TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
well metropolis has been used a couple times in the franchise for different things. It could easily just be a name Eggman likes reusing.

(that said the term "metropolis" is a bit of a misnomer for a stage that's a single building.)
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
Since the game has kind of a SatAM theme to it, I'd expect more like Robotroplis
maxresdefault.jpg
 

TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
well again, that aspect is covered by the Green Hill and Chemical Plant stages. Grand Metropolis is the shining, advanced place you show for propaganda, they're the places where the prisoners are locked up.

also a thing about technology is that even the clean and nice looking stuff is still capable of affecting the environment. Look up what goes into the stuff your iPhone is made of. Just because it's pretty doesn't mean it doesn't fit Eggman's role as a bad guy.
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,458
One thing is for certain, we've all put in far more thought into this plot point than Sonic Team cared to for this release.
 

Vadara

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,565
Also as I side note I am looking at the lyrics of the Avatar songs and omg they are SO TONEDEAF

Like, they are just painfully melodramatic which does not fit at all with the game's haphazard and completely tonally incoherent plot. Like, I don't even hate Aqua Road, but:

Moonlight all around (My eyes are shining)
Shadows on the ground (My mind is flying)
Will there ever be an end? (There's no dividing)
Forever running from this lunacy
Moonlight coming down (My hope igniting)
Beaming through the clouds (My thoughts colliding)
Will we never see the end? (Just keep surviving)
Forever searching for my destiny (loop begin)
Battlefield... Illuminated...
What will be when it's over? Can you see?


These lyrics feel like they were written for a completely different game than Forces. Why are they so melancholy and over-the-top in a game that's often as stupidly jokey and light-hearted as Colors or Lost World again?
 
OP
OP
Redhead On Moped
Oct 25, 2017
3,859
USA, Sol 3, Universe 1
Just beat the Switch version in tabletop mode!

It may be 30 FPS, but it seems to be locked with only a single hiccup in my entire playthough.

I have now clocked 28 hours playing this game.

Holy shit.

Anyways Switch owners, if that's all you have or want to take it with you, don't hesitate on picking this version up. It is totally legit.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
So 3x bonus basically makes it so you only have to clear an avatar stage about 7 or 8 times before it's fully maxed out. I kid you not, replaying stage 25, I was able to earn about 3 bronze medals each time I finished the level, & I did this before the 30 bonus minutes were up

Also, it's really freaky that you can change the head of your character into an actual spring with matching gloves & shoes.
 
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Zaverious

Member
Oct 25, 2017
451
Those big air boosts you can do in stages like Mortar Canyon and Enemy Territory are pretty satisfying even though they ignore so much in the levels lol. I feel that boost in Forces is a lot better than the other games.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
Damn, finally maxed out the final avatar type, which got me 4 trophies at once (maxing out all avatar types, finishing all missions, getting all the avatar parts, & all the avatar weapons). Just need the 10 daily missions & I'll have the platinum. Edit: LOL you can just change the system date. Well, that wasn't too bad.

....I'm rather disappointed in that I can get Mega Drive & Sega SG-1000 bodysuits, but none based on Saturn or Dreamcast or Game Gear & what not. Oh well, I have to admit that they added a TON of options.

I'll try out the Shadow stuff eventually.
 
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Yukinari

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,538
The Danger Zone
After reading various posts talk about the game and how Sega showed off a different version at one point its no wonder why this game ended up the way it did.

It used to be focused on the OCs with Sonic as a downplayed character. Would explain why Classic Sonic feels so shoehorned too.

Forces was called Sonic Wars and it still mentions that name in the files of the PC version.
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
Just beat the Switch version in tabletop mode!

It may be 30 FPS, but it seems to be locked with only a single hiccup in my entire playthough.

I have now clocked 28 hours playing this game.

Holy shit.

Anyways Switch owners, if that's all you have or want to take it with you, don't hesitate on picking this version up. It is totally legit.
The Switch version is the one I own, and I thought it was fine. Watching videos on YouTube makes it obvious it's a graphical downgrade, but it doesn't look too bad
 

Camjo-Z

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,558
The city seen in Forces is a far cry from a place that could also be called Genocide City.
Genocidecityhack.png

I believe this is what Act 3 once looked like, set outside the factory of the first two zones

That's actually from a fan hack, interestingly the only official image we have of Genocide/Cyber City is a piece of concept art that shows it would have been more similar to something like Metallic Madness.

