''It's about ethics tho."
Edit: also, lmao it didn't take long for him to show his true colors. People didn't need to look very far.
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Escapist: How Do We Finally Talk About Ethics?
- Thread starter Giolon
- Start date
''It's about ethics tho."
Edit: also, lmao it didn't take long for him to show his true colors. People didn't need to look very far.
isn't it it funny how almost everyone correctly intuited what he was all about when he first relaunched the escapist with the whole dumb "we're leaving politics at the door" thing. it's almost as if dog whistles exist.
i mean even if he actually weren't using gamergate dogwhistles (which he is absolutely doing here) the article is still breathtakingly ignorant and self-important.
game outlets are always talking about ethical issues, consumer rights, and everything that GG used as a smokescreen to cover their reactionary ideology. the reason they don't use the phrase "ethics in game journalism" is specifically because that's so deeply tied to GG, which has absolutely nothing to do with real ethical concerns.
so marching in and loudly declaring "IT'S TIME TO TALK ABOUT ETHICS, PEOPLE" while addressing no real ethical concerns that aren't in the conversation is either the most tone-deaf and clumsy faux pas of all time or an extremely transparent call to arms for actual nazis.
game outlets are always talking about ethical issues, consumer rights, and everything that GG used as a smokescreen to cover their reactionary ideology. the reason they don't use the phrase "ethics in game journalism" is specifically because that's so deeply tied to GG, which has absolutely nothing to do with real ethical concerns.
so marching in and loudly declaring "IT'S TIME TO TALK ABOUT ETHICS, PEOPLE" while addressing no real ethical concerns that aren't in the conversation is either the most tone-deaf and clumsy faux pas of all time or an extremely transparent call to arms for actual nazis.
There was never a fundamental problem with games journalism as a whole & GG was always BS. They may have believed in their own BS but it doesn't change the fact that GG were never the reasonable ones or the ones on the right side of history. They were always the army of gross assholes. BTW is Yahtzee still associated with The Escapist? He was one of the only things I ever liked about that site but then I grew up. His repeated use of the r-word (and stuff of that nature) and his angry gamer shtick got really old.
Now if we want to talk about ethics in journalism, lets talk about Fox News...
Now if we want to talk about ethics in journalism, lets talk about Fox News...
My wife is a nurse and that is a stressful job. This attitude from someone who, lets be honest, makes a career out of writing about toys, is going to be pretty insulting to a lot of people.
GG revealed that there's a major problem in the ethics within gaming culture (basically, large numbers of gamers have none) - journalism was never a problem worthy of any kind of "movement".
You could excuse the initial article of "your a dumbass but at least I can get how you thought this was a good idea", but the doubling and tripling down... my only theory is that he thinks Escapist is going under, and he has seen how well alt-right dipshits have done on crowdfunding (before patreon deplatformed them), and said "man, this could be my financial future" or something
Oh my bad. Didn't realize he voluntarily resigned to shield Eurogamer. Still, that makes the other publication who threatened to sue when Rab's criticism was legit the one to blame.
And since that article's publishing in 2012, that other games journalist has done more than enough to redeem himself.
My point was that legitimate criticism can be turned on its head and used by bad actors with an ulterior motive as Rab himself had later professed.
How you talk about ethics is you talk about it. Like what happened during the Mucin thing, for instance.
How you don't talk about ethics is you talk about a misogynistic harassment campaign.
Gamergate has zero positive value or redeeming qualities. So when talking about it, suggesting it wasn't all bad, or leaving room for ambiguity, is a failure.
Oh he's now effectively...not exactly doubled down, rather dug down, because he wasn't antagonizing GG targets in the article.
...
I don't understand why he's doing any of this. He has now pissed off basically everyone. Why?
He quite vigorously told Gamergate to fuck off in the article, and now he's done the same to people they hurt.
I don't know whose side he thinks he's on, but I doubt many are on his.
Like...good luck with your website, dude.
Again, I don't understand what the fuck he's doing. I am slightly more flabbergasted than anything else.
How you don't talk about ethics is you talk about a misogynistic harassment campaign.
Gamergate has zero positive value or redeeming qualities. So when talking about it, suggesting it wasn't all bad, or leaving room for ambiguity, is a failure.
Oh he's now effectively...not exactly doubled down, rather dug down, because he wasn't antagonizing GG targets in the article.
...
I don't understand why he's doing any of this. He has now pissed off basically everyone. Why?
He quite vigorously told Gamergate to fuck off in the article, and now he's done the same to people they hurt.
I don't know whose side he thinks he's on, but I doubt many are on his.
Like...good luck with your website, dude.
Again, I don't understand what the fuck he's doing. I am slightly more flabbergasted than anything else.
The whole idea of it being about 'criticism' and 'ethics' was always bullshit because there's always been issues about the cosy relationship between critics/journalists have had with subjects; this isn't suddenly magically new to gaming of all fucking places a world that as far as consumed entertainment and art is concerned is barely a zygote.
