Don't think that's a hot take tbh, I'd maybe put it over Garuda but it's clearly a lower-budget fight.
Final Fantasy XVI: The Rising Tide releases April 18, 2024
- Thread starter --R
- Start date
So you agree that they were working on DLC when the interview took place, which they flat out said there were no plans for it, and that doesn't strike you as dishonest at worst and disingenuously cheeky at best?
try to cancel only the last attack of the combo with magic and not between the other attack. so 4 basic attacks and then the magic finisher. After doing it like that I had no trouble finishing before the time was up anymore
Yoshida also said before launch they had an 18 month plan to increase sales of the game. It's pretty obvious now this is DLC followed by a PC launch even when they were also stating they had no plans for DLC.
Square Enix Has An 18 Month Post-Launch Plan To Increase Final Fantasy XVI Sales
Square Enix has an 18 month post-launch plan to increase the sales of its latest entry in its long-running RPG series, Final Fantasy XVI.
twistedvoxel.com
It's whatever you have your opinion and I have mine. The way they marketed it irked me before and after launch. I'm totally fine with what they delivered I just dislike the way they presented it.
Plenty of projects get scrapped while they are in development. Why would he come out and fully say "yeah we're also working on DLC!" before release with no indication of if the game is going to perform well.
I think it's a risk averse statement made by, at the end of the day, a business man who wants mitigate potential risk for his company. I don't see the value of reading the literal words they are saying any more cynically than that.
I just don't get your point of view where Final Fantasy XVI had any risk of selling poorly enough for them to scrap DLC mid development.
Something about his final line so sure of himself that Clive will fail, that even as he lies there dieing he's just incapable of accepting that he could be wrong, makes him feel real. I get if people don't like the presentation of him, but thematically he's a perfect foil to Clive, as well as the game's environmental messages.
I'm not gonna put him in the highest tier of my favorite FF villains, but I do really like how it all comes together the more I think about it.
There is risk when you put anything out, it's impossible to always predict what you sell. Look at Rebirth, I doubt they expected it to potentially sell less than XVI. A new FF game appealing to character action crowds is plenty risky on its own, at least to me.
Besides risk aversion is always preemptive, if XVI sold terribly and not within their expectations, I don't think we get two DLC episodes as we are now, whether they were in development or not.
Hm, I expected a little more. The new enviroment was gorgeous and some of the fights were great. I wish Tonberries were more dangerous though. but the story was pretty anemic and the side quests are basically the exact same structure as in the main game so they were eh as well
felt like this couldve been a good opportunity to put a little more focus on some party members like Jill, but... its pretty much the same as ever.
glad that the first trailer song got used though, what a banger
felt like this couldve been a good opportunity to put a little more focus on some party members like Jill, but... its pretty much the same as ever.
glad that the first trailer song got used though, what a banger
I really want to like Bahamut Wings ability but I feel like I'm not doing anything at all when I try to use it in battles. The enemies don't attack enough (at least the ones along the way to the town in expansion) for dodging to matter. I know they changed it so the activation also dodges so maybe you just use it for a dodge move now? I was trying to get the trophy to use it 3 times in a battle to charge up a charge but the enemies rarely attack. Maybe I'm used to Rebirths super aggressive enemies lol
You can force enemies to attack with taunt, which helps a lot, but I mostly use it as a dodge now and it feels really good. 4 dodges and you're guaranteed to have max.
Nope, this is how it works, even in Devil May Cry the enemies stand around you begging for your best combo. XVI just went too far that side unfortunately.
It's a bit better in FF Mode but still too passive.
Wow, it looks incredibleMysidia is so fucking gorgeous lmfao. PS6 looking game
Ultima's final moments are fantastic. He basically just says "yeah well fuck you Clive." He is so fucking petty. A complete and total narcissistic asshole. He's a freaky alien and yet acts so human. That's the irony of it.
You can use taunt to get trash enemies to attack, but I've found Bahamut most useful against large enemies and bosses who have combos.
Ultima is Elon Musk/Mark Zuckerberg/Every other freakazoid billionaire. Sets up the system to serve himself, justifies it in long-winded platitudes and diatribes that don't mean anything, and is ultimately petty alien weirdo completely unable or unwilling to understand anything other than his own desires. I love him.
The best part of the DLC is new Eikonic abilities to make combos with, and Bloody Palace. The stories for both of the DLC's sucked noodles and felt pointless due to the ending. Sadly can't really say they elevated the game to higher status. As far as Character-Action games go W101 is still king for me, and Bayonetta 3's gameplay still destroys XVI's...
I just can't understand how the development of this game ended up feeling so conflicted with itself. Once second it's copying XIV's quest structure and putting me to sleep... the next it's full on Platinum/Capcom spectacle and combos. The tonal whiplash this game suffers from makes it very hard to replay... luckily they've added Bloody Palace, and that quick complete sidequest thing. The overworld of this game feels so pointless at times.