 

Auberji

Member
Oct 25, 2017
685
y'know honestly I get the hate but I genuinely had a fun time with this. The janky nature of the avatar character is almost charming - I managed to make mine look completely emotionless and white like a garage kit. Only thing that bummed me out was that final fight (
no super sonic fight? or for that matter a fight with Shadow or Chaos?
). Some of the levels are too short and it definitely feels like content is missing from inbetween levels in a way.

I'm gonna do some post game stuff since I actually like the idea of speed running it but I got so many S ranks the first way through. Just as an aside since I dunno if I've missed something or I need to round out some other stuff... is there really only 1 "EXTRA" stage?
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,787
NoVA
I'm gonna do some post game stuff since I actually like the idea of speed running it but I got so many S ranks the first way through. Just as an aside since I dunno if I've missed something or I need to round out some other stuff... is there really only 1 "EXTRA" stage?
There's more extra and secret stages, you get more as you get collectables in stages.
 

Deleted member 3010

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,974
Just beat the Switch version in tabletop mode!

It may be 30 FPS, but it seems to be locked with only a single hiccup in my entire playthough.

I have now clocked 28 hours playing this game.

Holy shit.

Anyways Switch owners, if that's all you have or want to take it with you, don't hesitate on picking this version up. It is totally legit.

If anything shines with the Switch version, it's the Handheld Mode.

Game looks great on the Switch screen, I wish I could say the same when it's docked, unfortunately the extra power wasn't tapped in.

Is there any differences between docked/undocked so far? Effects, LOD, anything?
 

Camjo-Z

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,558
how do you unlock those pieces

Pretty sure the shoes were for completing 25 SOS missions. Can't remember what the other gloves and scarf were from, unlocked them way earlier.

Speaking of which, having just finished the 30th SOS mission, I have now 100%'d the game! Certainly got more than 4 hours out of it, now if only my activity log would update to tell me just how many more...
 

Deleted member 9971

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,743
Ah screw it, i will give in and buy the game around the end of this month for Switch. Playable Shadow alone already is enough to me lol. And heck i enjoyed Sonic Black Knight and Secret Rings. Also i just want one more Switch game this year.... (Xeno 2 just is not for me imo and i will replay Zelda due to the story dlc anyway next month)
 

RecRoulette

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,044
Pretty sure the shoes were for completing 25 SOS missions. Can't remember what the other gloves and scarf were from, unlocked them way earlier.

Speaking of which, having just finished the 30th SOS mission, I have now 100%'d the game! Certainly got more than 4 hours out of it, now if only my activity log would update to tell me just how many more...
Fuck, I guess I gotta start grinding SOS missions.
 

Seyavesh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
636
Also as I side note I am looking at the lyrics of the Avatar songs and omg they are SO TONEDEAF

Like, they are just painfully melodramatic which does not fit at all with the game's haphazard and completely tonally incoherent plot. Like, I don't even hate Aqua Road, but:

Moonlight all around (My eyes are shining)
Shadows on the ground (My mind is flying)
Will there ever be an end? (There's no dividing)
Forever running from this lunacy
Moonlight coming down (My hope igniting)
Beaming through the clouds (My thoughts colliding)
Will we never see the end? (Just keep surviving)
Forever searching for my destiny (loop begin)
Battlefield... Illuminated...
What will be when it's over? Can you see?


These lyrics feel like they were written for a completely different game than Forces. Why are they so melancholy and over-the-top in a game that's often as stupidly jokey and light-hearted as Colors or Lost World again?

yeah that shit is GREAT and another reason why i wish there were more avatar stages

the section of fist bump that plays after the null space section heavily suggests your char was originally supposed to vanish or die or some bullshit fitting the randomly super edgy tonedeaf stuff in the story probably leftover from the old story

We can show the world what we can do
You are next to me and I'm next to you
Push me on through until the battle's won
No one's gonna give a thing to us
Into each other we put our trust
Standing united, after the fight

All alone, we will never be
The two, of us, are holding the key
We see, today, a world we couldn't see
Before I say goodbye to you
One more last fist bump...
 