You've had developers/distributors and even console manufacturers punishing critics and all that shit barely makes it out of insider circles, perks of good reviews where we just joke about intentionally sabotaged reviews about editors now, etc. It's even morphed since GG with the popularity of paid streamer shills and you know what they do?
*shrug*
But throw in even a fucking SNIFF of something that deviates from the bro norm and suddenly its 'THEY ARE TAKING OVER OUR GAMES'.
Im all for journalistic integrity; imho its a basic of a fundamental society. But lets not fool ourselves that this has anything to do with it; its the absolute ANTITHESIS of journalistic integrity which is why honest journos were the first ones to catch sniper bullets when GG started.
And what's disgusting is now we've gone a full 360 where purveyors of such disingenuous bigotry trying to come back around and try to sell us on supposed real integrity for fucking clicks (when they happily played in the bigoted muck for those same clicks before). Worst human beings, scum of the earth.
You've had developers/distributors and even console manufacturers punishing critics and all that shit barely makes it out of insider circles, perks of good reviews where we just joke about intentionally sabotaged reviews about editors now, etc. It's even morphed since GG with the popularity of paid streamer shills and you know what they do?
*shrug*
But throw in even a fucking SNIFF of something that deviates from the bro norm and suddenly its 'THEY ARE TAKING OVER OUR GAMES'.
Im all for journalistic integrity; imho its a basic of a fundamental society. But lets not fool ourselves that this has anything to do with it; its the absolute ANTITHESIS of journalistic integrity which is why honest journos were the first ones to catch sniper bullets when GG started.
And what's disgusting is now we've gone a full 360 where purveyors of such disingenuous bigotry trying to come back around and try to sell us on supposed real integrity for fucking clicks (when they happily played in the bigoted muck for those same clicks before). Worst human beings, scum of the earth.
Oh what a surprise from the guy running the Escapist and promising "politics free video games journalism"
I for one am shocked
There's a lot of bad stuff in this article, but this part really stuck out to me as being particularly incendiary and unsubstantiated:
Is this actually a thing that's ever been shown to happen with a legitimate publication? I can't think of anything. The Gerstmann thing wasn't even that, since that was "ad campaign money" instead of "for a code". This seems like a pretty incendiary accusation, caked in a "well maybe it happens I dunnnoooooo",and then he specifically calls out anyone that got a Kingdom Hearts 3 early code as being possibly guilty of this.
I think it's certainly possible that early codes get strategically given to outlets that are more likely to review something well over ones that have shown no interest, but that's just the publisher doing its research. Suggesting that they're specifically getting clandestine assurances from reviewers about scores before handing a code over is an entirely different thing. And would actually be an ethical/legal issue, but also despite GG shit heads doing their damnedest to find any possible hint of this, I don't remember it ever coming up.
Is this actually a thing that's ever been shown to happen with a legitimate publication? I can't think of anything. The Gerstmann thing wasn't even that, since that was "ad campaign money" instead of "for a code". This seems like a pretty incendiary accusation, caked in a "well maybe it happens I dunnnoooooo",and then he specifically calls out anyone that got a Kingdom Hearts 3 early code as being possibly guilty of this.
I think it's certainly possible that early codes get strategically given to outlets that are more likely to review something well over ones that have shown no interest, but that's just the publisher doing its research. Suggesting that they're specifically getting clandestine assurances from reviewers about scores before handing a code over is an entirely different thing. And would actually be an ethical/legal issue, but also despite GG shit heads doing their damnedest to find any possible hint of this, I don't remember it ever coming up.
Is this sudden heel turn about Ethics because TheQuartering broke the news about Apex Legends and the entire gaming media ignored TheQuartering while Pitts complained on twitter about how they were outscooped. Cause that was funny
So from all the heavily reactionary takes on this, should I assume that we also think Bob Chipman is a GGer, too, since he was heavily involved in this Escapist revamp? Cuz it seems like we're tar-and-feathering the whole lot of them ITT because of a single bad take.
Holy shit this fucking dude!
Oops.
I agree with you 100% but wanted to add that the kind of people who get riled up by a review score not being to their liking are generally idiots with nothing worthwhile to say anyway
It's not like it's reasonable people getting upset because of a number. You have to come from a place of being unreasonable to be emotionally invested in a products aggregate score
it's not a single bad take. it's a pattern of behavior. and his tantrum this morning has removed all doubt.
it was a garbage take. he imploded because his bullshit was called out. he sucks.
Pitt's has always been pro-gamergate as far back as his vox days. There should be no surprise here.
Apparently he wrote a book that had some gross stuff? Sadly the links are dead, but they're described. Even the old place had a thread that talked about how terrible it was.
My bad, so we're tar-and-feathering all involved with the Escapist redux because one person involved in it is going off on a predictable tangent. Fairer assessment?
I would think a normal person would just apologize, but this guy just keeps digging.
The article read like it was written by some sophomore student up at 3AM writing an essay on a novel they skimmed a week ago, honestly.
