PS5 and Xbox Series speculation |OT11| Cry Havoc and Let Slip the Dogs of War [NEW NEWS, NEW THREAD - CHECK OUT THE STAFF POST]

[Xeontech]

Was on vacay for a week. Took my Stadia with me for the travels.

Got back to my consoles today.

All I can say is anyone that thinks consoles are being left behind at this point is out of touch with reality.

Maybe in 20 years. But it's a joke to compare the experiences right now. Holy shit. It's just worse on every level.

Hardware for the win fam.

 

[Deleted member 5028]

Was on vacay for a week. Took my Stadia with me for the travels.

Got back to my consoles today.

All I can say is anyone that thinks consoles are being left behind at this point is out of touch with reality.

Maybe in 20 years. But it's a joke to compare the experiences right now. Holy shit. It's just worse on every level.

Hardware for the win fam.

Click to shrink...

Having flashbacks to Ouya and how it was going to be a real game changer for the industry.

 

[Dust]

Jason Voorhees may do it maybe. XD

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Someone needs to break the NDA and implode their career...for great justice.

 

[RoninStrife]

I reckon the sky would be the limit. Ps2 emulation has been in a pretty good spot for a good while.

Last I checked its mostly cpu dependent but I managed to get good results with a celeron years ago.

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With a Celeron, wow, that bodes well for us then.

 

[DrKeo]

PCIe 6.0 is still on track for 2021. It will be x4 times faster than PCIe 4 and x2 times faster than PCIe 5.0 which will supposedly be available this year.

x4 lane in different PCIe versions, the standard for a good NVMe:
PCIe 3.0 - 3.94GB/s
PCIe 4.0 - 7.88GB/s
PCIe 5.0 - 15.75GB/s
PCIe 6.0 - 31.51GB/s

So if anyone was scared PC gamers will be left behind, don't worry, their 30GB/s NVMe next year will be OK with games built around the PS5's SSD :)

 

[tusharngf]

Tomorrow we might get some rdna 2 news from AMD.

 

[Kschreck]

PCIe 6.0 is still on track for 2021. It will be x4 times faster than PCIe 4 and x2 times faster than PCIe 5.0 which will supposedly be available this year.

x4 lane in different PCIe versions, the standard for a good NVMe:
PCIe 3.0 - 3.94GB/s
PCIe 4.0 - 7.88GB/s
PCIe 5.0 - 15.75GB/s
PCIe 6.0 - 31.51GB/s

So if anyone was scared PC gamers will be left behind, don't worry, their 30GB/s NVMe next year will be OK with games built around the PS5's SSD :)

Click to shrink...

This is why I am holding off on building a new computer. Some awesome tech coming relatively soon.

 

[DrKeo]

This is why I am holding off on building a new computer. Some awesome tech coming relatively soon.

Click to shrink...

I don't even care past PCIe 5.0. GPUs couldn't care less if you place them on a PCIe 3 or PCIe 6 lane, SSD data transfer like copying files is limited by the drive you are copying from or to (which is usually much slower than your SSD) and even if gaming is finally going to start using SSDs, if PS5 and XSX will load in a matter of a few seconds, how much faster will it be on a PCIe 6.0 SSD? 0.9 seconds instead of 1.8 seconds? We are reaching the "I just don't care anymore" territory.

 

[ILikeFeet]

This is why I am holding off on building a new computer. Some awesome tech coming relatively soon.

Click to shrink...

Yea, nah. Pcie 4.0 was finalized in 2017 and is only now coming out. 5.0 is for servers and shit

 

[DrDeckard]

The next big thing In the coming years will be optane....if Intel's investment pays off. Everything we have seen currently is childsplay compared to their plans, and was more to introduce the name.

It's a big if but if intel can get a system to the point where your ssd and memory is on the same optane chips and it's all unified the next gen of pcs will fly.

But back to these consoles, I need more info soon. Looking forward to ms dropping a little extra something and creating some hype again.

 

[DrKeo]

Yea, nah. Pcie 4.0 was finalized in 2017 and is only now coming out. 5.0 is for servers and shit

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You will probably see first consumer PCIe 5.0 parts in 2021.

 

[DrDeckard]

You will probably see first consumer PCIe 5.0 parts in 2021.

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Definitely, theres a reason intel are more or less skipping pcie 4.0 for their mainstream consumer chipsets.

