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Sorian

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,964
Trump said there had allready been 7 fbi investigations, so they won't find shit.....what blows my mind if this guy sat there and pretty much thinks this is a left wing attack on him...

If he gets confirmed you are going to have someone with a lot of power, very angry and hurt. Democrats and left leaning folks should be very afraid

Maybe of the next guy but I still don't see how Kavanaugh isn't done. Anyone who matters to this is distancing themselves as much as possible already. With three accusers and at least one of the other two meeting with the FBI what sounds like tomorrow or Sunday at the latest, this is going to dig up too much shit for him to even make it to a vote. He'll withdraw via a mouth piece, things will settle, and Trump will keep revving this "search and destroy" conspiracy engine within a week.
 
Oct 26, 2017
948
Trump said there had allready been 7 fbi investigations, so they won't find shit.....what blows my mind if this guy sat there and pretty much thinks this is a left wing attack on him...

If he gets confirmed you are going to have someone with a lot of power, very angry and hurt. Democrats and left leaning folks should be very afraid

Again, not a single accusation had been made until now. They didn't find anything in the past because no one had come forward until now. You can't investigate something that you have no evidence of. Even if they did ask about things of this nature, who did they talk to? His friends? His employers? His family? His friends could easily write it off as there were no accusations made and no one else likely knew due to him hiding that side of himself from them.
 

Deleted member 29806

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 2, 2017
2,047
Germany
Setting aside the sex assault allegations for a moment, his behavior yesterday showed he is unfit to serve on the Supreme Court, and should be removed from his current position. He openly threatened the Democratic Party with retribution from the bench with the whole "what goes around, comes around", and the parroting of trump's bullshit claims that this is all a Democratic smear campaign. He showed that is is incapable of being an impartial judge.
I think your country is far beyond that being even a requirement even if that constitution thingie may say it should be so.
 

Luminish

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,508
Denver
I am genuinely curious to see the reaction on this side of the site, if the FBI after their investigation shows that there is a lack of evidence to corroborate Ford's testimony.
I am fully prepared for them to come out with nothing, and am already kinda mad at democrats for putting to much faith in it. More fair investigation doesn't hurt, but we already have enough to declare Kavanaugh unfit and the moderates voting for it will absolutely do major damage to the culture and psyche of our nation.

I would be slightly prepared for the FBI to be terrible and declare far too much innocence on far too little evidence because there's a lot of terrible individuals within the FBI, which the FBI would deserve to be called out on.

Them coming out with hard evidence of innocence is a hypothetical that's too extreme to waste braincells on. The hardcore conspiracy nuts including Lindsey Graham will have to provide the goods to deserve even the littlest time of day on that.
 
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Saya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,972
Trump said there had allready been 7 fbi investigations, so they won't find shit.....what blows my mind if this guy sat there and pretty much thinks this is a left wing attack on him...

If he gets confirmed you are going to have someone with a lot of power, very angry and hurt. Democrats and left leaning folks should be very afraid

He's already angry and hurt and looking for revenge. What's there to lose?
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,710
Trump said there had allready been 7 fbi investigations, so they won't find shit.....what blows my mind if this guy sat there and pretty much thinks this is a left wing attack on him...

If he gets confirmed you are going to have someone with a lot of power, very angry and hurt. Democrats and left leaning folks should be very afraid

What you saw was always there, just hidden. He would be 1 of 9 and Roberts isn't going to let him get out of line. You may see some crazy dissents or concurrences, but so what, he is voting like other conservative judges would anyway. This guy was always going to be bad news for most progressive positions, nothing changes with his hurt feelings.
 

starpower

The Fallen
Jan 23, 2018
4,008
Canada
ubha9I5.png


This is truly an amazing picture
holy shit
 

Oilvomer

Banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
775
Good article on BBC about how America now is simply about picking a side, regardless of truth, and it started with Clinton

Modern-day Washington is about scoring partisan points. Winning tribal battles. The pursuit of the truth seems far less important than the pursuit of an outright political victory. Zero sum politics at its most rancorous and bloody.

