We haven't even seen Bayonneta 3.. But I'm not confident the budget will be good, so DMCV probably going to stomp it in graphics and content at the minimum. Nintendo isn't going to invest that much in a niche title...
Place your bets: Bayonetta 3 or Devil May Cry 5
- Thread starter malyse
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You mean like this?
Or this?
All on last gen hardware, btw.
Quoting for the new page of this ridiculous argument.
DMC5 has got more to prove so it really should be a better game than Bayo3 which will still be good even if it's on par with previous games.
I wouldn't buy either until I get more impressions and maybe even wait for reviews.
Bayonetta can kick Dante's ass though. 4 guns > 2 guns.
I wouldn't buy either until I get more impressions and maybe even wait for reviews.
Bayonetta can kick Dante's ass though. 4 guns > 2 guns.
That's accurate and one day someone will explain to me how is that acceptable, that's part of the reason why i hate GOTY so much.
Given that this is simply based on "feels" I'll take Devil May Cry 5 because it's on PC and not stuck on the Switch. I'll play both when all is said and done. Bayonetta 3 will have to be quite spectacular to compete with Devil May Cry 5 though.
No one said anything about enemy counts or mechanics. The person you responded to and I quote said ''
there are things happening in the environment in DMCV that the Switch can't do.''
I'm not sure you're aware but DMC5 does have more things going under the hood then it's pretty graphics.
It has real environmental destruction, scattering, permanent damage caused by bosses on the battlefield spots and that's just off the top of my head.
The Goliath boss fight from the demo features so many tehnical aspects, all mentioned above plus some seamless transition between the zones and him literally picking up every object including the broken building pieces into his big whirlwind absorb move . It's very reminiscent of Dice's Frostbyte.
Too bad none of that's real time and scripted like the vast majority of games. You can see ''destruction'' examples like this on PS2 games.
But no it's better to move a goal poast and change the subject into enemy count or whatever.
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It's more about how well the game holds itself while allowing enemies to completely destroy the environment in ways which aren't like totally scripted. Sort of like how Ornstein & Smough destroy the pillars in Anor Londo, but on a greater scale.
The thing DMCV does is it uses the destruction to seamlessly change the stage for the fight, kind of like how Dead or Alive used to (without the destruction). So the big monster lets out a big energy blast and destroys the church you are in and you both chase each other out into the next zone without a cutscene transition
It's like that fight against the chariot horse in DMC3, but they needed to do a cutscene to do the stage transition from the bridge. Bayo does it similar to DMC3, when fighting Jeanne across buildings, or Raiden in MGR chasing Mistral across a power plant. All in a staged hands-off interaction, but V looks like it's trying to keep the gameplay sequences completely seamless and running at 60.
So these aren't just trivial 'oh look at the pretty colours' additions, they're potentially meaningful as well at keeping these fights feeling intense and not in a kind of staged way. Or one that you got to QTE to get through.
Like everyone (or most) who played DMC3 was like 'I wanna be cutscene Dante'. V looks like it's trying to do this a little bit. I can't really imagine the kind of action V is doing in that trailer on a Switch, especially the whole flying Tony Hanks McTwist bit with the rocket arm. Would that be smooth and 60fps on Switch? Possibly, but if the more general action sequences on B1 and B2 have some slowdown (B1) or frameskipping (B2) then it isn't up to the task as far as I can see.
I'll admit tho I did think of Red Faction when looking at that SoS clip. Like what would Remarstered edition be like on Switch
The thing DMCV does is it uses the destruction to seamlessly change the stage for the fight, kind of like how Dead or Alive used to (without the destruction). So the big monster lets out a big energy blast and destroys the church you are in and you both chase each other out into the next zone without a cutscene transition
It's like that fight against the chariot horse in DMC3, but they needed to do a cutscene to do the stage transition from the bridge. Bayo does it similar to DMC3, when fighting Jeanne across buildings, or Raiden in MGR chasing Mistral across a power plant. All in a staged hands-off interaction, but V looks like it's trying to keep the gameplay sequences completely seamless and running at 60.
So these aren't just trivial 'oh look at the pretty colours' additions, they're potentially meaningful as well at keeping these fights feeling intense and not in a kind of staged way. Or one that you got to QTE to get through.