Anyways, love Leviathan, and the secret Eikon, more combo potential is always nice. The actual expansion was very mid for me, but I didn't really enjoy the main game outside of its high points. I also dislike the marketing around the game. The level cap being constantly brought up also felt like a copy of marketing regarding XIV's expansions (the level cap literally doesn't matter in this game)
I just can't understand how the development of this game ended up feeling so conflicted with itself. Once second it's copying XIV's quest structure and putting me to sleep... the next it's full on Platinum/Capcom spectacle and combos. The tonal whiplash this game suffers from makes it very hard to replay... luckily they've added Bloody Palace, and that quick complete sidequest thing. The overworld of this game feels so pointless at times.
Anyways, love Leviathan, and the secret Eikon, more combo potential is always nice. The actual expansion was very mid for me, but I didn't really enjoy the main game outside of its high points. I also dislike the marketing around the game. The level cap being constantly brought up also felt like a copy of marketing regarding XIV's expansions (the level cap literally doesn't matter in this game)
I really want a post mortem on at what point in development Platinum was brought on and to what extent. More than likely the Eikon fights but I feel like they could have helped immensely with everything else surrounding the battle system for Clive and the pacing of the story/power-ups.
Selling okay-ish and selling to the point of disaster are two different things. I don't agree that there was any way they weren't going to release the XVI DLC considering XVI (and Rebirth) are the lowest selling debuts of the franchise. This is the same company that threw all hands on deck to redo XIV 1.0 and continued supporting Avengers long after that game was beyond salvaging.
The Rising Tide's story is pretty okay. Not quite what I was hoping for, but not bad at all, IMO.
I'm glad the expansion pass exists. It adds some good meat to the bones of FFXVI's endgame stretch all-around.
I'm glad the expansion pass exists. It adds some good meat to the bones of FFXVI's endgame stretch all-around.
The "Accept the Truth" moment always gets better the more I think about it, because the refusal of it is so central to all the villains. All of them look to someone else to tell them what to do or to give them something to blame, and then Clive and Ultima are the natural conclusions to that, either accept your mistakes and try to better yourself, or double down until you're left all alone.
Those aren't good examples. Ones a live service and the other is an MMO. Even if you have a bad launch, you can turn around and turn it into a constant earner. XIV is keeping SE afloat right now, I might be a little hyperbolic but the point stands.
I don't see SE doing the same for a single player release that drops and does poorly, at all. It just doesn't make sense to me, but we can agree to disagree.
Clive even says the latter to Ultima, that he "turned his back on them". I think it's pretty strong writing overall, the contrast they give each other.
I think Ultima is cool, I just wish he was present in the story more beyond the mustache twirling he does now. Like having him around more physically and being less "beyond" everyone else if that makes sense.
yup. a god who made humans in his "image", so it may very well be that this god, aka ultima, is also an asshole just like so many of us. so simple yet so good
I really love how they went with "just make the player feel busted at all times" with this freaking game. Leviathan does a shocking amount of damage, and that dodge is insanely great at disengaging to recharge just to jump back in and start hydrating the fuck outta fools. Deluge(the machine gun skill) and Abyssal Tear(the hovering orb) are insane, in that one absolutely demolishes the stagger bar, and the other at max strength feels like it hits as hard as some ultimates. This, coupled with the recent buffs, and now Ultima's new Eikonic abilities, and I feel like I'm playing with action replay or something.
Really love how the side quests have given meaningful rewards in this DLC. It was my biggest problems with the quests in the base game. In Rising Tides, I felt like I was actually getting meaningful rewards that reflected in the gameplay. Gonna start pouring some time into the Kairos Gate now, but man did I miss this game.
Will say, the new Eikons definitely make you wish that the older ones had unique weapons that changes your moveset. It's such a cool way to make the Eikons feel more distinct and flesh out your abilities a bit more, and I'd have loved to see a mock blackmage with Ramuh, or a mock Dragoon with Bahamut.
Really love how the side quests have given meaningful rewards in this DLC. It was my biggest problems with the quests in the base game. In Rising Tides, I felt like I was actually getting meaningful rewards that reflected in the gameplay. Gonna start pouring some time into the Kairos Gate now, but man did I miss this game.
Will say, the new Eikons definitely make you wish that the older ones had unique weapons that changes your moveset. It's such a cool way to make the Eikons feel more distinct and flesh out your abilities a bit more, and I'd have loved to see a mock blackmage with Ramuh, or a mock Dragoon with Bahamut.
Honestly the further I get away from it, part of my dislike for XVI's story was just it not being what I thought it was gonna be. I really, really thought it was gonna be more political intrigue than it ended up being going by what they were saying and how it looked in marketing.
