Doctor Who: The Fifteenth Doctor |OT| Ncuti Stars (Season 1 debuts on May 10th/11th)
- Thread starter Dwebble
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Yeah, it seemed like a DELIBERATE choice to close the first "drop" of episodes with this one because of just how MUCH stronger it is than the premiere. Get 'em hooked, don't risk losing folks after the first episode.
Episode 1 was fun and all, but episode 2 really blows it away. Jinkx absolutely kills it as Maestro, the plot was nice, Ncuti continues to be an absolute joy as The Doctor, and it was real nice to see Ruby in a non baby related story. I totally see why they did the double episode drop because The Devil's Chord is the perfect way to tell someone if they'll like the show or not.
I wonder if they'll incorporate snow into every episode of the season and if so, I wonder if they'll manage to slip it in subtly going forward.
I wonder if they'll incorporate snow into every episode of the season and if so, I wonder if they'll manage to slip it in subtly going forward.
Space Babies was whatever. Fun fluff. Direction was quite stilted, but I imagine that was a difficult episode to navigate technically and logistically.
Devil's Chord was absolutely wonderful. Jinx was obviously a total blast. I'd said before the premise was giving me Adam West Batman vibes and it definitely made me think of the episode where Catwoman stole the voices of another British invasion band.
Ncuti and Millie are magic together. Great start to the season.
Right then. I've got work in four hours 😞
Devil's Chord was absolutely wonderful. Jinx was obviously a total blast. I'd said before the premise was giving me Adam West Batman vibes and it definitely made me think of the episode where Catwoman stole the voices of another British invasion band.
Ncuti and Millie are magic together. Great start to the season.
Right then. I've got work in four hours 😞
OP
OP
I am absolutely LIVING for RTD kicking off the big Disney+ push with one deliberately, pointedly childish episode and one that's quite simply the most gloriously bugshit episode to ever go out under the Doctor Who name.
He's not just back to play the hits!
He's not just back to play the hits!
Mmhhmm. "Safe" seems to be the last word you could use to describe this new era so far.
Yeah I don't think my opinion is gonna be too radical. Space Babies is a pretty weak premier. It's the kind of episode that would have been a perfectly acceptable "Episode 8" of the old 13 episode seasons. But as a premier of an 8 episode season, it didn't really land as well. Makes sense they put Church on here as a retroactive "Episode 1" and released Space Babies alongside Devils Chord. The talking babies was a bit too silly and looked terrible... like they didn't even come close to getting the babies to look like they fit what they were saying, so it was just a bunch of shots of babies looking confused and slightly upset while going "yay i love you". Weird. Ending the whole thing with the solution being "it's a snot monster" and "let's have the space station fart us to our destination" feels like we walked right back into the old Season One from 2005 and not in a good way.
But then the Devil's Chord was an absolute blast. Fun episode that contributed in a big way to the overall story of the season. Leaving us off on a much better note (heh).
But then the Devil's Chord was an absolute blast. Fun episode that contributed in a big way to the overall story of the season. Leaving us off on a much better note (heh).
Space Babies was just okay, but The Devil's Chord was genuinely fantastic. Maestro was such a great villain. They were the perfect mix of campy and menacing.
Overall a strong start to the season.
Overall a strong start to the season.
It really makes you think about the fact that Doctor Who villains, aside from the Master and most recently the Toymaker, are almost NEVER acting powerhouses. But Jinkx not only understood the assignment, she attacked it with a level of play that basically said "Yes, I am aware of Neil Patrick Harris. Yes, I am aware that my character is Neil Patrick Harris' child. And I am going to play this role like Neil Patrick Harris did about 300 pounds of unfiltered cocaine and mainlined five seasons of Drag Race without stopping to sleep."
I am so glad that Maestro took the Toymaker's intensity and went "OK, now let's theatre kid the shit out of this."
What a villain. I doubt we'll get another one as good as this for a while.
YES!!! You've said it perfectly! There's absolutely nothing quite like an incredibly over the top theatrical queer-coded villain! Helps that Ncuti and Millie give absolutely pitch perfect performances too. It's just so electric to watch!
I haven't really enjoyed Gatwa's episodes so far. I find them too silly with the singing goblins, talking babies and piano demon. I feel like Gatwa may be too young for the role or his type of energy. Matt Smith was younger but I bought his take of a tweed-dressed, sloppy haired professor stuck in a young man's body.
That's a shame. I hope you vibe with him more as the season goes on. I think the energy is a nice change of pace from Tennant, he feels like a "renewed" Doctor in a way we haven't really seen post-regeneration. He really seems like someone who just wants to be the universe's friend instead of their teacher.
