Final Fantasy XVI: The Rising Tide releases April 18, 2024

Rutger · Apr 18, 2024

Aside from the name of the spell being Raise, I got everything about Ultima's plan just from what he said, I don't think you need to look at the active time lore.

But I guess if it's confusing to some, then that justifies the existence of the mechanic.

Zebesian-X said:
Ultima is fine in concept, it's his characterization that sinks it for me. Him and Barnabas are total snoozers

I liked them both. They're wholly selfish and cowardly and nicely contrast with the themes Clive faces.

Phendrift · Apr 18, 2024

Holundrian said:
Wonder what people now run to with the ending as stated remaining unchanged for their cope of trying to pretend against all rhyme or reason that FF16 wasn't a complete game on release. Still the weirdest insane take I've seen pushed in some of the 16 discussions with people even throwing the "Yoshi P should apologize for lying(prematurely for the not changed ending) xD and people bitter because he was "smug" in their eyes about 16 being a complete work".

I mean games ALWAYS have cut content that we'll never find anything about, so it's understandable if they didn't have time to put Leviathan in, but the game did a pretty bad job at covering up that she was planned to be in. I can't blame people for noting the irony between the pretty blatant cut content that resurfaced as DLC and Yoshida's comment lol. Calling it an incomplete game is dumb, but it *is* a pretty funny situation imo.

I don't think it was malicious intentions or anything, in fact it's cool that they were able to bring back stuff that couldn't make it in the base game for DLC. Leaving stuff on the cutting room floor happens all the time in game development, it just usually… isn't as obvious as Leviathan in XVI lol.

DarthKamen · Apr 18, 2024

I will say that, as someone who never looked into the ATL, I also understood Ultima's plan pretty well.

My bigger issue is Barnabas' backstory being locked into the ATL...

(I also like Barnabas far more than I should, and don't hate Ultima...I just think he's done better in other FF games.)

MrTharne · Apr 18, 2024

Goddam just saw a weapon :

Tonberry Knife. They finally added a weapon with more Stagger than Attack, why they didn't lean into that for different weapons in the base game was behond me. Can't wait to see if it speeds up the stagger bar a lot.

Worldshaker · Apr 18, 2024

Knocked out the DLC this morning, and all I have left to do is the Kairos Gate. Really solid DLC, and the new powers are really fun.

I read someone say it's really difficult and makes you understand and master the battle mechanics. I'm excited to jump in this weekend.

Lumination · Apr 18, 2024

Ultima was fine. I liked having a villain that actively affected things and showed up once in a while over your typical "meet me in 60hrs" kind of thing. It's not new, just less common.

Barnabas felt like a waste. Dude got into the very first political sequence just to feel like filler by the end. I should've been excited to explore Ash. Instead, it was all mobs on a grey landscape instead of anything I loved about how the plot had been progressing.

Chaserjoey · Apr 18, 2024

Goodbye Final Fantasy XVI!

Worldshaker · Apr 18, 2024

Chaserjoey said:
Goodbye Final Fantasy XVI!

You're a beast!! Congrats! How hard was the Kairos Gate?

DarthKamen · Apr 18, 2024

Barnabas could have been so much more, I REALLY wish he was more present (I'd have cut Kupka and had Barny be a more present rival)...but I have a stupid weakness for preachy religious type villains, so Barnabas speaks to me. He also has cool edgelord armor, and a charismatic partner in Sleipnir.

Lumination said:
Barnabas felt like a waste. Dude got into the very first political sequence just to feel like filler by the end. I should've been excited to explore Ash. Instead, it was all mobs on a grey landscape instead of anything I loved about how the plot had been progressing.

I really wanted to talk to the people of Ash about their thoughts on their king, their religion, all of that.

Holundrian · Apr 18, 2024

Phendrift said:
I mean games ALWAYS have cut content that we'll never find anything about, so it's understandable if they didn't have time to put Leviathan in, but the game did a pretty bad job at covering up that she was planned to be in. I can't blame people for noting the irony between the pretty blatant cut content that resurfaced as DLC and Yoshida's comment lol. Calling it an incomplete game is dumb, but it *is* a pretty funny situation imo.

I don't think it was malicious intentions or anything, in fact it's cool that they were able to bring back stuff that couldn't make it in the base game for DLC. Leaving stuff on the cutting room floor happens all the time in game development, it just usually… isn't as obvious as Leviathan in XVI lol.