What we are watching in the Kavanaugh confirmation process is the latest clash in a partisan and ideological war that's been intensifying for decades, and which has been fuelled by the Trump presidency and the MeToo campaign.

When in the summer of 1998 the president's lies about his affair with the young White House intern were exposed, and his denials were no longer scientifically tenable, he delivered a televised address noteworthy less for its grudging admission of personal wrongdoing and more for his attack on the special prosecutor Kenneth Starr and his Republican sponsors.

Whatever the outcome of this zero sum game, the very notion of America itself surely ends up on the losing side.

Once again, those United States seem more like a continent than a country, shared land occupied by warring tribes. Whose side are you on in the Brett Kavanaugh row inevitably answers an even more delineating question: which of these two Americas you belong in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45673702
 

Jiraiya

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,306
The democrats were arguing it was unprecedented for a new allegation to arise about a nominee and the fbi not be allowed to investigate it. Which was what the Republicans were trying to skip on top of sealing records. Which they've also made a stink about.

It's not a case of democrats throwing a hell Maryb to stop kavanaugh.

Dude was always going to air on Trump's side...so this whole thing can't make him anymore angry or change how he would rule. I just wish people would stop acting like this is some last ditch effort to stop dude...that implies Ford was used.
 

shinra-bansho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,964
The GOP will seat someone to fill Kennedy's place.
They will either bulldoze Kavanaugh through despite credible allegations of sexual assault, or they will seat someone else.
Even if they were to lose the Senate in the midterms, Mitch McConnell would just seat someone during the lame duck session.
So, no one should be under the illusion that they won't find some just as much of a partisan hack and that the balance of the SCOTUS will shift. That was decided in November 2016.

It will.

But this man should not be the one to shift it.
 
Oct 30, 2017
4,190
Of course it's the Clintons fault. She must be impeached asap.

It's talking about the Clinton presidency in the 90s. Which doesn't entirely paint a proper picture. Newt Gingrich had a big hand in how things are today too. Something happened in between Reagan and Clinton that has changed this country in very bad ways. Before 2000, there no real "safe" blue or red states. HW Bush won California in 1988 and Clinton won a lot of the South twice.

Then in 2000 80% of the states basically voted one way and never changed.
 

Reeks

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,326
She was

It wasn't her explanation that was the problem, the country ain't gonna understand better

It was people's reaction, they are all like oozing "oh my God!" what a great explanation!

Like no fuck man, no. The senators whose job it is to vote on healthcare policy, who lack understanding, that's the fucking problem.

Colbert I love the man but I was like "dude wtf are u talking about" with the hippocampus and norepinephrine. They might as well be impressed by gibberish if that is impressive.

It is not the issue of what happened in this case, here inconsequential.

It just is reflective of the overall level of sheer ignorance of understanding of basic science by both population and people who make decisions like congress people and senators, they just don't even understand this shit in the slightest yet suppose to have professional authority to be able to judiciously apply their will to it, and that's fucking wrong.


I hear what you're saying but she didn't exactly just drop buzzwords. I didn't see Colbert, admittedly; however, she gave a decent explanation on the spot for a wide audience. She did a great job of making it accessible, especially given that the drop off between scientists and non scientists is fairly steep. <<I do have a minor criticism that the hippocampus would then relay the info to store long-term in the cortex>> blerp>> but for these purposes and this context, it was a great way to introduce how intense memories are preferentially coded in the brain via increased secretion of norepinephrine. I'm not sure that's exactly rudimentary, although I agree that most people don't have the slightest grasp of how the brain and memory encoding/consolidation works. Neuroscientists are still bickering about the finer details of these processes.... lay people are frustrating but that's because we need to pay attention to more people like Dr. Ford. One more, albeit peripheral, reason to be saddened that her testimony has fallen on many deaf ears.
She could not have been a better witness.
The very things people are using to "poke holes" in her testimory are the things that make it strong, because they reflect how memory actually works. That is what's most frustrating to me.