Like, XVI becomes like any other classic FF - small-time stuff escalating to cosmic/godlike forces by the end - which I normally LOVE, but it was just harder to appreciate when I thought we were getting something else.
I'm expecting the latter part of the story to age better on a replay in the future, as I really do see where a lot of people on this page are coming from wrt Ultima and I'll appreciate it for what it is over what it isn't, but I think I'll always be a little disappointed that FF GOT didn't pan out fully like I wanted it to. And even with that, I think there will always be some missed potential with characters like Benedikta, Jill, and Hugo
Like, XVI becomes like any other classic FF - small-time stuff escalating to cosmic/godlike forces by the end - which I normally LOVE, but it was just harder to appreciate when I thought we were getting something else.
I'm expecting the latter part of the story to age better on a replay in the future, as I really do see where a lot of people on this page are coming from wrt Ultima and I'll appreciate it for what it is over what it isn't, but I think I'll always be a little disappointed that FF GOT didn't pan out fully like I wanted it to. And even with that, I think there will always be some missed potential with characters like Benedikta, Jill, and Hugo
As someone that really didn't like XVI and sort of disliked it more and more each time I thought about it after finishing it but was open to having their mind changed (the DLC for XB3 basically saved the game for me), this DLC kinda just reinforces my belief that CBU3 has no fucking idea what they're doing half the time and underscores how much garbage a lot of XVI's game design is.
Very very briefly I was optimistic. The start of the DLC features some somewhat amusing party banter. For a brief moment, it seems like things will be different.
Except they're not different, it's all the same shit with a new coat of paint. On the way to the town I saw what I thought would be an optional cave, except no, it's blocked by a bunch of bushes. Dunno why I was getting my hopes up.
I'm walking down hallways collecting pinches of beaver ass or some such nonsense for a crafting system I'm never going to use. I'm doing sidequests where a minimal amount of information is conveyed in the most smarmy self-interested and boated verbose out the ass manner and then I go pick up some flowers or kill some enemy I've fought before. All the random world big enemies I've seen are just palette swaps all over again. The cutscenes direction is notably worse than the base game and the sidequests somehow are too. The + icon ones here just seem to be to unlock features you already had that the game took away. I'm unlocking crafting recipes for gear that's weaker that stuff I already have. I'm getting items to sell for gil when I already have gil out the ass.
The Omega DLC gets you into the dungeon relatively quickly and you get a succession of unique bosses albeit with some copy past shit in between, but here it feels like they doubled down on the bad version of XVI but just with a prettier skybox.
As for leviathan's powers, I now just mash triangle to end any random encounter and the rift thing is kinda cool, but its just another example of a bunch of powers that feel very functionally similar to a lot of other eikon abilities.
Jill, idk what's happening with Jill. Waiting for her time to shine but so far she's done the same old hang out in the background of cutscenes and sometimes say a line during exploration.
There's a couple things they did right with the this expansion and the last one:
- Accessories that do things. (albeit you're basically never incentivized to use them because it's a hassle to menu all that shit or change eikon stuff, and the game is piss easy as is). This is the absolute bare minimum of what should have been a stat and perk sphere grid or sth.
- Pieces of content that felt substantive but different from the main story's nonstop sadness/slavery/grim shit.
- Art direction, at least in the second DLC, is more interesting than almost the entirety of the base game, which just feels like bumfuck nowhere in the middle of the UK, with 3 locations that could generously be described as "green" and one that was "tan".
If XVI had launched like this I think I would overall be more charitable, but the fact that they had an extra year, charged a cumulative $90+ and are still making rookie mistakes is ridiculous.
I would be fine if nothing about XVI is ever revisited again, aside from perhaps the core gamefeel of combat and some of the technical stuff/spectacle.
He is not known for lying hes known for either being extremely vague or just wrong.
Im not sure if you said this in jest but you are unironically 100% right. Thats exactly what I thought he was a metaphor for.
And for me, personally, the parts that we got that were in the direction we thought the game was headed, were just not good. Like, the political-intrigue part of the game felt like a Tactics parody at best.
I figured he's very specifically an oil baron, myself. Rather than someone like Elon or Zuck, he's SPECIFICALLY someone like the Vanderbilts. But yeah, in an era where we don't quite have eco-capitalists like the Vanderbilts anymore, I can see why people compare him to other rich bastards.
For me though the element of "come to a place, use up all the natural resources while bragging about how special you are, then leave the smoking ruin behind to start again elsewhere" just aches of robber baron more than tech bro.
I'm excited to try the DLCs later Today!
I'm considering after finishing the DLCs, playing XVI and Rebirth Hard Modes side be side, this looks like a decent way to have fun for sometime.