I mean that's not the argument people have been making which they hinged on the ending changing being the proof that the game was incomplete.

Very blatant DLC hooks that can turn into something later though aren't really anything new, like we all are expecting ER DLC to give us something on Miquella and that's been the first assumption of where it would go for people that finished ER. That's basically the same as Leviathan obviousness. Sometimes nothing happens with these things too like with Tomoe in Sekiro.

DLC just has many different shapes and forms and I'm not really gonna try argue against whatever everyone's personal value evaluation is for any given DLC.
But I dunno I think there is a very clear difference the dlc in this game was not used to patch up a game that needed it. It is extra for people that wanted more.
Vs games where many parts don't even make any real sense because of the omission and then having the gal of selling you the thing that fills the gap.

Chaserjoey · Apr 18, 2024

Worldshaker said:
You're a beast!! Congrats! How hard was the Kairos Gate?

I used the timely accessories to make it a bit easier, but it provided a decent challenge. Worst bit was trying to regain health.

I mainly just kept all of the healing stuff going between circles and focused on upgrading it's potential and increasing my defence and eikon stats with the "permanent" enhancements.

Lumination · Apr 18, 2024

So is it one medal of valor for Omega and one for Levi?

BladeX · Apr 18, 2024

Chaserjoey said:
I used the timely accessories to make it a bit easier, but it provided a decent challenge. Worst bit was trying to regain health.

I mainly just kept all of the healing stuff going between circles and focused on upgrading it's potential and increasing my defence and eikon stats with the "permanent" enhancements.

What difficulty did you play it at?
Also can it be done on easier difficulties if it becomes a hassle for someone with limited time and such?

Chaserjoey · Apr 18, 2024

BladeX said:
What difficulty did you play it at?
Also can it be done on easier difficulties if it becomes a hassle for someone with limited time and such?

I did it in final fantasy mode. Did not see any way to change the difficulty.

Hasney · Apr 18, 2024

How am I supposed to beat the time when I have to press the attack? I'm not getting hit, using all my cooldowns and even shooting when I'm running back, but I'm not doing enough damage quick enough.

Quinton · Apr 18, 2024

Warrior of Light said:
After spending so much time with the characters, I want to know what happens.

I agree with everything you said. But this hits on my thoughts most of all. Just wanted to shine a brighter light on the sentence. I'm with you on your rankings of VII and XVI, too! (Though I did put IX above VII in a list somewhat recently. Look, it's complicated...)

Worldshaker · Apr 18, 2024

Chaserjoey said:
I used the timely accessories to make it a bit easier, but it provided a decent challenge. Worst bit was trying to regain health.

I mainly just kept all of the healing stuff going between circles and focused on upgrading it's potential and increasing my defence and eikon stats with the "permanent" enhancements.

Oh cool!

Chaserjoey said:
I used the timely accessories to make it a bit easier, but it provided a decent challenge. Worst bit was trying to regain health.

I mainly just kept all of the healing stuff going between circles and focused on upgrading it's potential and increasing my defence and eikon stats with the "permanent" enhancements.

Good to know! I used the Timely accessories on a few fights so it's good to know they're accessable in the Gate. I thought they looked you out of everything, but I guess not.

YorkshireDaveUK · Apr 18, 2024

Do both dlcs slot in nicely with a first playthrough? I think I got halfway in the base game and stopped.

Lil Bee · Apr 18, 2024

YorkshireDaveUK said:
Do both dlcs slot in nicely with a first playthrough? I think I got halfway in the base game and stopped.

The first DLC I know requires completing (character spoilers) Joshua and Jill's questlines and being right before the point of no return. Unsure about the second DLC. But, yes, I think they would slot in nicely as pre-point of no return content.

Hasney · Apr 18, 2024

Hasney said:
How am I supposed to beat the time when I have to press the attack? I'm not getting hit, using all my cooldowns and even shooting when I'm running back, but I'm not doing enough damage quick enough.

Done it. I think I might just be underlevelled at 92 in Final Fantasy difficulty. But I got through it, just got the countdown to One

Kazhar · Apr 18, 2024

So, does Jill get some screentime in this? During the pre-release period Yoshi-P said her fans would be pleased but I've not read anything mentioning her so far. (outside of added party banter)

Agni Kai · Apr 18, 2024

Chaserjoey said:
Goodbye Final Fantasy XVI!