Edit: fixed a typo
 

BDS

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,845
Good article on BBC about how America now is simply about picking a side, regardless of truth, and it started with Clinton







https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45673702

Article is a load of revisionist nonsense. Modern partisanship in American originated with Roger Ailes and the Nixon investigation. Ailes and others believed that Nixon was innocent, the victim of a smear campaign by the "liberal media," and that Republicans had fallen for it. He vowed never to let it happen again. In the mid-90s, Newt Gingrich spearheaded the Republican Revolution, which took back Congress. Like Ailes, Gingrich believed that George H. W. Bush was a good president destroyed by an evil lying liberal media and Democratic establishment. At the same time, Ailes became head of a new network, Fox News. Gingrich and Ailes, and the Republican establishment, took on a new strategy: partisanship. No compromise, no cooperation, no working together, no civility. Democrats are the enemy, liars and traitors who must be destroyed. They believed that there is no "truth," only competing facts reported by a liberal or conservative source, and that it was their duty and their right to spread their version of the facts to the American public. Together, their strategy rewrote the rules of American politics, into the era that we're in today.
 

Oilvomer

Banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
775
Article is a load of revisionist nonsense. Modern partisanship in American originated with Roger Ailes and the Nixon investigation. Ailes and others believed that Nixon was innocent, the victim of a smear campaign by the "liberal media," and that Republicans had fallen for it. He vowed never to let it happen again. In the mid-90s, Newt Gingrich spearheaded the Republican Revolution, which took back Congress. Like Ailes, Gingrich believed that George H. W. Bush was a good president destroyed by an evil lying liberal media and Democratic establishment. At the same time, Ailes became head of a new network, Fox News. Gingrich and Ailes, and the Republican establishment, took on a new strategy: partisanship. No compromise, no cooperation, no working together, no civility. Democrats are the enemy, liars and traitors who must be destroyed. They believed that there is no "truth," only competing facts reported by a liberal or conservative source, and that it was their duty and their right to spread their version of the facts to the American public. Together, their strategy rewrote the rules of American politics, into the era that we're in today.

Perhaps you should send the author your reply

https://www.twitter.com/NickBryantNY
 
Oct 26, 2017
948
Perhaps you should send the author your reply

https://www.twitter.com/NickBryantNY

Perhaps you should stop posting horseshit. You've done nothing but "just ask questions" in every thread you've been in on this subject and post links that do nothing but scream "both sides". I swear I'm about to lose my mind that people can look at what has been going on lately and still roll out both sides bullshit.
 

Oilvomer

Banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
775
User Banned (5 Days): Trolling. History of similar behaviour.
Perhaps you should stop posting horseshit. You've done nothing but "just ask questions" in every thread you've been in on this subject and post links that do nothing but scream "both sides". I swear I'm about to lose my mind that people can look at what has been going on lately and still roll out both sides bullshit.

Perhaps you are exactly what he says....don't like it, scream it down
 

Oilvomer

Banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
775
So uh what's the other side to Dr Fords arugument

Kavanaugh couldn't even make one, considering how many questions he dodged

Well his defence was his calendars, which I admit is the weirdest defence...but the issue is not about who I believe, the issue is over the article I posted, and the datails may be argued but the reality is the fundamental point is right, if you are a democrate he was guilty, if you are a republican he was innocent, and evidence matters not a bit...

And that should be concerning for all
 

Dust

C H A O S
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,478
What I don't get is that why are they clutching to Kavanaugh so hard, even if it means delay.
I am sure there are other super loyale soldiers in the GoP camp who can fit his shoes.
 

Maledict

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,104
What I don't get is that why are they clutching to Kavanaugh so hard, even if it means delay.
I am sure there are other super loyale soldiers in the GoP camp who can fit his shoes.

Because if you admit one sexual assault accusation might be true and makes the guy inappropriate, then maybe all of the accusations are true? Because the core philosophy of the Republican Party is 'beat the liberals' no matter what that entails? Because Kavanaugh has uniquely weird views on presidential power that would suit Trump much more than a standard conservative judge?

Some toxic mixture of all three plus a bunch of sexism as well no doubt.
 