OP
OP
Redhead On Moped
Oct 25, 2017
3,859
USA, Sol 3, Universe 1
Pretty sure the shoes were for completing 25 SOS missions. Can't remember what the other gloves and scarf were from, unlocked them way earlier.

Speaking of which, having just finished the 30th SOS mission, I have now 100%'d the game! Certainly got more than 4 hours out of it, now if only my activity log would update to tell me just how many more...
I wish Switch had the 3DS/U features as far as stats are concerned.
 

Zaverious

Member
Oct 25, 2017
451
The classic stages annoy me so much especially when trying to speed run them. If they weren't in the game and replaced with more avatar and Sonic stages that would've been so great.
 

TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
yeah that shit is GREAT and another reason why i wish there were more avatar stages

the section of fist bump that plays after the null space section heavily suggests your char was originally supposed to vanish or die or some bullshit fitting the randomly super edgy tonedeaf stuff in the story probably leftover from the old story

We can show the world what we can do
You are next to me and I'm next to you
Push me on through until the battle's won
No one's gonna give a thing to us
Into each other we put our trust
Standing united, after the fight

All alone, we will never be
The two, of us, are holding the key
We see, today, a world we couldn't see
Before I say goodbye to you
One more last fist bump...

I think it's more foreshadowing the end of the game where
Classic Sonic and the Avatar both go their separate ways from Sonic and Tails, with a final fist bump to each other.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
The more I thought about it as I was grinding for 100k rings & maxing out all the avatars, I think Xtortion said it best: It's just "Aggressively Mediocre". Granted, I'd probably give it a 2/5, maybe a 3/5 if some of the mission stuff didn't feel so tedious (i.e. why do I need to play the "use this weapon" mission 3 times when I already cleared the "beat # enemies with this weapon" on my first use of said weapon???), but I would still prefer it over Unleashed & depending on if I want a more "speedrun" mode than "platforming", Lost World.

I guess I'll hold onto my copy for a bit to see if they patch in any additional stuff like Super Sonic (but then again, I'd feel little desire to use him if I've 100%'d the game already), but I don't think I have any desire to ever replay this like how I double dipped on Generations.
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,787
NoVA
The classic stages annoy me so much especially when trying to speed run them. If they weren't in the game and replaced with more avatar and Sonic stages that would've been so great.

I actually strongly disagree - I think they're one of the few things this game has improved over Generations. Multiple routes, decently hidden secrets, and all of them slightly longer than the 1.5 minute average stage length. Doesn't come close to Mania obviously, and it feels like both the friction and gravity are too high (a surprising contrast to Modern and Avatar who feel like they're walking on ice most of the time) but they were one of the few things I ended up looking forward to.

Honestly if they could get Taxman's physics model from the Retro engine and iterated on Classic's gameplay here, I'd almost have faith in a Classic Sonic title from this team.
 

TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
I will say that I like the feel of the Drop Dash here better than in Mania, at least. I'm not sure I can pinpoint why exactly, though.
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
It doesn't matter how good Classic Sonic's stage designs are, he is basically uncontrollable to do anything other than get from point A to point B and even then the physics engine struggles

I will say that I like the feel of the Drop Dash here better than in Mania, at least. I'm not sure I can pinpoint why exactly, though.
Yea, it does. I don't know why either, but it feels better to use here. I completely replaced Spin Dashing for me in this game, while I never use it in Mania. I think Mania only spin dashes you one level, in Forces it seems like it almost counts as a maxed out spin dash.
 

Deleted member 3815

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,633
Forgot to show off my dumb avatar, well he is;

DOYS1EjVoAA20vs.jpg


Oh good lord how I do not care for him to even put any effort into giving him a name other than giving him a mask to hide his shame.

yeah that shit is GREAT and another reason why i wish there were more avatar stages.

More?! There should have been less Avatar stage or at least optional, the avatar is just basically a modern Sonic clone without the boost and a much slower homing attack.

