Ok but it's two different implementations. The PS5's haptic feedback seems to offer different levels of resistance and feeling. So it's still incorrect to say XB did it already when it isn't even doing the same thing.
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PlayStation 5 Confirmed To Sport 8 Cores / 16 Threads CPU; Full Reveal Coming Next Year
- Thread starter Alucardx23
- Start date
Ok but it's two different implementations. The PS5's haptic feedback seems to offer different levels of resistance and feeling. So it's still incorrect to say XB did it already when it isn't even doing the same thing.
Honest question, have you played Forza on Xbox One? Because it absolutely does that.
No i have not.
I'm guessing you're going to tell me it has those too.
Yes.
The feeling of the triggers going from track to grass, sand, water, puddles, snow and ice is all very different.
We'll just have to wait for more details on PS5's version then. It read like something different that what XB1 does.
It's probably just a newer implementation of it, I mean I highly doubt they'd use the same exact old tech as Xbox One (Switch uses updated haptic feedback for similar results); but as an idea and a feature, it's exactly the same thing and I would also expect to see Xbox improve their implementation as well with Scarlet. It's going to be whatever Immersion is offering.
So in a game with a bow and arrow, does it feel different? Do guns feel different on the trigger? Because if you're just saying there's different intensities of rumble (they are rumble triggers after all) it is not the same as having different levels of resistance. That is the key, trigger resistance and different levels of rumble are absolutely not the same thing. I'm sure the scarlet controller will have resistive triggers, MS always makes great controllers. But rumble triggers are not resistive triggers
$499.
I think they can get all this at a reduced price because they are ordering so many parts. They'll also lose some money at launch.
The conversation wasn't about the Adaptive Triggers, it was about the Haptic Feedback motors.
Two completely different things and I definitely didn't confuse the two.
The I don't think anyone else has done a type of 'force feedback' with controller triggers before, so that should be pretty damn cool in itself.
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More like they will release a game every 2 to 3 yrats because they will have two teams that release games on different schedules.
No games utilize the 6 cores and a half Jaguar fully but they are so weak they can't compete with a quad-core. You can multithreaded games much better than now.
Parallelizing the Naughty Dog Engine Using Fibers
This talk is a detailed walkthrough of the game engine modifications needed to make The Last of Us Remastered run at 60 fps on PlayStation 4. Topics covered will include the fiber-based job system Naughty Dog adopted for the game, the overall...
www.gdcvault.com
And some devs not so big pastagame use it and they do PC, consoles and mobile games.
Here the job system
Second part:
With SSD they will need to replace serial I/O stuff by parallelized I/O but many things can be parallelized in game code.
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You can be sure if the next Xbox has similar features included, Ryan will suddenly think they're a good idea.
Where does he sat he doesn't think they are a good Idea in the PS5 controller?
Seems he's pointing out others have used them as gimmicks and he hopes Sony does better.
Exactly. Not a very positive comment (a back-handed compliment at best) but then it's hardly surprising considering who it is.
I'd rather have a choice of a stronger console. Mid gen refreshes are great. They serve a niche audience that spends a lot of money.
I'm excited to see Assassin's Creed and GTA on the PS5. Assassin's Creed Odyssey and Red Dead Redemption 2 are great looking games but they don't have big cities with lots of NPCs. The next Assassin's Creed title is likely to be a cross gen game (vikings scenario), but I think GTA will be next gen only. Hopefully it comes out before 2022, but I'm not so sure about that.
How is him hoping they actually put it to good use a back-handed compliment?
Biggest complaint about the feature you'll hear from any Xbox user is that it was severely underutilized. If more dev's start using it because of Sony adopting it, that is a gain for everyone.
This is a bit silly. Everyone and their mother said this about HD rumble in the Switch's Joycon.
The difference in cost between a 1TB 2.5" HDD whether it's 5400 or 7200RPM and a 1TB SSD retail isn't that great anymore, probably a good deal smaller when it comes to the tens of millions Sony will be buying without retail mark up with whatever manufacturer they partner with. Mechanical HDDs are pretty much at their price floor while SSDs are going to continue to drop significantly over the next several years.
Production (and demand, obviously) of consumer level HDDs has been declining for years now and manufacturers have been moving away from it for a while outside of the enterprise sector. I'll be surprised if consumer HDD production (on a reasonably large scale) is still going on by the time the next gen ends and I could see it ending around mid-gen for consumer 2.5" HDDs. Sony and MS kinda have to make the switch, the potential performance benefits just makes it an easier sell to consumers.
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Sony has their own patents for this, so it may not be licensed from Immersion.
We have enough detail to know how it differs from 'rumble triggers'. Rumble (vibration in the trigger.but no change in its travel behaviour) and actual force feedback (a change in how the trigger travels, or doesn't travel) are two different things. What the Wired article describes in terms of the triggers is more like the latter.
I do expect Microsoft to have the same in the next Xbox controller - they filed their own patent, iirc, around actual force feedback in triggers. Hopefully anyway, because it would likely help increase good application in multiplat games.
Don't expect them to give "total" compatibility. That would just open the door for someone to sue them if some obscure Move game is not working.
I just don't see how she can do that, even taking some sort of loss. Those specs are crazy even for $499.
Right, they'll already be taking a decent loss at $499. $399 would probably see them losing >$200.
At 1440p+ a 2080 will probably be the bottleneck with i7 9700 =) ill be very suprised if thats not the case
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check it out, not even a 2080ti can stress a 8700k=)
All you need to know about the IGN personality in question, is that near the beginning of this gen Shu Yoshida responded to a tweet made in the same way one respond to someone.....who is a particularly passionate fan of some things over others
McCaffery tweet: "If Kojima does sign w/Sony as rumoured, my first thought will be: 'did Microsoft even pick up the phone & call him?"
