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PC Gaming Era | April 2019 - Goodbye, Uzzy is your new King

Tombstone for Orange should say:

  • Windows ME is a good operating system

    Votes: 42 16.4%

  • UN Ambassador for PC Gaming

    Votes: 34 13.3%

  • Report this Orange man

    Votes: 10 3.9%

  • Still thinks PC Gaming is dead

    Votes: 22 8.6%

  • ༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ (I have no idea if this one is allowed)

    Votes: 57 22.3%

  • nice thread btw :)

    Votes: 91 35.5%
  • Total voters
    256
  • Poll closed .
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Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,165
China
I still do not get why people say "Reviewbombing" inherently is supposed to be bad.

"Era" loved it when the user review Metacritic of BF2 fell down.
I would argue people would love it here if The Last Night Metacritic userreview would be at 1 because of the political stance of the author.

But the 15 review bombs out of over 20.000 games on Steam are bad now? I really do not get it.
 
Igniz12

Igniz12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,497
Speaking of leaks....I won't lie, when someone on PC era posted that EGS BB fake page I literally felt my bollock drop. Idk if it was from the excitement of having BB on PC or if it was the fact that I had my arm twisted and finally would have to get a game from EGS. Praise Sony for that most likely not happening, ever.
 
Wok

Wok

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
3,258
France
Chairmanchuck said:
I still do not get why people say "Reviewbombing" inherently is supposed to be bad.
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To quote Valve:

Review Score should represent the likelihood that a future purchaser will be happy with their purchase.
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"Off-topic review bombing" is an abuse of the review system by an angry mob to voice their discontentment with an issue unrelated to the item available for purchase, and to try to deliver a financial hit to the team behind it. Moreover, it does not happen in a vacuum: a small yet very active part of this angry mob is likely to send death threats and to harass the team on social media and in-real life. In my opinion, it is not the kind of reaction which we should wish for or advocate in any way.
 
Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,165
China
Wok said:
To quote Valve:



"Off-topic review bombing" is an abuse of the review system by an angry mob to voice their discontentment with an issue unrelated to the item available for purchase, and to try to deliver a financial hit to the team behind it. Moreover, it does not happen in a vacuum: a small yet very active part of this angry mob is likely to send death threats and to harass the team on social media and in-real life. In my opinion, it is not the kind of reaction which we should wish for or advocate in any way.
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But in like The Last Nights case it would be related to the item for purchase, because the whole ideology is part of the game.
 
BernardoOne

BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
Review bombs are tools. Wether they are good or bad always depends on the use. It certainly has done plenty of good: restoring modding, fixing ports , prevent Chinese censorship forced on global version, dumb regional pricing, removal of spyware and so on. Meanwhile I can't remember a single one of the dumb review bombings that actually resulted in a change to the games.
 
Pixieking

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,987
BernardoOne said:
Review bombs are tools. Wether they are good or bad always depends on the use. It certainly has done plenty of good: restoring modding, fixing ports , prevent Chinese censorship forced on global version, dumb regional pricing, removal of spyware and so on. Meanwhile I can't remember a single one of the dumb review bombings that actually resulted in a change to the games.
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Skyrim review bombing killed paid mods on Steam. Whether that's good or bad comes down to your view of paid mods. I think they were (are) a good thing, but *shrugs*

Edit:

"Trying to negatively affect an entity's ability to make money is not only a valid way to protest," one Kotaku reader wrote to me, "as you can see by the removal of Skyrim's paid mods it is one of the most effective ways... I think defending the value-proposition of PC gaming is worth the protest as I get a lot of entertainment time I value out of PC gaming, and considering what a desert of quality mobile gaming is."
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( https://kotaku.com/steam-review-bombing-is-a-problem-1701088582 )
 
Durante

Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,074
BernardoOne said:
Review bombs are tools. Wether they are good or bad always depends on the use. It certainly has done plenty of good: restoring modding, fixing ports , prevent Chinese censorship forced on global version, dumb regional pricing, removal of spyware and so on. Meanwhile I can't remember a single one of the dumb review bombings that actually resulted in a change to the games.
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Review bombs are tools, and more than that, they are one of the very few tools consumers can wield effectively against publishers.
 