 

[orava]

PCIe 6.0 is still on track for 2021. It will be x4 times faster than PCIe 4 and x2 times faster than PCIe 5.0 which will supposedly be available this year.

x4 lane in different PCIe versions, the standard for a good NVMe:
PCIe 3.0 - 3.94GB/s
PCIe 4.0 - 7.88GB/s
PCIe 5.0 - 15.75GB/s
PCIe 6.0 - 31.51GB/s

So if anyone was scared PC gamers will be left behind, don't worry, their 30GB/s NVMe next year will be OK with games built around the PS5's SSD :)

Click to shrink...

The manufacturers throw billions to research and develop this tech and entire companies are dedicated to just some parts of it. Sony's division is not going to develop anything that you would want to put to your PC. If it's heavily customized, It might be more optimal in some situations, especially in some gaming related tasks, but there must be compromises and it's going to be lacking as a general purpose drive. Software side must be taken into consideration too and this kind of specialization comes also with a cost.

 

[M4xim1l1ano]

Thank you very very very much. You saved my day. :D

I wonder what happened to this tech. I hope to see it back on XSX.

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I loved the idea back then but I think they said it was too expensive/not feasible but that was back then.

I hope that with tech advances that it can be made to a reasonable price, at least below the surface studio in price.. obviously not for everyone but eventually it would reach mass market price.. I think.

Nonetheless, cool as hell!

 

[taggen86]

Tomorrow we might get some rdna 2 news from AMD.

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What is happening tomorrow?

 

[anexanhume]

Definitely, theres a reason intel are more or less skipping pcie 4.0 for their mainstream consumer chipsets.

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Intel got caught with their pants down when AMD chose to support 4.0 so they quickly announced 5.0 support to give the appearance of playing catch up. If it was an isolated incident I'd ignore it, but this is emblematic of their slow roll of features because they had a stranglehold on the market.

 

[modiz]

Tomorrow we might get some rdna 2 news from AMD.

Click to shrink...

On March 5th, not tomorrow

 

[Gay Bowser]

This is why I am holding off on building a new computer. Some awesome tech coming relatively soon.

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There is always awesome tech coming relatively soon.

 

[tusharngf]

What is happening tomorrow?

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Oh snap... Yes march 5th...rdna2 big navi announcement from amd

 

[Silencerx98]

Info dump on RDNA2 will be the most exciting news this month, just accept it, folks

 

[Adookah]

I'll take it, as I have actually done this before.

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Oh man I liked your old avatar, the new one is a nightmare.

 

[Raide]

Info dump on RDNA2 will be the most exciting news this month, just accept it, folks

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Sounds likely but this might be the place they show off Series X in some small capacity...maybe...

 

[DrKeo]

The manufacturers throw billions to research and develop this tech and entire companies are dedicated to just some parts of it. Sony's division is not going to develop anything that you would want to put to your PC. If it's heavily customized, It might be more optimal in some situations, especially in some gaming related tasks, but there must be compromises and it's going to be lacking as a general purpose drive. Software side must be taken into consideration too and this kind of specialization comes also with a cost.

Click to shrink...

My comment was meant for people who worry about how "PC will hold back PS5". It's just a reminder that no matter how fast or big of a number Sony and MS shows us, it will always be beaten by a large margin by some PC part and it doesn't matter if it's TF, memory, CPU or SSD, PC will always win because it has a limitless budget and it's constantly evolving. Yes, costume file structures and such will help consoles punch above their weight, but you can't fight x8 times faster brute force SSD.

Intel got caught with their pants down when AMD chose to support 4.0 so they quickly announced 5.0 support to give the appearance of playing catch up. If it was an isolated incident I'd ignore it, but this is emblematic of their slow roll of features because they had a stranglehold on the market.

Click to shrink...

Both Intel and AMD are slow frigates, reacting today by building architectures that will be ready in 2-3 years. Intel have messed up big with its 10nm process, Intel is stuck on 14nm (it's not TSMC's 14nm, Intel's is closer to TSMC's 10nm, but still far off TSMC's 7nm), so AMD has them cornered right now. But the CPU business is a fickle one, today Zen rules, in a few years 12000 series might rule. I wonder how well AMD will hold against intel when they are on the same manufacturing node. If Intel's plan to go 7nm (and that's Intel's 7nm, which is denser than TSMC's 5nm) goes well, who knows how the CPU market will look in two years.