To which Shu responded
"Hi Ryan, why would that be your first thought? Do you love MS so much?".
Link so I'm not seen to speaking out my ass.
It didn't even occur to Shu that he worked for IGN, that's how bad the tweet was. He has a history of this
People seem to be misunderstanding about the costs of this kind of thing. technology evolves and things seemingly impressive get cheaper. it will have been 7 years since jaguar(an already subpar CPU at the time) and SSD's prices have been coming down, and the architecture of AMD's GPU's has improved a lot too, in the midrange space as well(where the PS5's GPU will come out towards). I'm sure these companies can make a good unit without going the PS3 or 360 route of breaking the bank or sacrificing on build quality to do so.
I'm expecting 449 or 499, but they wont be eating that much on the system.
I'm expecting 449 or 499, but they wont be eating that much on the system.
The SOC May be more expensive than it was at ps4 launch but nothing seems that expensive when you look at industry prices.
For GDDR6, the belief I've seen is each chip will be $7-$8 per chip, with each chip being 2GB, 24GB would be $96. So I'd say $100ish for 16-24GBs. PS4 ram in 2013 was $100-$110
Ultra HD Blu Ray costs the same to make as Blu-ray drives so it's likely $30 or less. It was $30 estimated for Xbox One S in 2016 after all.
SSDs at 1TB are sold at huge profits, likely triple cost, at $100-$130. So they likely cost those manufacturers $40-$60 max, and console makers will get discounts because they can order 50-100M+. So I'd expect a 1TB SSD to add $40 to the total bill, a bit more than a 500GB HDD in 2013.
I can easily see PS5 having these specs, costing $430-$450 and being sold at $399.99
8 core Zen 2 @3.2Ghz
Navi GPU @10-11TFs
16-24GB total ram. Maybe be a mixture of types
1TB SSD
I think if anything goes up it's Dual Shock 5, likely going from $18ish in 2013 to $25-$30 with haptics, etc, and sold for $69.99 like SwitchPro
Ps4 was sold at $60 loss on launch, dont see why wont we see them losing money on the hardware on launch considering the increase in digital game sales and mtx
No, in example a Ryzen 3600 (6c/12t) will handle next gen games with no issues, and so will your cpu.
- Significant reduction in load times
- Notably bigger environments
- Notably improved streaming system
- Consequently significantly better Level of Detail (LoD) management systems i.e. less pop ins.
- Smaller game sizes due to the lack of data duplication (except the overall size of big budget games would probably be bigger due to increased resolutions of texture assets)
- Fixed HW means fixed specs (within margin of error tolerance) means devs do not ever have to worry about end user disrupting their optimized works
Ah. Okay. I wasn't exactly sure but this clears it up. Ofc, I imagine all this will depend on the devs
Indeed. I think this will help smaller developers immensely who generally do not possess the same time and/or budgetary resources for optimization as the larger studios.
That actually makes Yoshida look more juvenile and fanboyish than Ryan though. You guys are making big deal out of tweets that aren't that antagonistic. Ryan is merely hoping that devs would use the feature. I don't understand how that is an insult or backhanded compliment to the PS5. There are always console features that devs choose not to use. Jeez. And why do you call Yoshida like that? Is this supposed to be an satirical post or sth? Perhaps it's a difference in culture, but I just find it so weird when westerners call Japanese people by their given names (or even make a nickname for them).
I will add that due to the much faster streaming, you can have much shorter masked loading sequences like crawling through tight spaces in games, this could in turn help improve the pacing of games and increase the scale of sequences (can unload and load in parts from one set piece to the next quickly and seamlessly)
Unless developers can portray a scenario we can't think of as mere consumers I still don't see these as game changers as all of these are expected improvements from next gens and loading times are already super fast on PC. Game worlds get bigger, draw distances improve, no loading screen games aren't rare. Pop in is distracting but not a limiting factor I think. Compared to current consoles this is massive upgrade for them, but apart from engine level pop in in games that SSD cannot fix, most of these benefits have gotten old now.
Right, devs would have to experiment with them.
Spider-Man being able to swing way faster is a gameplay example. I think God of War being able to almost instantly go from realm to realm is another good example. You could have a game involving warping to different places randomly. A Flash game is also possible now.
- Initial loading, fast travel and respawn time disprove your assertions about load times depending on the game. I would recommend watching Unity's Heretic YT video.
- Streaming system, which is inherently tied to LoD system is also tied to HDD speed which is why DriftingSpirit pointed out, pace of travel within the game world has its upper bounds which shall see notable improvements only made possible due to the high speed nature of the storage in lieu of unrealistically large pool of RAM (like 128GB GDDR6, an 8x increase- A multiplication factor that has previously been the trend since the days of iirc PS2).
- Finally, a notably upgraded CPU goes hand in hand with the SSD. I can't imagine a current gen Jaguar paired with the same custom SSD solution to yield as big of an advantage as the former.
A Flash game would still be limited by how fast our brain can process information and react in a given time in the game world. I don't think technology is the main factor why we haven't seen a Flash game yet. Its not like racing games don't move fast enough.
- Isn't that just a cut scene? What am I missing there?
- I already pointed out engine level pop in that SSD cannot fix. Again, its a distraction which is noticeable variably across different games. It would be an iterative improvement. So you could move faster in God of War while the next area loads. Thats not revelatory in my opinion.
- I did say its a massive improvement for consoles. How much would it improve over a top end SSD paired with a powerful i7? Not a huge amount.
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