InquisitorAles

InquisitorAles

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,205
Belarus
Igniz12 said:
Speaking of leaks....I won't lie, when someone on PC era posted that EGS BB fake page I literally felt my bollock drop. Idk if it was from the excitement of having BB on PC or if it was the fact that I had my arm twisted and finally would have to get a game from EGS. Praise Sony for that most likely not happening, ever.
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Why you guys keep doing this to yourself.
 
kafiend

kafiend

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,252
Durante said:
Review bombs are tools, and more than that, they are one of the very few tools consumers can wield effectively against publishers.
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Sometimes review bombs attack the devs rather than the publisher which is wrong and I'm not sure how that particular part can be dealt with.

With the Epic thing going on I'd be surprised if new publisher contracts don't have stuff in them that promotes the idea that devs want money via accumulating fans that purchase their games and not money via an exclusivity deal that limits this idea. Gaining fans should be a long-term goal of everyone involved in game creation and publishing, but it isn't for publishers at the moment.

Of course the bigger problem with review bombings come from dev's who wrongly believe they just made the best game on the planet with the best ideas ever thought and that they themselves have never made an imperfect decision ever. Those self-idolised devs get extremely upset when their perfection is challenged when obviously incorrect flaws are pointed out in their game or ideology via a review by a mortal.
 
BernardoOne

BernardoOne

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,289
You know, I think it's about time a thread is created about the good of user reviews, and how it covers games usually ignored by the mainstream gaming media.
 
1-D_FE

1-D_FE

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,290
BernardoOne said:
You know, I think it's about time a thread is created about the good of user reviews, and how it covers games usually ignored by the mainstream gaming media.
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I doubt it really matters or would make a difference. Every single grievance (in the long list) about EGS is valid, yet it doesn't matter in the discussions.

I've said it before, it'd be like if Nintendo bought Sony or MS, and killed LIVE/PSN and implemented an even shittier version of Nintendo Online. None of the supporters of EGS are arguing in good faith. And there'd be mass strokes if the above scenario happened.

And, yes, Steam is obviously a platform. The fact that I saw mods (here) say with a straight face it's not is the most rediculious thing I think I've ever read here.
 
Digoman

Digoman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
233
GhostTrick said:
If you want to know what is effective, just look at what publishers wants to remove from Steam by praising EGS. :)
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This. The fact that so many publishers/developers are bothered by them just show how important user reviews are.

The only time review bombing is somewhat less useful to me personally is when they happen to just released games (like Devotion) that don't have enough reviews yet so it is harder to get a reading of what's happening. The other times Steam gives me all the tools I need to see really quickly that a review bombing is happening (even before Valve's new protection system) and what was the score before. Then I read a few of the "reviews" to see why the discontent and judge for myself if the reason, even if it's an "off topic" one like a developer opinion over a certain subject, will influence my decision to buy the game.

So.... in the vast majority of the cases they just give me more information about a possible purchase, even if they are done some stupid reason (though from what I have seen thouse usually disappear in statistical noise in a couple of weeks).

BernardoOne said:
You know, I think it's about time a thread is created about the good of user reviews, and how it covers games usually ignored by the mainstream gaming media.
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I think the Supraland developer wrote that 98% of the traffic came from Steam itself, and that game did get at least a little bit of coverage like the Giantbomb quick look. So that just shows (again) why a review system attached to the store itself is so important. But I'm going to take a wild guess that a thread about this is not going to end well....
 
ramoisdead

ramoisdead

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,652
BernardoOne said:
You know, I think it's about time a thread is created about the good of user reviews, and how it covers games usually ignored by the mainstream gaming media.
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It would be a good thread idea. Sure Randy Pitchford, Rami, and a bunch of other devs like to neglect user reviews are anything positive on Steam but I've known from experience using the store that it is a lot more useful since nobody in games media like to cover or review any of these games that are PC only. It also includes the outlets that cover PC as well.
 