These days are exciting times for CPUs after a decade of an Intel monopoly.

 

[BreakAtmo]

Oh man I liked your old avatar, the new one is a nightmare.

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Honestly I wish they'd gone for something hilariously terrible, this is just kind of boring.

 

[Deleted member 12635]

Tomorrow we might get some rdna 2 news from AMD.

Click to shrink...

What happens tomorrow?

 

[anexanhume]

Both Intel and AMD are slow frigates, reacting today by building architectures that will be ready in 2-3 years. Intel have messed up big with its 10nm process, Intel is stuck on 14nm (it's not TSMC's 14nm, Intel's is closer to TSMC's 10nm, but still far off TSMC's 7nm), so AMD has them cornered right now. But the CPU business is a fickle one, today Zen rules, in a few years 12000 series might rule. I wonder how well AMD will hold against intel when they are on the same manufacturing node. If Intel's plan to go 7nm (and that's Intel's 7nm, which is denser than TSMC's 5nm) goes well, who knows how the CPU market will look in two years.

This days are exciting times for CPUs after a decade of an Intel monopoly.

Click to shrink...

I don't think Intel will regain process parity. At least not in the next 5 years. TSMC is rolling out 5nm this year, which would probably be equivalent or slightly behind whatever 7nm process Intel has cooked up. Meanwhile, Intel's new architecture Sunny Cove is trapped without a good node to roll out on. Intel's troubles aren't near an end yet.

 

[tusharngf]

What happens tomorrow?

Click to shrink...

Typo... March 5th ..AMD might unveil the details of big navi and rdna 2 architecture . What happened to your avatar. I just noticed.

AMD might detail new RDNA2 graphics card on March 5

On Financial Analysts Day AMD would share the first details about the new graphics cards that AMD has in the works. According to Mithun Chandrasekhar, the man behind Radeon product management, 'Big N...

www.guru3d.com

 

[Midas]

I only came to realize that I made an avatar bet with that date, this week. I thought it was just all fun :lol

Best of it all, I only today realized that it lasts until release of the console.

 

[Silencerx98]

Sounds likely but this might be the place they show off Series X in some small capacity...maybe...

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What else do you need to know about Series X from the GPU side at this point? We know it's 12TFs, RDNA2 and has hardware accelerated ray tracing. If you want to know the more exact details like the clockspeeds and computing units enabled, that will probably have to wait until closer to release. For now, even an announcement for AMD's RDNA2 lineup this year would be exciting because it would allow us to potentially guess which GPU's are used as the base for both consoles

 

[Raide]

What else do you need to know about Series X from the GPU side at this point? We know it's 12TFs, RDNA2 and has hardware accelerated ray tracing. If you want to know the more exact details like the clockspeeds and computing units enabled, that will probably have to wait until closer to release. For now, even an announcement for AMD's RDNA2 lineup this year would be exciting because it would allow us to potentially guess which GPU's are used as the base for both consoles

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More interested in the performance gains that RDNA 2 has over 1. Some actual examples would also be nice. Also interested to see what other technologies RDNA will bring to the table and their uses in the future.

 

[Deleted member 12635]

Typo... March 5th ..AMD might unveil the details of big navi and rdna 2 architecture details. What happened to your avatar. I just noticed.

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Thanks.

To your question, I lost a bet that next gen consoles would achieve not more than 10.xTF with the announcement of Series X being 12 TF. That bet was made May 2019, so it was foreseeable since last December 2019 that I will lose it when I for myself started to predict 12 TF for Xbox based on the information we already got at that point in time. I lost the bet for the greater good so to say lol.

Though the bet was only to wear the avatar for a week or so. Tomorrow the week is over and I will probably change back to my normal avatar.

 

[orava]

Typo... March 5th ..AMD might unveil the details of big navi and rdna 2 architecture . What happened to your avatar. I just noticed.

AMD might detail new RDNA2 graphics card on March 5

On Financial Analysts Day AMD would share the first details about the new graphics cards that AMD has in the works. According to Mithun Chandrasekhar, the man behind Radeon product management, 'Big N...

www.guru3d.com

Click to shrink...