Goddamn. Congrats!

Socivol · Apr 18, 2024

YorkshireDaveUK said:
Do both dlcs slot in nicely with a first playthrough? I think I got halfway in the base game and stopped.

They really do and I kind of wish I got to experience the entire package. The Echoes Dungeon is kind of like the final dungeon of the game. I haven't finished Rising Tide yet but it seems to slot in after Echoes with some of the reference Clive has made.

Spehornoob · Apr 18, 2024

Rutger said:
I liked them both. They're wholly selfish and cowardly and nicely contrast with the themes Clive faces.

Ah, a fellow Ultima enjoyer. There are dozens of us. Dozens!

DinkyBox · Apr 18, 2024

YorkshireDaveUK said:
Do both dlcs slot in nicely with a first playthrough? I think I got halfway in the base game and stopped.

You have to unlocked the last minute mission in the base game and completed a small series of side quests to get access to the DLC segments. I think it works both before and after the completion of the last base mission

Hero · Apr 18, 2024

Wound up watching Audrey's stream of the DLC. Leviathan fight looked great and the Eikon for Clive is fun and inventive, definitely feel like every one was supposed to have a unique weapon for Clive originally that got scrapped at some point.

Kazhar said:
So, does Jill get some screentime in this? During the pre-release period Yoshi-P said her fans would be pleased but I've not read anything mentioning her so far. (outside of added party banter)

Minimal, sadly.

No Depth · Apr 18, 2024

11gb? Hmm…that's like 1/3rd a Stettar Blade!

Ryengeku · Apr 18, 2024

What a time to be alive.

Linus815 · Apr 18, 2024

Hasney said:
How am I supposed to beat the time when I have to press the attack? I'm not getting hit, using all my cooldowns and even shooting when I'm running back, but I'm not doing enough damage quick enough.

im so fucking confused, im playing on normal, level 53 and im struggling lol, even with perfect combos

Brodo Baggins · Apr 18, 2024

Holundrian said:
Wonder what people now run to with the ending as stated remaining unchanged for their cope of trying to pretend against all rhyme or reason that FF16 wasn't a complete game on release. Still the weirdest insane take I've seen pushed in some of the 16 discussions with people even throwing the "Yoshi P should apologize for lying(prematurely for the not changed ending) xD and people bitter because he was "smug" in their eyes about 16 being a complete work".

I mean... Leviathan being missing with a very distinct landmass on the map was enough for the game to have obvious major cuts to the main story. That they could bring these two DLCs within a year of launch clearly shows they were being worked on before the game launched.

I am overall fine with it and still think it's a good game, but I think for me this game was still too unambitious and disjointed in many respects for the devs to be tooting their own horn on how scoped and complete it is multiple times.

Holundrian · Apr 18, 2024

Brodo Baggins said:
I mean... Leviathan being missing with a very distinct landmass on the map was enough for the game to have obvious major cuts to the main story. That they could bring these two DLCs within a year of launch clearly shows they were being worked on before the game launched.

I am overall fine with it and still think it's a good game, but I think for me this game was still too unambitious and disjointed in many respects for the devs to be tooting their own horn on how scoped and complete it is multiple times.

Well I guess here I have it answered now that the ending has not changed guess the new argument is DLC content adding meaningful stuff shows it was all cut in the first place xD. Hysterical. Very clearly this all only applies to 16 as well vs other games that have done the exact same.
The amount of goalpost moving just so some people can tell themselves 16 wasn't a complete game on release *shrug*.

Rod · Apr 18, 2024

I gotta say, Clive is one of the coolest character designs I've ever seen. It just hit the perfect spot, not over or underdone.

It's noticeable how it prolly went like 4 or 5 polishing/refining/augmenting phases until the team was 100% satisfied with the design, and it shows.

I get it why people would be frustrated with the ending, maybe it's not even about the world, alot want to see more from Clive.

Socivol · Apr 18, 2024

Ryengeku said:
What a time to be alive.

We really are eating as Final Fantasy fans.

J 0 E · Apr 18, 2024

Ryengeku said:
What a time to be alive.