Like everyone (or most) who played DMC3 was like 'I wanna be cutscene Dante'. V looks like it's trying to do this a little bit. I can't really imagine the kind of action V is doing in that trailer on a Switch, especially the whole flying Tony Hanks McTwist bit with the rocket arm. Would that be smooth and 60fps on Switch? Possibly, but if the more general action sequences on B1 and B2 have some slowdown (B1) or frameskipping (B2) then it isn't up to the task as far as I can see.
I'll admit tho I did think of Red Faction when looking at that SoS clip. Like what would Remarstered edition be like on Switch
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Yeah let's just make it run at near-SD resolutions and sub-30fps like Doom and Wolf2. DMCV will play just wonderfully.
It's scary that you are actually serious with that comparison haha
I mean as characters I prefer Bayonetta to Dante but Dante isn't the lead so it's not like that matters in this instance.
I like Bayo's gameplay style more as it's a bit easier for me to grasp and find a groove.
Everything else I can't really say until we see more of Bayonetta 3.
I will say I'd rather this not turn into a pissing contest though. I say be happy we're getting both.
I like Bayo's gameplay style more as it's a bit easier for me to grasp and find a groove.
Everything else I can't really say until we see more of Bayonetta 3.
I will say I'd rather this not turn into a pissing contest though. I say be happy we're getting both.
Lol because thats how game development works right. Just lower the res and framerate and it'll port perfectly.
Also my original point with DMC4 that I was trying to make was more along the lines that it is a game mode that people have come to expect from DMC, and if V is to include it I can't imagine it as an easy fit for Switch. I didn't make that clear really
But also tbqh I can't imagine 100 enemies on screen on DMCV for base consoles either, but I'm no engineer and got no real authority on the matter. Just basing what I'm saying on doing a cross-comparison between the two major character action titles on Switch and with DMCV footage
But also tbqh I can't imagine 100 enemies on screen on DMCV for base consoles either, but I'm no engineer and got no real authority on the matter. Just basing what I'm saying on doing a cross-comparison between the two major character action titles on Switch and with DMCV footage
I have insanely high hopes for both and I fully expect both will meet them. I also expect them to deliver different enough takes on the genre that I feel no need to pit them against each other.
Hey, unless you program games, I'd refrain from this sort of topic. It's not that you are right or wrong, it's just that you might not have any idea what you are talking about. There is examples of everything you've mentioned done on last gen consoles, brainchild himself has even pointed out some of the ones you've mentioned.
And nothing that you mentioned is anything new and has been done on last gen hardware.
It would be one thing to argue that the Switch could not handle the precision of the physics involved in the destruction, but that does not matter as far as gameplay is concerned. There's no need to retain the fidelity as long as the functionality is maintained, and that certainly wouldn't be impossible to do on the Switch.
I'm sure brainchild means well, but I don't know what's he's talking about. the environmental stuff in W101 doesn't go beyond what Bayo 1 did last gen iirc. DMCV is on whole another level.
User Warned : Platform wars rhetoric.
DMC V will open Bayonetta 3 ass and shread it to pieces.
Bayonetta 2 was a huge let down and not having Kamiya will hurt the brand even more. Also PG should rename Bayonetta to Bombanetta, especially after Bayo ports selling poorly.
And lol at people talking about 30fps, 720p for DMC V on Nintendo Switch, i know the standard on NSW are pretty low but DMC V dont deserve to run on an inferior hardware.
Bayonetta 2 was a huge let down and not having Kamiya will hurt the brand even more. Also PG should rename Bayonetta to Bombanetta, especially after Bayo ports selling poorly.
And lol at people talking about 30fps, 720p for DMC V on Nintendo Switch, i know the standard on NSW are pretty low but DMC V dont deserve to run on an inferior hardware.
Bigger expectations of Bayo, and Bayo would win :D
Maybe even higher scores for Bayo, who knows?
Maybe even higher scores for Bayo, who knows?
My point is that, functionally, that type of gameplay is possible on Switch, not that those examples are as computationally demanding as the environment destruction in DMCV.
None of the things you just mentioned are impossible on Switch. To top it off, as far as I have seen from DMCV it looks like the playable environments are actually pretty small overall. You can see pretty far but your character moves along a very linear path. That makes it all the more possible for Switch. Just sayin.
