grandparents were from Hungary and immigrated to Mexico, so the Mexican half is also white. I don't believe he has any indigenous Mexican or Spanish ancestry, though he does have family there. Not that any of that really matters, but that's the context.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
20,764
The issue people have seems to be more about Rock not getting angry and telling them to stop.
Black folks have expectations amongst ourselves not to give white people an inch in racial matters. There is also the fact that Rock himself shelved a joke specifically because he recognized the harm in white people thinking they have the social clout to say the word. And then for some weird reason there he was years later having learned nothing at the time the film was made.
 

MidnightMania

Member
Oct 31, 2017
538
Chris Rock is trending now because of this video and people are dog piling on him. This video is what, 5-7 years old? The twitter outrage machine is at it again. I mean I get why the video and the conversation in it is getting criticized, but it's not like this got released yesterday. I don't get it.
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
Chris Rock is trending now because of this video and people are dog piling on him. This video is what, 5-7 years old? The twitter outrage machine is at it again. I mean I get why the video and the conversation in it is getting criticized, but it's not like this got released yesterday. I don't get it.
Shocking I know but not everyone is omniscient.
 

crimzonflame

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,770
There was a GAF thread made when this special came out and its weird that more people are outraged in this thread than the old one.
 

Nerokis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,571
Somehow Gervais' presence almost stands out more than Louie dropping the n-word. Do comedians actually like him? He comes across as a deeply insecure person who hides his sense of being a fraud in plain sight by being as loud and obnoxious as possible.

There was a GAF thread made when this special came out and its weird that more people are outraged in this thread than the old one.

For one thing, I'm not seeing a notable amount of outrage in this thread...?

For another, how would that be the slightest bit weird? People change, times change. I would hope that we'd be less receptive to racist and homophobic jokes today than yesterday.
 
Nov 1, 2017
655
So we're cool with this now but when Gunn can't make my Marvel movie we have a problem with digging up irrelevant shit out of context from years ago?
I think I hate the internet