All while enjoying the recently released FF7 Rebirth 👌

oty · Apr 18, 2024

Spehornoob said:
Ah, a fellow Ultima enjoyer. There are dozens of us. Dozens!

hey, i like ultima. mostly because he has a top5 coolest leitmotif of all villains in the franchise

Brodo Baggins · Apr 18, 2024

Holundrian said:
Well I guess here I have it answered now that the ending has not changed guess the new argument is DLC content adding meaningful stuff shows it was all cut in the first place xD. Hysterical. Very clearly this all only applies to 16 as well vs other games that have done the exact same.

I don't think this is a "new argument" I never really thought the ending would change. It's not moving the goalposts you're talking to multiple people on the internet who have differing opinions. For me it's more about how they pitched their marketing around the game being totally done, they don't plan to do DLC, etc. It's just a straight up fabrication of the truth. They were ALWAYS going to DLC unless the game bombed hard.

Again it's whatever the game wasn't incomplete or anything I just dislike that marketing bend, and yeah I don't like it when other games do the same thing.

Final Fantasy 16: There Are Currently No Plans For DLC

But the team is interested in returning to Valisthea.

www.gameinformer.com

ChaserX · Apr 18, 2024

That Timekeeper fight was intense as hell.

Chri5t · Apr 18, 2024

Ryengeku said:
What a time to be alive.

Ellie, we really are the Final Fantasy.

Hero · Apr 18, 2024

Brodo Baggins said:
I don't think this is a "new argument" I never really thought the ending would change. It's not moving the goalposts you're talking to multiple people on the internet who have differing opinions. For me it's more about how they pitched their marketing around the game being totally done, they don't plan to do DLC, etc. It's just a straight up fabrication of the truth. They were ALWAYS going to DLC unless the game bombed hard.

Again it's whatever the game wasn't incomplete or anything I just dislike that marketing bend, and yeah I don't like it when other games do the same thing.

Final Fantasy 16: There Are Currently No Plans For DLC

But the team is interested in returning to Valisthea.

www.gameinformer.com

DLC is almost always planned ahead of time, just like how Takahashi was originally going to have Torna in base XC2 but relegated it to be its own stand alone DLC to do it justice. I like Yoshi P but some of his public comments/interviews were really weird surrounding XVI like dunking on XV when he nows fully well the history of that game and most of the series in that era.

Hasney · Apr 18, 2024

Linus815 said:
im so fucking confused, im playing on normal, level 53 and im struggling lol, even with perfect combos

Hit Spitfitre as soon as it starts, then rush in by holding circle, hit the other cooldown and combo, then just repeat.

ChocoBuddy · Apr 18, 2024

Brodo Baggins said:
I don't think this is a "new argument" I never really thought the ending would change. It's not moving the goalposts you're talking to multiple people on the internet who have differing opinions. For me it's more about how they pitched their marketing around the game being totally done, they don't plan to do DLC, etc. It's just a straight up fabrication of the truth. They were ALWAYS going to DLC unless the game bombed hard.

Again it's whatever the game wasn't incomplete or anything I just dislike that marketing bend, and yeah I don't like it when other games do the same thing.

Final Fantasy 16: There Are Currently No Plans For DLC

But the team is interested in returning to Valisthea.

www.gameinformer.com

The article you mentioned even says itself what you mentioned, from YoshiP's mouth. I don't think it's unreasonable that maybe they floated ideas in pre-production for DLC, but didn't want to confirm anything unless there was demand.

I just don't see why it needs to be a fabrication at all, it seems par for the course for what any developer says pre launch. What would be the benefit of them lying about this?

MrTharne · Apr 18, 2024

Leviathan fight :

I don't understand how to win, I reach him as fast as possible after getting blown away, I don't miss any cancel into magic, I use the two abilities on cooldown and I still can't kill the shield...

Brodo Baggins · Apr 18, 2024

ChocoBuddy said:
The article you mentioned even says itself what you mentioned, from YoshiP's mouth. I don't think it's unreasonable that maybe they floated ideas in pre-production for DLC, but didn't want to confirm anything unless there was demand.

I just don't see why it needs to be a fabrication at all, it seems par for the course for what any developer says pre launch. What would be the benefit of them lying about this?

The benefit of them lying about it is that they get people to buy in day 1. There was a clear negative sentiment around how FFXV handled their DLC both externally (for good reason) and internally (this is pure speculation based on Tabata leaving, and the DLC being ingloriously cancelled), so it was pretty obvious from how they were marketing the game they were trying to avoid this perception repeatedly saying it was scoped years ahead of launch, playable end to end a full year ahead of launch, no day 1 patch that they were trying to put on airs of the game being so complete and so ready.