After beating the game, I only play the Sonic stages with 2 tag team stage and even then I don't switch to the avatar because he isn't fun to play as.

the section of fist bump that plays after the null space section heavily suggests your char was originally supposed to vanish or die or some bullshit fitting the randomly super edgy tonedeaf stuff in the story probably leftover from the old story

We can show the world what we can do
You are next to me and I'm next to you
Push me on through until the battle's won
No one's gonna give a thing to us
Into each other we put our trust
Standing united, after the fight

All alone, we will never be
The two, of us, are holding the key
We see, today, a world we couldn't see
Before I say goodbye to you
One more last fist bump...

Glad they didn't do that as the Avatar didn't deserve the honour of having a noble death, also speaking of fist bump I hated how the game would interrupt the flow of the game just mash the button to trigger the double boost, not that it matters as I refused to do it and the game just continued as normal.

The classic stages annoy me so much especially when trying to speed run them. If they weren't in the game and replaced with more avatar and Sonic stages that would've been so great.

Between the QTE, the Fist bump and final Infinite fight the game isn't set up for speed running as there are too many factors that interrupt the flows the game.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
The main issue with classic is that the physics feel really off, & I say this as someone who never got the "PHYSICS ARE DIFFERENT & BAD!" complaints for Generations. There were times where it felt like my speed just dropped for no reason, especially when doing a drop dash & going down a hill or my speed dropping before a loop & Sonic is straining to make it over it.

Granted, I probably notice this more having Mania so fresh in my mind & it's been a few years since Generations, but this was the first time the 2D sections made me realize "uuh, something's wrong here" and maybe it's just the fact they feel so....shoehorned in, which makes no sense because we knew about classic sonic from the start.

I will say that I like the feel of the Drop Dash here better than in Mania, at least. I'm not sure I can pinpoint why exactly, though.
I want to say that it gave you better feedback as to when you were activating it in the air. I don't think Mania ever did anything aside from a faint audio sound, but here, you can see the jump animation changing to indicate you're gonna perform a drop dash.
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
The main issue with classic is that the physics feel really off, & I say this as someone who never got the "PHYSICS ARE DIFFERENT & BAD!" complaints for Generations. There were times where it felt like my speed just dropped for no reason, especially when doing a drop dash & going down a hill or my speed dropping before a loop & Sonic is straining to make it over it.

Granted, I probably notice this more having Mania so fresh in my mind & it's been a few years since Generations, but this was the first time the 2D sections made me realize "uuh, something's wrong here" and maybe it's just the fact they feel so....shoehorned in, which makes no sense because we knew about classic sonic from the start.
Same here. Never really minded the physics in Generations, but here, it's very noticeable that something is wrong with Classic Sonic.
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,787
NoVA
It doesn't matter how good Classic Sonic's stage designs are, he is basically uncontrollable to do anything other than get from point A to point B and even then the physics engine struggles
I don't disagree, but this is a valid complaint for the whole game. Physics are borked for Avatar and Modern with their wonky acceleration and traction and their completely bizarre jumping. Classic suffers too, but at least his areas are more interesting than theirs.
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
I don't disagree, but this is a valid complaint for the whole game. Physics are borked for Avatar and Modern with their wonky acceleration and traction and their completely bizarre jumping. Classic suffers too, but at least his areas are more interesting than theirs.
Probably because Classic Sonic lifts layouts wholesale from better Sonic games, in places.
 

TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
The physics in Generations ARE different from the Generations version, just like how Modern Sonic's are different from that game as well. I'm no expert, but I'd hazard that it's because this game is, as modders have discovered, built off of Lost World's engine instead of Generations was, so those gameplay styles were adapted to that engine instead of just reincorporated as they were before. I will admit, Classic Sonic feels a bit heavy in the same way Lost World Sonic was, a bit.
 

Zaverious

Member
Oct 25, 2017
451
I actually strongly disagree - I think they're one of the few things this game has improved over Generations. Multiple routes, decently hidden secrets, and all of them slightly longer than the 1.5 minute average stage length. Doesn't come close to Mania obviously, and it feels like both the friction and gravity are too high (a surprising contrast to Modern and Avatar who feel like they're walking on ice most of the time) but they were one of the few things I ended up looking forward to.