Stone Ocean

Stone Ocean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,629
It's really hard to argue for review bombing in ERA because people will go with their usual whataboutisms that generalize all review bombing with the occasional alt right review bomb.

Then again that's pretty much every discussion in gaming side when it comes to Steam nowadays. Hey a lack of curation isn't a bad th- BUT WHAT ABOUT RAPE DAY
 
Galdere

Galdere

Member
Oct 25, 2017
53
Trying Anno 1800 with a 2080 and i9 9900 and it's a slideshow of low fps. Someone really messed up changing something since the betas as it seems I'm not alone with the issue. Some have said changing to DX12 in the options kicks in the GPU properly but I've had no luck with that. Anyone else found a temp fix?
 
Igniz12

Igniz12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,497
I can see both sides of the review bomb topic; it is often times the only way to get someone to take notice of an issue but can also be used to hurt a dev as we've seen with campo santo and BG2:EE. In both of those instances the defense used for review bombs is "It is only 10% of total reviews and did not hurt the dev that much".

How can something be effective at one thing to make (hopefully) positive change but then suddenly not be such a big deal when it is used negatively idk. In both instances it is being used to hurt the devs, in one instance it is justified by fair minded people but I am sure those alt-right/alt-lite asshole also feel justified in what they are doing as well when they go on a review bombing run.

This shit is incredibly murky and why I don't have a blanket opinion and it really falls in to case by case. I reckon it is the case with most people too. I guess what I am saying is we are going use review bombs to get devs to make changes then we should also acknowledge that this should not be the case and game companies need better avenues for people to let their voices be heard but actually be heard and not just be given lip service.

Fat hope of that ever happening so I guess review bombs are here to stay.


InquisitorAles said:
Why you guys keep doing this to yourself.
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What can I say, I am a sucker for From games :P
 
YuSuzzune

YuSuzzune

Member
Nov 21, 2018
4,925
Beware on purchasing stuff from Indiegala:

https://www.indiegala.com/forums/1

Apparently there are problems going on, you could get your payment refused (like me), you could end up being charged twice or you could end up on paying without receiving a key with no transaction history. Dunno what's happening here.
 
Kyougar

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,420
Gaming Industry right now in a nutshell:

Reviews:
- are good when they are positive
- are toxic when they are negative (regardless of the reason of the negative review)

Fanatical Fans:
- are the best ever, especially if they hype your game without even knowing anything about it
- are entitled toxic manbabies when they don't eat what the company throws at them

Influencers:
- are the future and a positive force for game sales
- don't matter at all, have no impact on game sales

Curation:
- is good when you are one of the few on the store
- is bad for everything else

Gaming Press:
- *this point is censored because of the "Vilifying Media outlet" act.*
 
Stone Ocean

Stone Ocean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,629
Igniz12 said:
I can see both sides of the review bomb topic; it is often times the only way to get someone to take notice of an issue but can also be used to hurt a dev as we've seen with campo santo and BG2:EE. In both of those instances the defense used for review bombs is "It is only 10% of total reviews and did not hurt the dev that much".

How can something be effective at one thing to make (hopefully) positive change but then suddenly not be such a big deal when it is used negatively idk. In both instances it is being used to hurt the devs, in one instance it is justified by fair minded people but I am sure those alt-right/alt-lite asshole also feel justified in what they are doing as well when they go on a review bombing run.

This shit is incredibly murky and why I don't have a blanket opinion and it really falls in to case by case. I reckon it is the case with most people too. I guess what I am saying is we are going use review bombs to get devs to make changes then we should also acknowledge that this should not be the case and game companies need better avenues for people to let their voices be heard but actually be heard and not just be given lip service.