Even if "Space Babies" was more middle-of-the-road than you would hope from a season opener it still had a lot to recommend for it. You get a very clear impression of who 15 is, it very pointedly calls out the hypocrisy of the modern pro-life movement, and honestly I love that the show isn't afraid to be a bit daft even when it's aiming for a wider audience.
"Devil's Chord", though... absolutely the right call to drop two episodes at once. Love how much of a feint all the Beatles stuff ended up being, with the episode much more establishing the new kind of stakes The Doctor is up against post Toymaker. Part of why I love the revival era of DW is how often you get crackerjack performances and Devil's Chord was full of them. Jinkx obviously arrived fully formed but Ncuti and Millie completely held their own. 15's panic to eventual resolve was extremely well done; loved everything in the ruined 2024 and then the tete a tete in the darkened void.
Finally (and this is a small thing), I am SO HAPPY there are still "next time" teasers at the end of the episode!
"Devil's Chord", though... absolutely the right call to drop two episodes at once. Love how much of a feint all the Beatles stuff ended up being, with the episode much more establishing the new kind of stakes The Doctor is up against post Toymaker. Part of why I love the revival era of DW is how often you get crackerjack performances and Devil's Chord was full of them. Jinkx obviously arrived fully formed but Ncuti and Millie completely held their own. 15's panic to eventual resolve was extremely well done; loved everything in the ruined 2024 and then the tete a tete in the darkened void.
Finally (and this is a small thing), I am SO HAPPY there are still "next time" teasers at the end of the episode!
Thinking about it since watching, and I feel Space Babies works best if viewed as an episode 2 like The End of the World in Series 1 (2005) especially since BBC/Disney have made the Christmas Special the defacto first episode for the season now in their listings on iPlayer/Disney+.
Crossposting my thoughts from Gallifrey Base:
Struggled to get through this one. Ncuti and Millie are... fine, I guess? They're not lacking in enthusiasm, but I'm not really feeling either of them yet. I feel like if you trained an AI on Davies' episodes and then asked it to generate you a Doctor and companion duo, 15 and Ruby are what you'd get.
As for everything else... well, it wasn't really for me. The story was a bit twee for my tastes, and perhaps hinged a little too much of how cute you find the titular space babies; I weep to think of the money spent on those uncanny-ass CG mouths. The repetition of so many Davies-era tropes certainly didn't help, but that's an old fan problem I suppose.
I also kinda feel like the Doctor/Companion relationship is on fast-forward; they're already incredibly touchy-feely and chummy for two episodes in.
Production design was nice, though I can't say I'm seeing the Disney money yet.
Struggled to get through this one. Ncuti and Millie are... fine, I guess? They're not lacking in enthusiasm, but I'm not really feeling either of them yet. I feel like if you trained an AI on Davies' episodes and then asked it to generate you a Doctor and companion duo, 15 and Ruby are what you'd get.
As for everything else... well, it wasn't really for me. The story was a bit twee for my tastes, and perhaps hinged a little too much of how cute you find the titular space babies; I weep to think of the money spent on those uncanny-ass CG mouths. The repetition of so many Davies-era tropes certainly didn't help, but that's an old fan problem I suppose.
I also kinda feel like the Doctor/Companion relationship is on fast-forward; they're already incredibly touchy-feely and chummy for two episodes in.
Production design was nice, though I can't say I'm seeing the Disney money yet.
"Space Babies" felt like a mid-season filler ep. Weird choice to open with.
"The Devil's Chord" was amazing and has me eager to see where this series is going.
What's the deal with Ruby's mother and the Doctor? Are there more villains in the Toymaker/Maestro pantheon coming? And most importantly, why does everyone keep breaking the fourth wall?
"The Devil's Chord" was amazing and has me eager to see where this series is going.
What's the deal with Ruby's mother and the Doctor? Are there more villains in the Toymaker/Maestro pantheon coming? And most importantly, why does everyone keep breaking the fourth wall?
I think Space Babies is gonna be the divisive one. It's a very...kid-friendly episode, and with the bad CGI on the babies, it's probably going to be a particularly YMMV episode for older Who fans.
Also, did I catch the implication that six months have passed between Space Babies and Devil's Chord? Space Babies still took place on Christmas, but the Doctor and Ruby said that it was June 2024 in the next episode.
Six months. They have already been on plenty of adventures for the expanded universe to fill in.
I hated most of space babies, i thought devils chord was fine but really didnt need the song and dance.
I think ncuti is very OTT which really started to get annoying with how cartoonish the episodes were, i think he would be ok if the episodes themselves werent so OTT so ill leave judgement on him until the season is done.
Millie was fine but its just another 21st century lass thats extraordinary, seriously why cant they change it up like the older shows did or even jodies doctor did, they were still 21st century but they were a good mix and not special.
Also i really dont like the new intro or theme, but i really like mccoys and the movie theme best anyway.Minor nitpick but it adds to the whole not really feeling it so far.