I still bought, played and enjoyed the game, and am also playing this DLC, but I just find those developer comments to be lame.

Hero · Apr 18, 2024

ChocoBuddy said:
The article you mentioned even says itself what you mentioned, from YoshiP's mouth. I don't think it's unreasonable that maybe they floated ideas in pre-production for DLC, but didn't want to confirm anything unless there was demand.

I just don't see why it needs to be a fabrication at all, it seems par for the course for what any developer says pre launch. What would be the benefit of them lying about this?

Do you think they didn't work on the DLC at all until after XVI shipped?

Linus815 · Apr 18, 2024

MrTharne said:
Leviathan fight :

I don't understand how to win, I reach him as fast as possible after getting blown away, I don't miss any cancel into magic, I use the two abilities on cooldown and I still can't kill the shield...

Honestly it feels bugged for some of us? I just passed it but I literally had to play PERFECTLY. immediately used triangle skill, use perfect windups on the square skill, and keep hitting the magic burst combos.

MrTharne · Apr 18, 2024

Hasney said:
Hit Spitfitre as soon as it starts, then rush in by holding circle, hit the other cooldown and combo, then just repeat.

Thanks, I didn't use Spitflare at the start since I thought that it wouldn't reach him, the CD came back at "One" and I activated ZA WARUDO and won. (I also think the shield ability need to be used for the 4 Orbs to remove the charge time and still get the max damage from it to gain uptime on melee combo.)
Had no heal left and 5% HP, feels good.

Lant_War · Apr 18, 2024

PlanetSmasher said:
The reason I say it ruins the story is because Ultima's entire plan is "get Mythos to absorb all the Eikons" and then Clive doesn't absorb all the Eikons. And the game never addresses or even points this out. Clive literally does not have all of Ultima's powers at the end of the story. It's a genuine plot hole, not a CinemaSins-level plot hole.

And now this DLC lets Clive get that missing piece of power and the game doesn't address that change at all either.

When you unfreeze Leviathan, Ultima says its power wasn't needed for his objective. So the plan wasn't "absorb all the Eikons", just absorb enough to cast the spell

Astral · Apr 18, 2024

Even in the main story, Ultima never says he needs to absorb every single Eikon I'm pretty sure. It's just an easy assumption to make.

Linus815 · Apr 18, 2024

Hot take, but leviathan was probably the weakest eikon fight of them all. Still fun, but that first phase in particular was actually pretty bad. Got better after.

ChocoBuddy · Apr 18, 2024

Brodo Baggins said:
The benefit of them lying about it is that they get people to buy in day 1. There was a clear negative sentiment around how FFXV handled their DLC both externally (for good reason) and internally (this is pure speculation based on Tabata leaving, and the DLC being ingloriously cancelled), so it was pretty obvious from how they were marketing the game they were trying to avoid this perception repeatedly saying it was scoped years ahead of launch, playable end to end a full year ahead of launch, no day 1 patch that they were trying to put on airs of the game being so complete and so ready.

I still bought, played and enjoyed the game, and am also playing this DLC, but I just find those developer comments to be lame.

So they lied about waiting to see if there was an interest in DLC before announcing they were making it, in order to not scare off people who would potentially be turned off by the idea of Final Fantasy DLC after XV? This implies a level of post XV paranoia that I just don't think I'm willing to buy into, especially considering how well it did.

I think its more likely they didn't want to announce DLC prematurely because they weren't sure if the game was going to be successful since its already a risky venture as an FF game.

Hero said:
Do you think they didn't work on the DLC at all until after XVI shipped?

This isn't how it works anywhere, for the most part, so I don't get your point.

Leviathan, specifically, likely already had some dev time allocated to it anyway since they couldn't include it in the base game due to time constraints.

Final Fantasy XVI: The Rising Tide releases April 18, 2024

Keeper of the White Materia

Keeper of the White Materia

Keeper of the White Materia

Keeper of the White Materia

Keeper of the White Materia

One Winged Slayer

Specialist at TheGamer / Reviewer at RPG Site

One Winged Slayer

One Winged Slayer

One Winged Slayer

One Winged Slayer

One Winged Slayer

Classic Anus Game