Also Knack's LTD is counting its Japan sales, I believe.Knack didn't sell 5 million copies instantly, and though I'm aware it's a launch title, there's a huge difference between 3.5 million Wii U units "shipped" by the end of its 1st quarter and the 7.5 million PS4 units shipped in its first quarter. Furthermore, launch titles tend to sell at an aggressive pace since early adopters are looking for games for their new toy. 3D World wasn't a launch title.
It sold two million its first winter. It was not the LTD.Welp, looks like I got some misinformation here, for some reason the number 2 million was stuck in my head. I didn't thought 3D World sold nearly as much as Galaxy 2. That's actually quite impressive.
Can't really agree with you on art style (though I love 3D World's appeal towards a classic SMB3/World appearance), but 3D World does have a far higher quality and quantity of focused platforming challenge that is unmatched by the other 3D games. I understand that many don't prefer that, but I found it highly enjoyable compared to the weird half-measure that Galaxy 2 was, or the admittedly basic level design of 3D Land. I think it's been pretty clear for a while now that a lack of game quality compared to it's predecessors is not what determined the failure of the Wii U, it was largely a failed system with an unappealing premise and bloated pricepoint that did it in. It's unfortunate that those excellent games seem like they're gonna be unknown in the public eye and die with the system."Correlations" aside, I think it's important not to let the WiiU's unfortunate fate taint the software titles. I still think that 3D World is a better Mario game than Odyssey when looking at art style and level design.
Couldn't agree more. Galaxy is my favorite Mario game, maybe my favorite game of all, and to see a handheld "kind-of-port" of 3D Land become the main console 3D Mario game after Galaxy was really disappointing.Wow. Some guys love 3D World a little too much here and take it as a personal attack if someone doesn't like it. Just accept that not everyone loves this game as much you do. For me it was the worst 3D Mario by far simply because it lacked ambition and the adventure aspect of the 3D Mario series. OP, you are not as alone as that vocal minority tells you. Sales speak for themselves and no, that was not only because of the low userbase from the Wii U. If there is a 3D World port on the Switch, I guarantee you it wouldn't even sell half as much as Odysee. There's a lot higher demand for 3D Mario games than for 3D World styled games, and luckily Nintendo knew that and we got Odysee.
But it's not a pattern if it doesn't make sense.Damn lol. Why is everybody attacking the OP here so vehemently? All he did was just share a fun little pattern that he discovered. Nothing more, nothing less. I don't understand what all the drama is about.
This site definitely feels like a successor to GAF 100% lmao
I completely forgot about that!Also Knack's LTD is counting its Japan sales, I believe.
Where it was a pack-in.
The contrast between Galaxy and NSMB Wii (approx. 8 mil vs. 31 mil) is kind of what defined Nintendo's output for the next five to six years.Mario games sell well when the system sells well? Pretty obvious isn't it?
You mentioned Mario Galaxy on the Wii, but the real winner at that time was New Super Mario Bros Wii which sold WAY better than Mario Galaxy.
But it's not a pattern if it doesn't make sense.
Mario 64 is one of the venerated games of all time. The N64 sold twelve million more units than the Gamecube, which is universally considered a huge failure.
The N64 was at 32 million with an incredibly low attach rate.I don't really believe the N64 was as much of a failure as people say it was. Relative to the PlayStation? Sure. But on its own, it was still a very popular console. Especially in the US. It also dominated the console multiplayer scene back in the day. It was home to some of the best and most groundbreaking games of all time and so many people have so much nostalgia for it to this day. Even if it was losing, it was still a very relevant console in the grand scheme of things. It was certainly in no worse position than the Saturn, that's for sure.
I'd say the GameCube is when Nintendo really started to fall behind the competition. The N64 was when the cracks first started showing. The GameCube is when the cracks burst open.
Damn lol. Why is everybody attacking the OP here so vehemently? All he did was just share a fun little pattern that he discovered
I just don't think 3D world, with it's NSMB set-up (three big coins, pole etc, generic Mario settings), and being designed to be played on a Wii Remote was ever seen as the 'next big step' game for Mario, as opposed to the dramatic new setting and mechanics in each of 64, Sunshine, Galaxy and Odyssey.
The N64 was at 32 million with an incredibly low attach rate.
The Gamecube was 20 million with a slightly higher attach rate.
It is way less about belief of whether or not it's a failure as much as it is the numbers saying it was a failure.
No. N64 was a qualified success. It was a failure in Japan. But it was a big success in the US, basically matching the SNES. It made Nintendo pretty much as much money as the SNES too, as they sold much more first party software on it.
The contrast between Galaxy and NSMB Wii (approx. 8 mil vs. 31 mil) is kind of what defined Nintendo's output for the next five to six years.