 

[Pheonix]

If PS5 is over 9.2 but under XSX, then waiting and letting the 9.2 figure simmer in is smart IMO. If in a month or two every one is sure PS5 is 9.2TF and Sony announces PS5 is 10.5TF, everyone will applaud. Making everyone happy with an announcement of you being weaker than your competition is very hard. Smart strategy IMO if that's the case.

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I agree 100%, that why I said its a great strategy.

Everyone ha the PS5o be at 9.2TF now. Sony doesn't have to be at 12tf or over, they just now have to be over 10TF. Then they can talk up focusing on things like SSD and memory bandwidth (if they are better in those areas) making it sound like "hey we could have done 12TF if we wanted but we just wanted to make an all-round better-balanced system".

Smart move if that's what they are doing. But if they are really at 9.2TF or god forbid less, then there is no amount of talking up other features they can do that would shift the focus from the power gap between the two consoles.

 

[DrKeo]

I don't think Intel will regain process parity. At least not in the next 5 years. TSMC is rolling out 5nm this year, which would probably be equivalent or slightly behind whatever 7nm process Intel has cooked up. Meanwhile, Intel's new architecture Sunny Cove is trapped without a good node to roll out on. Intel's troubles aren't near an end yet.

Click to shrink...

Intel's timeline right now is 2021 for 7nm EUV (this is from December 2019):

It doesn't mean they will hit it, but at some point, Intel will finally get off 14nm and will successfully manufacture on a new node. If Intel successfully moves to 7nm EUV in 2022, they will have a better manufacturing node than AMD at that time frame (assuming AMD will be on TSMC's 5nm or even N5P by 2022). On the same node ballpark, my money is on Intel.

As long as Intel is stuck on a bigger node, AMD will enjoy an advantage. but I wouldn't count out Intel, they can't f*ck up their new nodes forever.

 

[anexanhume]

Intel's timeline right now is 2021 for 7nm EUV (this is from December 2019):

It doesn't mean they will hit it, but at some point, Intel will finally get off 14nm and will successfully manufacture on a new node. If Intel successfully moves to 7nm EUV in 2021 or 2022, they will have a better manufacturing node than AMD at that time frame (assuming AMD will be on TSMC's 5nm or even N5P by 2022). On the same node ballpark, my money is on Intel.

As long as they are stuck on a bigger node than AMD, AMD will enjoy and advantage. but I wouldn't count out Intel, they can't f*ck up their new nodes forever.

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Intel's 7nm is only slightly more dense than TSMC's 5nm, and 5NP is entering risk production this year, so I'd be surprised if we don't see Zen 4 on 5NP by Fall 2021. I imagine AMD will just skip right over 5N given how quickly 5NP is on its heels and the fact they're compatible. We recently found that even Navi 10 from Summer last year is 7NP, not 7N like we had been assuming all along.

I don't think anyone has full confidence Intel will meet their 7nm dates, particularly since 10nm has gone so poorly and Intel hasn't been forthcoming about exactly what went wrong. The technology paths are supposedly completely independent, but I don't know anyone who has full confidence in them at this point.

 

[Puffy]

 

[Sekiro]

Click to shrink...

*Slams door shut*

 

[DrKeo]

Intel's 7nm is only slightly more dense than TSMC's 5nm, and 5NP is entering risk production this year, so I'd be surprised if we don't see Zen 4 on 5NP by Fall 2021. I imagine AMD will just skip right over 5N given how quickly 5NP is on its heels and the fact they're compatible. We recently found that even Navi 10 from Summer last year is 7NP, not 7N like we had been assuming all along.

I don't think anyone has full confidence Intel will meet their 7nm dates, particularly since 10nm has gone so poorly and Intel hasn't been forthcoming about exactly what went wrong. The technology paths are supposedly completely independent, but I don't know anyone who has full confidence in them at this point.

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I don't know if Intel will hit 7nm or not, right now they are saying it's on track, but who knows. As I've said, once Intel and AMD will be on the same node ballpark, Intel will have the upper hand IMO. The only question is, will Intel f*ck up another node.

 

[Md Ray]

This is incorrect. If you check the hardware unboxed (or the DF) review of the 3700x, you can see that the 9700k outperform it in gaming. And that is before taking account of the overclock of his 9700k and the underclock of the 3700 x in next gen. the 3700x is only more powerful in productivity tasks. But not even that would be true here given the vast difference in clocks.