Honestly if they could get Taxman's physics model from the Retro engine and iterated on Classic's gameplay here, I'd almost have faith in a Classic Sonic title from this team.
I'd appreciate the level design more if it weren't for the way Classic Sonic played. He has slightly more complex levels than the other two characters but I found them more fun to play and move around with. If classic was more like Generations or Mania I'd tolerate it more.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
I will say Classic felt the most tolerable when it came to precision platforming. Avatar was probably the worst in that it felt like he would either fly off the platform or I undershot, his jumping physics felt off.

YO WHAT, EPISODE SHADOW STAGE 2'S MUSIC. I wish I could be more excited, but the stage is based on one of my least favorite avatar stages.
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,787
NoVA
Probably because Classic Sonic lifts layouts wholesale from better Sonic games, in places.
Sure, they did a little more than pay homage with Death Egg and Chemical Plant at points. But even Ghost Town and Casino Forest do a decent job of giving alternate routes and encouraging exploration.

It's not great, particularly because the physics don't interact with ramps like they should and it makes reaching some of the upper routes a chore if not nigh impossible. But between that and removing the instant spindash from Generations it's at least a sign they were trying to improve on something.

It does feel like his stages were designed with Generation's physics in mind, which is troubling. But if they could finally nail it then maybe there's finally something Sonic Team related to look forward to. Hopefully whatever hand they had in Mania encouraged them to dig into the older games and find out what made them tick.
 

TyraZaurus

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,477
I can't remember; was Generations Sonic also faster when he's rolling? Because that's definitely the case here and I can't remember what the case was there.
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,787
NoVA
I can't remember; was Generations Sonic also faster when he's rolling? Because that's definitely the case here and I can't remember what the case was there.
Not that I recall, and he also didn't interact with halfpipes like he would in the classic games. If you didn't spindash, you didn't really generate any momentum from rolling.
 

ned_ballad

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
48,381
Rochester, New York
I can't remember; was Generations Sonic also faster when he's rolling? Because that's definitely the case here and I can't remember what the case was there.
I think Sonic has always been faster while rolling, but this game takes it kind of an extreme.

Sure, they did a little more than pay homage with Death Egg and Chemical Plant at points. But even Ghost Town and Casino Forest do a decent job of giving alternate routes and encouraging exploration.

It's not great, particularly because the physics don't interact with ramps like they should and it makes reaching some of the upper routes a chore if not nigh impossible. But between that and removing the instant spindash from Generations it's at least a sign they were trying to improve on something.

It does feel like his stages were designed with Generation's physics in mind, which is troubling. But if they could finally nail it then maybe there's finally something Sonic Team related to look forward to. Hopefully whatever hand they had in Mania encouraged them to dig into the older games and find out what made them tick.
I don't feel that removing the instant spin dash was a good thing

I will say Classic felt the most tolerable when it came to precision platforming. Avatar was probably the worst in that it felt like he would either fly off the platform or I undershot, his jumping physics felt off.

YO WHAT, EPISODE SHADOW STAGE 2'S MUSIC. I wish I could be more excited, but the stage is based on one of my least favorite avatar stages.
I think they spent their entire audio budget on the awesome Shadow remixes
 

Camjo-Z

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,558
Between the QTE, the Fist bump and final Infinite fight the game isn't set up for speed running as there are too many factors that interrupt the flows the game.

I've already seen someone manage to perform a glitch in Luminous Forest that totally skips the snake QTE, there's some tech to be found here. I'm excited for the inevitable AGDQ run.
 

Seeya

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,984
I think Sonic has always been faster while rolling, but this game takes it kind of an extreme.


I don't feel that removing the instant spin dash was a good thing

Why not? I feel like they got Classic Sonics movement much closer to the classic games and Mania, and the insta spin dash that went 100000000 miles an hour never felt right to me.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,753
Well, I'll give Episode Shadow this. The music is probably some of the best....because it's just remixes of SA2 stuff.

Also, it feels really weird that of all the characters to say "go together like chili & hot dogs", it was ROUGE. That clearly should've been a Sonic or even a Tails line. Not someone who was on "Team Dark/Evil"