On topic. I am very curious what Kamiya has planned for Bayo 3 in terms of locations and Art style. He was aware of what was being done with RE2 and DMCV before they were officially announced, having visited Capcom several times. he also recommended that DMC go for a more realistic style this time around, which really makes one wonder if he was saying that because he had similar plans for Bayo 3.
I am much more excited to see what happens with Bayonetta 3 than DMCV. I think Kamiya is just an all around better game designer than anyone at Capcom currently.
I don't think you'd want any Devil May Cry game at 30fps. DmC was crucified for a similar decision.
The fidelity is indeed on a whole other level. The unique gameplay that it offers compared to what games were capable of doing on last gen consoles, however, is not.
I used to actually but that's not the point here.
Anyone with some decent knowledge knows actually there's more to a game then meets the eye and there's way more stuff going under the hood then outside it.
I shed some light on the subject since I found it ridiculously funny that one would find that DMC5 wouldn't be possible on switch ''Non-sense.'' then tried to change the whole narrative and maknig it about the enemy count or whatever.
Yeah sure some of this has been done last gen but not in the same fidelity as here and many modern games with similar faets. DMC5 is a 60 fps(!) game that offers state of the art visuals while also having many great tehnical aspects outside of that. It's not very common to have the best of both worlds and do it efficiency.
The RE Engine is some amazing shti for Capcom.
I found DmC was perfectly playable t 30fps. I had no trouble whatsoever with reaction time. Rare is the game that requires 60fps to be playable. It is more of a luxury than a necessity.
I would MUCH rather have a perfect and stable 30fps than a wonky 60fps that jumps all over the friggin place.
I can't believe we're acting like the destructible environments are a big deal anyway, I don't think lacking them on the level of DMC5 will damn Bayo 3 in this comparison, like, at all. It'll come down to stuff like combat mechanics, enemy design and level design.
Which, we need to see if Umbran Climax was fixed from 2.
Which, we need to see if Umbran Climax was fixed from 2.
Regardless of the game themselves who would win between Dante and Bayonetta is a completely separate argument that's already been settled anyway
It kind of falls under enemy design imo, or rather boss design
I always hated Geyron in DMC3 and partly cause of the cutscene transition. Having that type of thing happen naturally and smoothly is really cool I think. It's not looking so stitched together anymore and that's important imo
I agree the most important things are the core aspects like mechanics and enemies tho.
It kind of falls under enemy design imo, or rather boss design
I always hated Geyron in DMC3 and partly cause of the cutscene transition. Having that type of thing happen naturally and smoothly is really cool I think. It's not looking so stitched together anymore and that's important imo
I agree the most important things are the core aspects like mechanics and enemies tho.
They did say Bayonetta 3 will push the genre and do something never seen before in it so there's potential for it be pretty intense in the action department.
But yeah with the power on the Switch being much lower than a PS4 Pro or Xbox One X and the clear big budget DMC V has, Bayonetta 3 has a lot to prove.
But yeah with the power on the Switch being much lower than a PS4 Pro or Xbox One X and the clear big budget DMC V has, Bayonetta 3 has a lot to prove.
/DeadRegardless of the game themselves who would win between Dante and Bayonetta is a completely separate argument that's already been settled anyway
So you agree with him.
I'm not saying it would run on Switch well at all, it would take a lot of tricks to get it to 60FPS, but it could look like a last gen game on Switch and do all the same things it's doing there, the amount of detail and destruction would have to be reduced, and it would take more work than it would probably be worth since it would be a late port and we don't know just how good/bad the game will be yet, but if you've worked on code like this before (like I have) then you know that it's possible.
Well I'm still a programmer in 2018 and have yet to see any of my peers make the dubious claims that you have.
If your argument is that the Switch can't handle the fidelity, you'll get no objections from me, but that wasn't what I was arguing in the first place.
No, that was for a brand new title not Bayonetta 3 https://www.destructoid.com/platinu...t-to-flip-the-genre-on-its-head--502911.phtml
I don't really remember. It was from my mom's workplace, which closed down in around 2007.
There was that Titanfall 2 guy, but he probably hadn't even seen the hardware.