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That is because none of the games use more than 8 threads at the moment. When next-gen games will utilize over 8 threads, the 9700K will struggle and you will see the result in the form of 1% and 0.1% Low (Min FPS) being lower than 3700X. 9700K's only advantage over Zen 2 maybe is its high clock speed and perhaps lower latency cores due to ring bus architecture which will result in higher Avg. FPS, but that alone doesn't tell the full story. Lack of hyper-threading in CPU when running titles that make use of HT will mean there'll be stutters and hitches in those titles in the future. I think Intel not allowing its 9700K to have more than 8 threads is ultimately going to hurt the 9700K users running next-gen CPU-intensive titles, there's very little to no headroom. It should have been at least a 12 thread CPU for the price they charged for that CPU.

 

[Thera]

PCIe 6.0 is still on track for 2021. It will be x4 times faster than PCIe 4 and x2 times faster than PCIe 5.0 which will supposedly be available this year.

x4 lane in different PCIe versions, the standard for a good NVMe:
PCIe 3.0 - 3.94GB/s
PCIe 4.0 - 7.88GB/s
PCIe 5.0 - 15.75GB/s
PCIe 6.0 - 31.51GB/s

So if anyone was scared PC gamers will be left behind, don't worry, their 30GB/s NVMe next year will be OK with games built around the PS5's SSD :)

Click to shrink...

30GB next year, are you high?
This is not because the lane can handle that speed that the disk will have it.

My comment was meant for people who worry about how "PC will hold back PS5". It's just a reminder that no matter how fast or big of a number Sony and MS shows us, it will always be beaten by a large margin by some PC part and it doesn't matter if it's TF, memory, CPU or SSD, PC will always win because it has a limitless budget and it's constantly evolving

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The problem isn't about what is the max PC can do. Of course it will always beat console.

The problem is mininum specs. At which point SSD and RT will be mandatory is the only relevant question.
Until this point, yes, PC will hold back design choices.

 

[Deleted member 12635]

I agree 100%, that why I said its a great strategy.

Everyone ha the PS5o be at 9.2TF now. Sony doesn't have to be at 12tf or over, they just now have to be over 10TF. Then they can talk up focusing on things like SSD and memory bandwidth (if they are better in those areas) making it sound like "hey we could have done 12TF if we wanted but we just wanted to make an all-round better-balanced system".

Smart move if that's what they are doing. But if they are really at 9.2TF or god forbid less, then there is no amount of talking up other features they can do that would shift the focus from the power gap between the two consoles.

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While the positive effect would be there based on some expectations ( mine for instance ), to say that the current situation is based on a Sony strategy is a little bit far fetched. That would imply that Sony planned to have Github as a controlled leak.

Btw If Github would not exist, my prediction would be still full range 9 to 11 TF or even now 12 TF because other than code names, some capabilities and clocks we would not know much about the PS5.

 

[chris 1515]

My comment was meant for people who worry about how "PC will hold back PS5". It's just a reminder that no matter how fast or big of a number Sony and MS shows us, it will always be beaten by a large margin by some PC part and it doesn't matter if it's TF, memory, CPU or SSD, PC will always win because it has a limitless budget and it's constantly evolving. Yes, costume file structures and such will help consoles punch above their weight, but you can't fight x8 times faster brute force SSD.


Both Intel and AMD are slow frigates, reacting today by building architectures that will be ready in 2-3 years. Intel have messed up big with its 10nm process, Intel is stuck on 14nm (it's not TSMC's 14nm, Intel's is closer to TSMC's 10nm, but still far off TSMC's 7nm), so AMD has them cornered right now. But the CPU business is a fickle one, today Zen rules, in a few years 12000 series might rule. I wonder how well AMD will hold against intel when they are on the same manufacturing node. If Intel's plan to go 7nm (and that's Intel's 7nm, which is denser than TSMC's 5nm) goes well, who knows how the CPU market will look in two years.

These days are exciting times for CPUs after a decade of an Intel monopoly.

Click to shrink...

Brute for SSD will nor help nothing currently SSD NVMe are barely faster than SATA SSD and speed is theorical in games.