SugarNoodles

Member
Nov 3, 2017
8,625
Portland, OR
Well his defence was his calendars, which I admit is the weirdest defence...but the issue is not about who I believe, the issue is over the article I posted, and the datails may be argued but the reality is the fundamental point is right, if you are a democrate he was guilty, if you are a republican he was innocent, and evidence matters not a bit...

And that should be concerning for all
Might help you understand the problem with your viewpoint

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_balance
 

weekev

Is this a test?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,215
Might help you understand the problem with your viewpoint

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_balance
I don't think that was their viewpoint.i think what Olivomor is saying is that an accusation of sexual assault is no longer being considered based on facts it is Dems vs Reps and that is concerning. Something as serious as this should not be a political debate. There should be nothing political about drugging someone and forcing your penis on them. And yet here we are.
 

luffie

Member
Dec 20, 2017
798
Indonesia
Well, on another note.... I actually think America is heading towards good times. Listen to me.

Trump being elected is sorta... a positive thing.

The evil that he has shown or exposed is not a sudden thing, it has already been going on for very long. Trump might be evil, but his party is the real enabler. Anyone with a conscience wouldn't even nominate him for presidential candidate.

So all this while, they(Republicans) have been corrupt in silence, with leaders/representative that knows to how hide the corruption. Now becoming a democrat doesn't grant you an automatic "good person" badge, but that's another matter.

So when they elected Donald, all these nonsense and nasty things start to happen, but does it though?
No, it already existed, but Donald's noise was such that it was brought to the media's and nation's attention. Deportation, racism, sexism, assault, corruption, lies, Trump's noise brought them to light.

With Trump exposing and empowering these bad stuffs, people are pushed to the brink, and thus #MeToo happened, people come forward, and you learnt that so many celebs and influential people like Cosby are shit. And oh, police racism and brutality too.

Take a moment to think, #MeToo is neither yesterday nor last year, it's many many years ago. Many years ago when reporting ain't gonna do shit, when you don't have the platform(social media) to voice out your truth, when fighting against all these corrupt people are just that much harder. Polansky, Spacey, Weinstein.... you name it. Reports were made, but there were no traction.

Just look at these links. These are the party of Christian values, and these are only the exposed ones.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...pponent/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.ac71944efa77

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2018/09/21/knoblach-ends-campaign-amid-abuse-allegations

Now without derailing too much, let's get to the main point. All the people Donald choose are shit, we've seen that. But the best thing is.... he exposes all these shit. Kava was already this shitty and have perhaps made the rape (not proven), regardless of the accusation. But now you see it, with your own eyes and ears, how terrible he is to a Supreme Judge, temperamental, evasive, derailing topics, making baseless partisan conspiracy theory. In my opinion, you don't even want him to be your honorary judge. Look at Lindsey, putting that fake shit show and spouting words of lies and hypocrisy. But was that just yesterday? No, it has been ever since, but now we saw them with our own eyes, and so we tremble, but it's good I tell you, now you are even clearer who is your enemy, (NO)thanks to Dotard. Thanks to him, someone found her courage to stand up for the truth and do her civic duty to fight against her nightmare.

Make no mistake, the entire party of demons is going to be the one that kills this Dotard, they will when they find his usefulness has end, and everyone will go and backtrack on how they always knew he was evil and disagree with him. Same lies.

So don't be too despaired and keep on fighting the good fight, since now that things are getting clearer, never give up, make noise, vote, protest, and enlighten. Anyone who says nothing can be done shouldn't lock their doors at night.

Sorry if I went a bit off tangent
 

shinra-bansho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,964
Well his defence was his calendars, which I admit is the weirdest defence...but the issue is not about who I believe, the issue is over the article I posted, and the datails may be argued but the reality is the fundamental point is right, if you are a democrate he was guilty, if you are a republican he was innocent, and evidence matters not a bit...

And that should be concerning for all
Sorry, but that's tripe.