Fat hope of that ever happening so I guess review bombs are here to stay.
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The way I see it, review bombs don't really work without context. They draw attention to an issue and from then on a discussion can be had. If the "issue" is some alt righter moronic rambling then it can be safely ignored, if the issue is something like a shit port then we can join in, etc.
 
Lashley

Lashley

<<Tag Here>>
Member
Oct 25, 2017
60,395
PS4 supporting raytracing, so should hopefully stop trolls shitting on it in every RT thread.
 
Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Chairmanchuck (另一个我)

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,165
China
Igniz12 said:
I can see both sides of the review bomb topic; it is often times the only way to get someone to take notice of an issue but can also be used to hurt a dev as we've seen with campo santo and BG2:EE. In both of those instances the defense used for review bombs is "It is only 10% of total reviews and did not hurt the dev that much".
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I would say that the "review bombing" issue is far too overblown. I made an almost complete list in the last thread about it and I think there were 14 games that were "review bombed" and out of 4-5 had good reasons (no chinese localization even though it was promised (Nier)) and some.
Compare that to the 20k games on Steam and that makes the issue actually.... not really that big.

That doesnt mean that the issue doesnt exist, but thats saying that a bug that 0,000002% of users encounter makes the whole game shit.
 
Stallion Free

Stallion Free

Member
Oct 29, 2017
955
Kyougar said:
Gaming Industry right now in a nutshell:

Reviews:
- are good when they are positive
- are toxic when they are negative (regardless of the reason of the negative review)

Fanatical Fans:
- are the best ever, especially if they hype your game without even knowing anything about it
- are entitled toxic manbabies when they don't eat what the company throws at them

Influencers:
- are the future and a positive force for game sales
- don't matter at all, have no impact on game sales

Curation:
- is good when you are one of the few on the store
- is bad for everything else

Gaming Press:
- *this point is censored because of the "Vilifying Media outlet" act.*
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Haha so true. It looks even worse when distilled down to those points.
 
SteveWinwood

SteveWinwood

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,726
USA USA USA
JaseC said:
The rumour was indefinite exclusivity, which should have raised a red flag to editorship at DSO but didn't because it was theoretically possible insofar that there are no forces at work that would render it impossible (i.e. because -- and let's be honest -- clicks). Fortunately, though, they wisened up when the same user later claimed Nintendo was in the process of porting Mario Odyssey to the PC for release on EGS.
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is this vilifying the media?
 
SuikerBrood

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
15,507
Galdere said:
Trying Anno 1800 with a 2080 and i9 9900 and it's a slideshow of low fps. Someone really messed up changing something since the betas as it seems I'm not alone with the issue. Some have said changing to DX12 in the options kicks in the GPU properly but I've had no luck with that. Anyone else found a temp fix?
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Have you tried putting Steam in offline mode?
 
Igniz12

Igniz12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,497
Kinda thinking of getting back into Enter the Gungeon after the Northenlion LP. I tried to get into that game many times but always drop off, the new update makes it very tempting especially after watching him play. Thing is idk if it is the NL dumb luck that made the run so interesting or if the updates have done a good job of not making the game seem like a chore at times.

Also, ACG has a review out for EGS exclusive, World War Z. Seems like an ok game but after wtaching the video idk why you would not just play Killing Floor 2. That games does the same gameplay but much better and has more things going for it than a single weird gimmick from the movie.
 
YuSuzzune

YuSuzzune

Member
Nov 21, 2018
4,925
Lashley said:
PS4 supporting raytracing, so should hopefully stop trolls shitting on it in every RT thread.
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People who believe raytracing will be a real thing on Ps5 should also believe horses can fly. It's the same scenario of "1080p/60 fps" mantra when the PS4 launched and than 90% of the games are in 30 fps. It will be present marginally in some titles and that's it.
 
AHA-Lambda

AHA-Lambda

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,849
Higurashi Chapter 7 is now finally in beta

Higurashi7-Minagoroshi.jpg


http://blog.mangagamer.org/project-status/
 
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