They need to step up from a software point of view. I expect SSD to go faster on console than PC.


https:www.techspot.com/amp/review/1893-pcie-4-vs-pcie-3-ssd/

Corsair MP600 PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD review

It's time to review some next-level M.2. NVMe in a sixth gear, yes we review the Corsair MP600. Of course it is an SSD you can seat into any PCIe 3.0 compatible PC, however, if you place it into a ...

www.guru3d.com

This a 5 GB/s SSD. Divide the speed of the SSD by 4maybz it will what you have in game if we see PCIE 5 SSD soon

With faster SSD with a software environnement not made for it I expect SSD PCIE5 or even 6 to not have performance near the max theoretical at all. It will probably worse for CPU bottleneck just for read data. I don't even expect any decompression not all people have a threadripper CPU.

Again 15 or 32 GB/s will not be the performance in game performance at all if nothing change on a software point of view. Far from it, if you're need to divide by three the SSD performance. I think PS5 will have be ok for a long time.

And when people or devs talk about PC holding back PS5 or Xbox Series X, it is on streaming side.

If a game is designed around the consoles SSD speed it needs to stutters on all slower SSD if you want to keep the same level of detail and I suppose to it means you need to do a big effort around the data to make the game work on other system and downgrade the experience like Star citizen have problem on HDD.

I would say on SSD the system and game are as fast as the slowest element, the storage.



If there is nothing done on software side for improve OS and filesystem around SSD I don't think something will change.

I expect the SSD speed to be slow down by a bottleneck(CPU?) somewhere and maybe we will see SSD reaching a bottleneck in term of speed in game on PC

 

[orava]

30GB next year, are you high?
This is not because the lane can handle that speed that the disk will have it.

The problem isn't about what is the max PC can do. Of course it will always beat console.

The problem is mininum specs. At which point SSD and RT will be mandatory is the only relevant question.
Until this point, yes, PC will hold back design choices.

Click to shrink...

No it won't. Most games aren't even going to rely on SSD performance, especially in the early years of the new console generation. We also need to look at the unit numbers here. Next gen consoles with SSDs aren't going to be overtaking the last gen console base instantly and right now there are already millions of PCs that can handle those requirements easily. When the consoles launch, the PC hardware base that have SSDs will already be larger than the next gen console base and this will not change.

 

[chris 1515]

No it won't. Most games aren't even going to rely on SSD performance, especially in the early years of the new console generation. We also need to look at the unit numbers here. Next gen consoles with SSDs aren't going to be overtaking the last gen console base instantly and right now there are already millions of PCs that can handle those requirements easily. When the consoles launch, the PC hardware base that have SSDs will already be larger than the next gen console base and this will not change.

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But how many player have a 3.75 GB/s SSD the speed of the Xbox Series X one? After I don't expect multiplatform game to design game around this speed. This will be what first party will do, at least on Sony side.

 

[ManOfWar]

No it won't. Most games aren't even going to rely on SSD performance, especially in the early years of the new console generation. We also need to look at the unit numbers here. Next gen consoles with SSDs aren't going to be overtaking the last gen console base instantly and right now there are already millions of PCs that can handle those requirements easily. When the consoles launch, the PC hardware base that have SSDs will already be larger than the next gen console base and this will not change.

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Instantly? No. But should things play out as they did last time, we are looking to a migration at a pace never seen before.

Back in 2013, high profile releases for PS3 and X360 died out pretty much instantly.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

No it won't. Most games aren't even going to rely on SSD performance, especially in the early years of the new console generation. We also need to look at the unit numbers here. Next gen consoles with SSDs aren't going to be overtaking the last gen console base instantly and right now there are already millions of PCs that can handle those requirements easily. When the consoles launch, the PC hardware base that have SSDs will already be larger than the next gen console base and this will not change.

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Next gen consoles don't have to have any where near last gen numbers .
Once more people buying games on next gen that is what more important and then games will be build around that .
So in about 2 years and the question then becomes will PC have SSD as min spec and what speed.
With one year of consoles sales more people will have RT hardware than PC and it was out for 3 years on PC if we get sales like this gen .

 

[DigSCCP]

If PS5 is over 9.2 but under XSX, then waiting and letting the 9.2 figure simmer in is smart IMO. If in a month or two every one is sure PS5 is 9.2TF and Sony announces PS5 is 10.5TF, everyone will applaud. Making everyone happy with an announcement of you being weaker than your competition is very hard. Smart strategy IMO if that's the case.

Click to shrink...