I think ncuti is very OTT which really started to get annoying with how cartoonish the episodes were, i think he would be ok if the episodes themselves werent so OTT so ill leave judgement on him until the season is done.
Millie was fine but its just another 21st century lass thats extraordinary, seriously why cant they change it up like the older shows did or even jodies doctor did, they were still 21st century but they were a good mix and not special.
Also i really dont like the new intro or theme, but i really like mccoys and the movie theme best anyway.Minor nitpick but it adds to the whole not really feeling it so far.
I did think they felt a little too close for their second adventure. Specifically Ruby saying "you never hide", felt weird.
Conspiracy theory time but I wonder if the episodes were re-arranged from the original intent. Looking at the directors, Julie Anne Robinson did 1 and 3. Dylan Holmes Williams did 4 and 5. Jamie Donoughue did 7 and 8. But Ben Chessell did... 2 and 6. His episodes are the only ones that aren't next to each other (well him and Julie Anne's, whose WOULD be if Ben's were next to each other as well). And Ben's other episode, Rogue... is gonna air in June.
My theory, until proven otherwise, is that The Devil's Chord was originally meant to be either before or after Rogue but was moved up to have a bigger episode early and tease more of the mystery earlier on.
Really enjoying Ncuti as The Doctor but neither of the episodes hit the spot for me. The second was a huge improvement on the first but tonally it was all over the place and for me not in a good way. Curious to see where the overall arc is going though
Next episode looks interesting.
Next episode looks interesting.
What an episode Devil's Chord was. Dayum. Show firing on all thrusters. And Moffat next week? Hope he brings his A-Game -- if he does, Doctor Who is back.
(Also, has Gallifrey Base always been this miserable?)
(Also, has Gallifrey Base always been this miserable?)
I joined sometime around 2004, and the answer is yes.
I enjoyed both episodes. I liked episode 2 quite a bit more then the first. I appreciated the fact that the villain felt really fresh. Looking forward to more. :)
I thought Space Babies was decent, but I've also seen the entire revived series and am already well-acquainted with Who's eccentricity. I'm not sure it was the best choice to try and onboard a new audience. RTD waited until like episode 5 for the Slitheen in 2005, but I guess at least this just had one fart joke instead of two whole episodes... Ncuti and Millie have great chemistry and I loved that we're already seeing more personality from 15 in the way he relished scaring the babies and teasing Ruby for falling in the snot.
Devil's Chord was fantastic, I don't have much to add that hasn't already been said. Jinkx absolutely crushed it. The song was... not great but I can forgive it because the choreography and editing were quite good lol.
Devil's Chord was fantastic, I don't have much to add that hasn't already been said. Jinkx absolutely crushed it. The song was... not great but I can forgive it because the choreography and editing were quite good lol.
The flip side is, to an audience in 2005, starting with the Autons was incredibly brave in its own way, because although they were "iconic" to the elderly who remember them with nostalgia, to the new young audience the show so desperately needed to win over they ran an extremely high risk of underlining and backing up the 'show with wobbly sets and men in crap plastic suits' reputation that was so damaging to the show in the late 80s and in the wilderness years, when Doctor Who was just a punchline. I remember reading at the time, "the music is cartoony, the autons look terrible, the mickey duplicate stuff is silly, modern audiences will not take to this!!!" at the time. With hindsight, 'Rose' is an all-time classic.
I think fans worry too much about this stuff and project too much in terms of projecting their fears about the show being too camp or whatever onto more general audiences, honestly
A great example of this is I've seen a lot of fans bellyaching over the baby lip flap being uncanny, but my wife watched it and didn't nitpick it, and my mum phoned and said she thought it was amazing how they made it look like the babies could talk! And they're good examples, I think, of the sort of audience that matters. Us fans, nitpicks and all, will be here anyway.
I saw a few people complaining that The Devils Chord has too much straight up magic and fourth wall breaks. But I do think that's going to be a recurring theme. The "invoked a superstition at the edge of the universe" in Wild Blue Yonder led to magical beings like the Toymaker showing up. And there's a lot of talk about the Doctor learning the language in Church on Ruby Road. The Doctor is deliberately out of his element here.
It's 100% going to be the theme of the season I think RTD even said as much. It's an element of unknown to even the Doctor.
This definitely raises the stakes for The Doctor. When The Doctor said "I can't fight this" I just rolled my eyes because it's episode 2 and he'd dealt with far worse… Until we found out Maestro was the daughter of the Toymaker and what appears to be a God-type being in the remade universe.
His fear was based on the fact that Maestro crawled out the piano and did "the giggle" from the giggle which made him believe Maestro was the toymaker. It was 100% the right call for him to say that.
I would possibly watch from the anniversary specials last year since a villain is referenced from them in episode 2… Other than that you should be good