Christine Blasey Ford made an earnest attempt to answer every question posed to her, as has been observed in analysis of her testimony. She has no motivation to recount her story in the public eye, she could have continued to live her quiet life. Blasey Ford showed no hint of malice or artifice. She was compelling, she was quiet but resolute. She was happy to submit to further investigation. She was honest about what she could not recall, and wished she could be more helpful, being incredibly respectful to members on both sides of the aisle.
That is why I believe Christine Blasey Ford.

Brett Kavanaugh has a vested interest in lying. Brett Kavanaugh lies regularly, from his very first commentary after being nominated, he was willing to bullshit to please Trump. Brett Kavanaugh has already mislead the Senate multiple times and under oath. He launched a partisan attack on the Committee Democrats, and feigned (poorly) indignation. He deflected questions that were posed. He sneered at a woman who began her questioning, with an anecdote about her alcoholic father, whether she had ever been blackout drunk. He showed his lifetime of privilege. He does not want the matter investigated thoroughly. Multiple accounts have come out about his characterisation of his drinking as untruthful, both before and after his testimony.
That is why I do not believe Brett Kavanaugh.

This is not a trial. It is a job interview. His life will not be over if he is not seated on the Supreme Court. He is not entitled to a Supreme Court seat.

Of course, this is probably pointless given you've "just asked questions" and that you've posted that his display of angry self-righteous nonsense was endearing.
 

Oilvomer

Banned for use of an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
775
I don't think that was their viewpoint.i think what Olivomor is saying is that an accusation of sexual assault is no longer being considered based on facts it is Dems vs Reps and that is concerning. Something as serious as this should not be a political debate. There should be nothing political about drugging someone and forcing your penis on them. And yet here we are.

Indeed it was my point, and the articles point...but because the article blamed Clinton for starting this tribalism, it caused tribalism.
 

RiPPn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,562
Phoenix
This was posted by someone on reddit, but I found it interesting and a small victory with at the very least pushing Kavanaugh off the October session of the court:

if you check out SCOTUSblog, you will see that on next month's docket is: Gamble v. U.S., No. 17-646. Issue(s): Whether the Supreme Court should overrule the "separate sovereigns" exception to the double jeopardy clause. They are desperate. The plan was to appoint Kavanaugh early this week so that he would be seated in time for this ruling. It was in the bag. Saves everyone involved from state charges. Not only Trump but all políticos who were knowingly enriched by the $$$ funneled through the NRA into the coffers of McConnell, Graham, Rubio, Ryan, etc. So if Kavanaugh gets appointed he'd effectively vote to stop states from charging Trump with anything."
 

luffie

Member
Dec 20, 2017
798
Indonesia
That is why I do not believe Brett Kavanaugh.

This is not a trial. It is a job interview. His life will not be over if he is not seated on the Supreme Court. He is not entitled to a Supreme Court seat.

Of course, this is probably pointless given you've "just asked questions" and that you've posted that his display of angry self-righteous nonsense was endearing.

Nah, while I know his life is not over if he isn't seated, his career SHOULD BE OVER theoretically.

Please, this is a judge, nominated for a position of authority as a Supreme Judge, a position that has "HONESTY", "IMPARTIAL" as a requirement. A position where he is trusted in good faith to make an honest and impartial policy that will decide the lives of the citizens. Even as a normal judge, honesty is practically required. To be shown that you are willing to lie in order to attain this important position, is to show how dangerous and deceitful you are, and should by all means be persecuted. But of course, the party of Republicons are going to make that extra difficult, since the best liar is in the top most position right now.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,676
London
Indeed it was my point, and the articles point...but because the article blamed Clinton for starting this tribalism, it caused tribalism.

I don't think it's quite fair in these sexual assault cases, the people on the left tend to be more on the victims side if they seem credible anyway. You don't get many saying its OK that boys have a bit of grope or the other crazy shit that the religious right say.
 

SchuckyDucky

Avenger
Nov 5, 2017
3,938
It's talking about the Clinton presidency in the 90s. Which doesn't entirely paint a proper picture. Newt Gingrich had a big hand in how things are today too. Something happened in between Reagan and Clinton that has changed this country in very bad ways. Before 2000, there no real "safe" blue or red states. HW Bush won California in 1988 and Clinton won a lot of the South twice.