Russ Pitts is owner and editor-in-chief of the Escapist relaunch. Every stupid thing he says and does in relation to his work on the site reflects poorly on everyone associated with it.
Since that was never about ethics it's not really an elephant in the room.
Star Wars Battlefront 2 is a really great example honestly about how video game media reported on the microtransactions to the future consumers to the point where the publisher changed their mind prior to release due to the negative response.
Unsupported anecdotes and insinuations, odd ones without examples of when these things supposedly happened, and it also sounds like a self correcting problem given that as he mentions it breaks the trust of the audience. In fact when it does it's called out like that one IGN Dead Cells review which was highly reported on! And pissed off other IGN employees because it made them look bad by mere association. I gotta say it look real bad when an Editor In Chief makes it seem normal that those things happen when it's the EIC's job to try to make sure those things don't happen.
Man, it's almost like those things he mentions in the article have been reported on and followed by video game journalists for years, like when Kotaku put up an article exposing the sexist practices at a major developer which caused them to actually institute changes.
Like just about every video game website out there you can just talk about them. It turns out that other journalists have managed to actually discuss problems with the industry over the last 5 years.
Seems weird that the article is complaining about not being able to discuss a topic that others in his field are able to do. Maybe it's a personal flaw.
People really shouldn't use a Twitter account when they're passionate about something, it always turns to garbage.
Don't voice your opinion within a limited number of characters on a very superficial platform if you really care about one of your standpoints.
(But I have to side with the person using Buffy in their name, that shows taste, understanding of the importance of certain media, and foresight. And I'm only half kidding.)
Don't voice your opinion within a limited number of characters on a very superficial platform if you really care about one of your standpoints.
(But I have to side with the person using Buffy in their name, that shows taste, understanding of the importance of certain media, and foresight. And I'm only half kidding.)
what? he wrote an entire article expressing his garbage opinion. on a the site he runs.
I doubt that in the context presented. It was literally their calling card. "It's about ethics in game journalism" is a phrase now where any permutation imaginable calls back to the very existence of GG and would, with or without a disclaimer of GG itself, be subject to doubt as a dog whistle.
This feels like the only way to win is not to play kind of thing. People are more concerned about harassment than a conversation about the conversation surrounding ethics. That said, bringing up specific issues without invoking GG does work and has been working, just not addressing them in a general sense. "Gamers rise up" and all that.
Alright, so Moviebob is a dirtbag at best and a GGer at worst, according to this thread. Now I know.
No one here is saying that he is.
But being part of a site run by Russ, who is clearly clueless, isn't a good look.
the escapist was an explicitly pro-gamergate site. then Russ takes over with a transparent "no politics" strategy. it doesn't take a genius to see that dogwhistle for what it is. I have no sympathy for anyone who willingly signed up for that nonsense.
Yeah, and after that he starts being completely stupid on Twitter, so now I can't take him seriously anymore.
I don't think his take was complete garbage, maybe it was questionable, or ripe for discussion, but now it's a joke.
Bad move, and unnessesary.
When do we actually fail as a community to call out ethical issues?
We're talking about crunch.
We're talking about IGN fails.
We're talking about Epic.
We never fail to call shit out. Ever. There are too many of us. But we can do it without bringing GG back, or shitting on women.
edit: I would go further -- the community actually talks about things even the "journalist" community doesn't. Case in point: Remember what happened with Good Old Games and CDPR? Remember the transphobia? Remember how we had people here shedding their accounts, and calling it out, and spreading that news? Remember how almost nobody in the journalism side said anything because they were worried about their Cyberpunk coverage?
Yeah, I remember that.
In case I am not being clear with what I'm saying: acting like ethics wasn't being handled before GG, and that is isn't being discussed now, is an attempt to drum up support for what GG is by bringing it up. Jason is 100% right: this is nothing more than a dog whistle.
We're talking about crunch.
We're talking about IGN fails.
We're talking about Epic.
We never fail to call shit out. Ever. There are too many of us. But we can do it without bringing GG back, or shitting on women.
edit: I would go further -- the community actually talks about things even the "journalist" community doesn't. Case in point: Remember what happened with Good Old Games and CDPR? Remember the transphobia? Remember how we had people here shedding their accounts, and calling it out, and spreading that news? Remember how almost nobody in the journalism side said anything because they were worried about their Cyberpunk coverage?
Yeah, I remember that.
In case I am not being clear with what I'm saying: acting like ethics wasn't being handled before GG, and that is isn't being discussed now, is an attempt to drum up support for what GG is by bringing it up. Jason is 100% right: this is nothing more than a dog whistle.
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it's dead fucking simple. Zoe Quinn's ex was mad about their breakup so he started a harassment campaign to hurt her.
No, it's really really not. Also, a note: the appearance of bias =/= bias. It's rather difficult to look at a group that engaged in a harassment campaign against women and LGBT industry figures with cold objectivity, so perhaps don't discount what you've read and heard because people react appropriately to what GG is.
Proven wrong by the post directly beneath you. That's gotta suck.