I don't know if it's a matter of strategy on the TF count only but I said this before here : if they manage to get a console on the two digits mark, it could be 10.1TF, and at the same this machine being cheaper than Series X that would be a huge win for them, specially if it's US100 less.
In my opinion a much bigger win than coming close, matching or even surpassing the Series X at the same price.

 

[anexanhume]

I don't know if Intel will hit 7nm or not, right now they are saying it's on track, but who knows. As I've said, once Intel and AMD will be on the same node ballpark, Intel will have the upper hand IMO. The only question is, will Intel f*ck up another node.

Click to shrink...

Why do you assume Intel will have the upper hand? Supposedly Zen 3 is the biggest change gen over gen since Zen was introduced and has another 10-15% IPC gains. I expect they'll slightly improve the memory system yet again and negate the disadvantages of going chiplet even further.

 

[orava]

But how many player have a 3.75 GB/s SSD the speed of the Xbox Series X one? After I don't expect multiplatform game to design game around this speed. This will be what first party will do, at least on Sony side.

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I'd say enough people will have that or at least something close enough. Especially closer to launch and few years after that. Also any modern SSD drive, be it a regular sata version or a newer NVME, will be perfectly fine for multiplats, even if the game is "designed around faster drives". The quote itself is a bit silly because if you design game around SSD tech, it will be beneficial to the slower drives too. The hardware requirements will have various speed SSD levels in them but it does not mean that the hardware is not there already.

I'd say that the consoles will actually be at the middle of the SSD hardware spectrum relatively quickly and then drop to lower end with majority of lower end PC's catching up. We can clearly see how quickly the tech advances.

 

[DrKeo]

30GB next year, are you high?
This is not because the lane can handle that speed that the disk will have it.

The problem isn't about what is the max PC can do. Of course it will always beat console.

The problem is mininum specs. At which point SSD and RT will be mandatory is the only relevant question.
Until this point, yes, PC will hold back design choices.

Click to shrink...

Lol, PC holding consoles back :)

Never have been, never will be.

Brute for SSD will nor help nothing currently SSD NVMe are barely faster than SATA SSD and speed is theorical in games.

They need to step up from a software point of view. I expect SSD to go faster on console than PC.


https:www.techspot.com/amp/review/1893-pcie-4-vs-pcie-3-ssd/

Corsair MP600 PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD review

It's time to review some next-level M.2. NVMe in a sixth gear, yes we review the Corsair MP600. Of course it is an SSD you can seat into any PCIe 3.0 compatible PC, however, if you place it into a ...

www.guru3d.com

This a 5 GB/s SSD. Divide the speed of the SSD by 4maybz it will what you have in game if we see PCIE 5 SSD soon

With faster SSD with a software environnement not made for it I expect SSD PCIE5 or even 6 to not have performance near the max theoretical at all. It will probably worse for CPU bottleneck just for read data. I don't even expect any decompression not all people have a threadripper CPU.

Again 15 or 32 GB/s will not be the performance in game performance at all if nothing change on a software point of view. Far from it, if you're need to divide by three the SSD performance. I think PS5 will have be ok for a long time.

And when people or devs talk about PC holding back PS5 or Xbox Series X, it is on streaming side.

If a game is designed around the consoles SSD speed it needs to stutters on all slower SSD if you want to keep the same level of detail and I suppose to it means you need to do a big effort around the data to make the game work on other system and downgrade the experience like Star citizen have problem on HDD.

I would say on SSD the system and game are as fast as the slowest element, the storage.



If there is nothing done on software side for improve OS and filesystem around SSD I don't think something will change.

I expect the SSD speed to be slow down by a bottleneck(CPU?) somewhere and maybe we will see SSD reaching a bottleneck in term of speed in game on PC

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Games are not designed around NVMe drives today, once they will, thing will change even without a new file structure. Don't bring me random benchmarks of games built around spinning plates, take a look at Star Citizen instead.

Why do you assume Intel will have the upper hand? Supposedly Zen 3 is the biggest change gen over gen since Zen was introduced and has another 10-15% IPC gains. I expect they'll slightly improve the memory system yet again and negate the disadvantages of going chiplet even further.

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AMD on 7nm can't match Intel's single core performance on 14nm. That's why I'm having a hard time believing Intel will be in the same situation once they achieve node parity.