Very rarely for the better.
Seems pretty clear to me they whipped out a 'lower ambition/party multiplayer' Mario for Wii U (HD development growing pains and rushing a 'system saver' out meant using the tuned-for-portble 3D Land setup) and were planning a big new breathrough entry, but delayed the big one because it would have died on the vine on Wii U.
I just don't think 3D world, with it's NSMB set-up (three big coins, pole etc, generic Mario settings), and being designed to be played on a Wii Remote was ever seen as the 'next big step' game for Mario, as opposed to the dramatic new setting and mechanics in each of 64, Sunshine, Galaxy and Odyssey.
Well I guess that is where your theory falls apart. 3d World is a amazing game and anything but forgettable.Mario 3D World was ultimately a below average if not forgettable 3D Mario title,
I'm not seeing this - the N64 didn't really do well at all outside the US
I think many forget that the N64 was the start of Nintendo's decline in the console business. It's telling that the games mentioned for it are almost always first party or second party and it's Japanese support was, to my knowledge, worse than the Wii U actually. It might be even counting regional exclusive games.Exactly. Here in spain there was one person with a N64 per 10 PSOne. It was crazy.
Everyone got a Playstation because Er FIFA y Er Pro
Because they already had two Marios out by then, but no MK/Smash. I mean they likely had Odyssey planned for Wii U, maybe for 2016. By 2015 they were already moving to NX plans, so moved it.This doesn't make any sense at all. Why wouldn't Nintendo hold back Mario Kart and Smash too? Heck, Zelda was astonishingly ambitious, even if it didn't get released until the Switch.
The SNES sold less than the Famicom/NES so that was the start of that decline. Gamecube was the end of that period of decline, since the next console sold as much as their previous three combined.I think many forget that the N64 was the start of Nintendo's decline in the console business. It's telling that the games mentioned for it are almost always first party or second party and it's Japanese support was, to my knowledge, worse than the Wii U actually. It might be even counting regional exclusive games.
I really don't understand the hate for 3D World. It was awesome.
It's fine to defend the game's quality, but it's pretty obvious why people would see it as a letdown. Conceptually it was much lower ambition as a big new single player game. Mario 64 was a whole new design for Mario games in a whole new setting, Sunshine was another whole new setting with many new mechanics, Galaxy was another whole new setting with many new mechanics (Galaxy 2 was a sequel but it didn't matter since that gen already had its breakthrough Mario), and now Odessey follows that tradition. Even the titles of these games showed they were something new (unless they were not, like Galaxy 2).I really don't understand the hate for 3D World. It was awesome.
Fair enough if you believe that, but I just don't think there's any evidence of that being the case; just seems like wishful thinking to me. Personally, I feel like they expected 3D World to be a breakout hit, although the system had already crashed and burned by the point the game came out.Because they already had two Marios out by then, but no MK/Smash. I mean they likely had Odyssey planned for Wii U, maybe for 2016. By 2015 they were already moving to NX plans, so moved it.
Basically I just doubt they only planned a kind of multiplayer semi-spin-off as their big new Mario game for the generation, but the generation got cut short by the Wii U.
Because they already had two Marios out by then, but no MK/Smash. I mean they likely had Odyssey planned for Wii U, maybe for 2016. By 2015 they were already moving to NX plans, so moved it.
Basically I just doubt they only planned a kind of multiplayer semi-spin-off as their big new Mario game for the generation, but the generation got cut short by the Wii U.
The SNES sold less than the Famicom/NES so that was the start of that decline. Gamecube was the end of that period of decline, since the next console sold as much as their previous three combined.
There's really no correlation here. Mario platformers sells well regardless of Nintendo platform (no pun intended). And just about every game, whether if it's 2D or 3D, has received pretty positive reception from critics and fans alike. Only the sales potential is really affected, because had 3D World been on a more successful hardware, it would have sold on par with the Galaxy games.
No. Games sell hardware, not the other way around.
3D World was supposed to make people buy Wii U's. It didn't. It is partly to blame for Wii U's failure.
Thankfully, Odyssey and the Switch erased 3D World and the Wii U from history. All is forgiven.
Let's at least pretend we're all adults, okay?Thankfully, Odyssey and the Switch erased 3D World and the Wii U from history. All is forgiven.
Definitely agree with you there. No desire at all to go back to 3D World. 64 and Galaxy felt way more special to me.Yeah I figured that may be the most debatable part of my argument. I know it reviewed well, though not nearly as high as Galaxy 1, 2, or Odyssey. I enjoyed it for what it was at the time, but unlike the Galaxy titles I have no desire to play 3D World again. It was forgettable to me, but maybe I'm more alone on that opinion than I thought....