Then in 2000 80% of the states basically voted one way and never changed.

One of the biggest things that happened between those two presidencies was the repeal of the Fairness Doctrine by the FCC during Reagan's presidency. It's one of the things that spurred the growth of right wing radio and media in the 90's.
 

darz1

Member
Dec 18, 2017
7,112
Well his defence was his calendars, which I admit is the weirdest defence...but the issue is not about who I believe, the issue is over the article I posted, and the datails may be argued but the reality is the fundamental point is right, if you are a democrate he was guilty, if you are a republican he was innocent, and evidence matters not a bit...

And that should be concerning for all
As a foreigner looking in, I have no horse in this race but in all honesty it seems like the Republicans are in the wrong in this case with their blind defence of Kavanaugh before during and after hearing from Ford and Kavanaugh.

And Im pretty sure the evidence actually does matter quite alot but the Republicans seem to be the ones who have been opposed to even investigating these accusation. You cant say both sides are in the wrong when one side is callig for an investigation and the other side is opposing an investigation.
 

Vennt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
647
One of the biggest things that happened between those two presidencies was the repeal of the Fairness Doctrine by the FCC during Reagan's presidency. It's one of the things that spurred the growth of right wing radio and media in the 90's.

Eclipsed by Citizens United IMO.

Probably one of the worst developments in your recent political history, and largely responsible for the political environment you now find yourselves in.
 

Bernd Lauert

Banned
May 27, 2018
1,812
As a foreigner looking in, I have no horse in this race but in all honesty it seems like the Republicans are in the wrong in this case with their blind defence of Kavanaugh before during and after hearing from Ford and Kavanaugh.

And Im pretty sure the evidence actually does matter quite alot but the Republicans seem to be the ones who have been opposed to even investigating these accusation. You cant say both sides are in the wrong when one side is callig for an investigation and the other side is opposing an investigation.

Republicans are arguing that they already did an investigation. They have sworn testimony from all the alleged witnesses.
 

hEist

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,054
Was thinking about this morning, if the FBI finds evidence by questioning Mark Judge, i am already prepared for Republicans playbook:
They majority will defend Kavanaugh by arguing/attacking him (Mark Judge) a la "why should we believe someone who got depression and anxiety and is a known alcoholic? Maybe he was under pressure by the FBI and he accidentally said something he didn't mean to. The American public knows how partisan the FBI is. Look at the Russian Witch Hunt."
 

RiPPn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,562
Phoenix
Republicans are arguing that they already did an investigation. They have sworn testimony from all the alleged witnesses.
They also know that isn't enough plus they were trying to blow off the other 2 accusers as if they didn't exist. In fact here is an article about an internal email that said they stymied the other accusers efforts to testify.

E-mails Show That Republican Senate Staff Stymied a Kavanaugh Accuser's Effort to Give Testimony

Was thinking about this morning, if the FBI finds evidence by questioning Mark Judge, i am already prepared for Republicans playbook:
They majority will defend Kavanaugh by arguing/attacking him (Mark Judge) a la "why should we believe someone who got depression and anxiety and is a known alcoholic? Maybe he was under pressure by the FBI and he accidentally said something he didn't mean to. The American public knows how partisan the FBI is. Look at the Russian Witch Hunt."
I don't think so, I think the FBI will report their findings if crucial asap and Kavanaugh will drop out / be forced out and they will get the ball rolling on a replacement asap.
 

PhoenixDark

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,089
White House
I am genuinely curious to see the reaction on this side of the site, if the FBI after their investigation shows that there is a lack of evidence to corroborate Ford's testimony.
It's basically going to be a report of statements from the people involved and come to no conclusions. I see no logical reason for wanting an FBI investigation besides to delay the confirmation.

We've seen this play out with Anita Hill. The report will give republicans cover to confirm Kavanaugh, and I'll have no issue with it (at least not as it relates to this case). You got what you asked for, there is no evidence, and I expect Judge to lie to the FBI in some way but they'll have no means of trapping him.
 
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