Unfortunately I was not able to buy Dragon's Dogma 2 and probably Stellar Blade too due budget reasons, maybe later this year.
Just a question, there's any information if the PC port may have more playable characters?
I remember reading an interview saying the possibility of adding playable Jill and/or Cid in future if the PC port does well.
What you guys think probably work better? Arcade Mode only? or in the main game/story? Or in better scenario, both?
I'm considering after finishing the DLCs, playing XVI and Rebirth Hard Modes side be side, this looks like a decent way to have fun for sometime.
Unfortunately I was not able to buy Dragon's Dogma 2 and probably Stellar Blade too due budget reasons, maybe later this year.
Just a question, there's any information if the PC port may have more playable characters?
I remember reading an interview saying the possibility of adding playable Jill and/or Cid in future if the PC port does well.
What you guys think probably work better? Arcade Mode only? or in the main game/story? Or in better scenario, both?
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Yeah, there's a lot I think the game could have done better with as far as how certain things happen.
But I find the core themes pretty strongly tied into it all, and along with me enjoyinga lot of the characters I find myself thinking more about the things I enjoyed rather than its faults.
Yeah, I get this.
Luckily I saw where it was really going early on and accepted it for what it is, and I do like the idea that all the complex politics going on in Valisthea is a distraction from the environmental problem and also serves as cover for Clive to do his thing, but the bait and switch is still real and I'd be lieing if I said I didn't want to see a FF go deeper with the politics like FFXII again.
Not to toot my own horn here, but I think you may appreciate my interpretation of the game as something of an active repudiation or deconstruction of Game-of-Thrones-esque politicking. I wrote it up in the OT a month or two back.
Yeah I honestly get this. The political intrigue and the god/alien wants to destroy the world thing kind of get fused into one thing.
It's story is genuinely just more quintessential Final Fantasy, they wear their love of the series on their sleeve which kind of played against it when it came to the "GOT meets Attack on Titan" word of mouth that ended up not being accurate.
I thought the first wave of the DLC was okay and had more hope for this one but it's pretty underwhelming overall (and surprisingly short). I'm honestly only trusting Monolith Soft to deliver good JRPG expansion passes at this point, like how are they charging $25 for this when XC2 and XC3's expansion passes were $30 with a shit ton of extra content and massive expansions. The Leviathan fight was also pretty meh, I enjoyed the Omega fight from the first DLC much more. Also why were they hyping up Jill having more of a role here?
At least the new area looks nice and more visually interesting than anything in the base game.
At least the new area looks nice and more visually interesting than anything in the base game.
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Flare Breath still kinda sucks but it has much more of a place now that it launches.
Biggest difference in terms of abilities imo is gouge, holy shit what a move it is now. It recovers so fast
Finished the story and it's a bit disappointing. Thought Jill would get more since she had nothing in the first DLC but instead she got a few lines and one cutscene where she had a few of the slightly important ones. They allude to some of her history in relation to the new area but then don't go into it.
Some of the post story hunts are neat but it felt like the first DLC went further in terms of interesting fight design. There's not even one big final hunt for doing all the quests. The new area looks amazing though, no complaints there.
Some of the post story hunts are neat but it felt like the first DLC went further in terms of interesting fight design. There's not even one big final hunt for doing all the quests. The new area looks amazing though, no complaints there.
I really don't understand why Gouge needed a buff in the first place. Was literally my main stagger for 3/4ths the game until I got Diamond Dust. Had zero issues with Gouge, but now it's even better I guess.
Can someone point me in the direction of the Ageless Oilstone? It's the only crafting item I'm missing from the DLC.
As a Gouge enjoyer up until the last boss, it just takes too long. You're too vulnerable. Some of those endgame fights, you don't get enough time to sneak even half of it in before they get up or transition or whatever else.
Good and hilarious post. I don't disagree with your criticisms. I haven't played the DLC yet, but no manner of bandaiding is enough if you have to spend $30 to get to it. It's ultimately still FF16, like it or not.
I have finished the new game mode and it is surprising fun, I don't know if tied to difficulty but I didn't find it too hard but still hard and my scores were as bad lol. So I am surprised at the end to the amount of content of the DLC, MSQ is short but there is work put in here, I had a blast to be honest.
Planning to finish the game and a start a new game plus in hard difficulty with my new accesories and weapons :D
Planning to finish the game and a start a new game plus in hard difficulty with my new accesories and weapons :D
that's the one you need for crafting the new weapon? I can't find it too
It's not really at all. If you dislike the original game then there is no chance any dlc will change your mind. Especially one out less than a year from release. Just find a new game. The take that XB3 had to be saved by DLC says all you need to know how serious they are.
And CBU3 has no clue about game design? FFXVI and FFXIV say hi. Hate it all you want but you are in the minority when it comes to this game.