The script for Joker has allegedly leaked, and it's not great

DragonSJG

Member
Mar 4, 2019
416
Joker being Batman's brother is beyond stupid.
Honestly though, him killing a woman for that reason isn't surprising as the Joker is a vile person who does vile things. If they try to use it to make him a tragic figure or some sort of fallen hero, then yeah, it has issues
 

al davis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,065
This is what I get for thinking they were going to make a smart Joker story.

Nope instead we’re gonna get XXJoKeR420XX and a movie about how it was actually all girls fault he becomes a psychopath with makeup. Boy Warner Bros., you guys can definitely have my money.

And Batman and Joker are brothers? How many different types of drugs were they on when they made this movie?
 

Cuburger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,374
I'm saying he's a bad dude that you can feel sorry for and that doesn't mean you're endorsing him murdering people. Also I gave you evidence that he's already a shitheel since we're playing trailer detective.

It's clear you have some weird axe to grind.
I don't have to play trailer detective because the broad strokes are apparent. Obviously the movie won't completely exonerate him from any wrong doing since I suspect that WB still knows they are making a movie about a villain, but if they are presenting the world wholly through his lens and perspective, complete with how his life is a tragedy (his words in the trailer) with potentially a sick mother who he has to take care of and he gets beat up in the street for seemingly no reason, they aren't just making you feel some sympathy for a character, they are making you feel sorry for a character who we know what he becomes and what he represents beyond this movie. We are getting an origin story for a serial killer and just like Joker said in The Killing Joke that he was pushed over the edge, we have mass shooters that want to play the victim of their circumstances and believe that others are responsible for pushing them over the edge. It was the "cool kids" fault for mocking them and not accepting them. It was societies fault for making it hard to find a job. It was a woman's fault for rejecting them. It was because they were bullied and beat up that they are justified in taking it out on the world.

Maybe people just want to have their cool Joker movie, but it rubs me the wrong way, and the trailer doesn't make me feel like the filmmakers realize the weight of the themes they are playing with or that they will be handled with care. It just makes me think they want to make a cool Joker movie, but it's not like they are unaware of what surrounds the iconography of the Joker if they are leaning into it and making decisions like the spoiler in the tweets. Maybe it's handled in a way I don't expect, but from people that have read a version of the script, it doesn't sound that way, and it's totally fair to criticize poor handling of such material.
 
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Ingueferroque

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
9,027
This is like those times when on-set photos leak of superhero movies, and everyone thinks the movie is going to be shit because the costumes look ridiculous.
 

skeezx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,744
Honestly though, him killing a woman for that reason isn't surprising as the Joker is a vile person who does vile things. If they try to use it to make him a tragic figure or some sort of fallen hero, then yeah, it has issues
yeah i feel you could do this with any movie. condense a plot point into a sentence summation by leave it by itself, doesn't tell you much of anything
 

Sgt. Demblant

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,309
France
Honestly the
Thomas Wayne
thing does not bother me at all.

It's basically an elseworlds story so who cares. Some of those comics had very similar premises and it worked great most times.

The thing that actually bothers me is that I've seen Hangover 3.
 
Oct 27, 2017
491
Didn't Zazie say during an interview that a lot of the script was re-written while they were filming? The leaked script might not even be representative of the film anymore. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,693
Gordita Beach
I don't have to play trailer detective because the broad strokes are apparent. Obviously the movie won't completely exonerate him from any wrong doing since I suspect that WB still knows they are making a movie about a villain, but if they are presenting the world wholly through his lens and perspective, complete with who his life is a tragedy (his words in the trailer) with potentially a sick mother who he has to take care of and he gets beat up in the street for seemingly no reason, they aren't just making you feel some sympathy for a character, they are making you feel sorry for a character who we know what he becomes and what he represents beyond this movie. We are getting an origin story for a serial killer and just like Joker said in The Killing Joke that he was pushed over the edge, we have mass shooters that want to play the victim of their circumstances and believe that others are responsible for pushing them over the edge. It was the "cool kids" fault for mocking them and not accepting them. It was societies fault for making it hard to find a job. It was a woman's fault for rejecting them. It was because they were bullied and beat up that they are justified in taking it out on the world.

Maybe people just want to have their cool Joker movie, but it rubs me the wrong way, and the trailer doesn't make me feel like the filmmakers realize the weight of the themes they are playing with or that they will be handled with care. It just makes me think they want to make a cool Joker movie, but it's not like they are unaware of what surrounds the iconography of the Joker if they are leaning into it and making decisions like the spoiler in the tweets. Maybe it's handled in a way I don't expect, but from people that have read a version of the script, it doesn't sound that way, and it's totally fair to criticize poor handling of such material.
That's fair. I do think there would be less scrutiny if this wasn't saddled with the weight of who the character is, but maybe that's also part of the appeal. i don't know.
 

Addleburg

The Fallen
Nov 16, 2017
1,221
If the scrambled tweet is true, then yeah: it’s possible that some idiots will champion the Joker, but I don’t think the filmmakers or most individuals would hail that action as a heroic act. In fact, it’d be a damning portrayal of a pathetic, weak character to most people.

The goal of filmmaking shouldn’t be to make sure every person interprets the story the “correct” way because that’s impossible to do. Some segment of the population will continue to celebrate characters that the filmmakers clearly didn’t want celebrated. As long as the majority of the viewers aren’t mistaken about the core themes, I think that’s fine.
 
May 9, 2019
65
I think the issue seems to be they are probably going too far in trying to make Joker a sympathetic creature so shitheads will fall over themselves to view joker as the hero who is standing up to all the bullshit
Honestly, I was getting that vibe from the trailer. And if its true then jeezus we don't need this right now. This is why you don't stick an origin on the Joker. He's just plain evil thats it.
 

McScroggz

The Fallen
Jan 11, 2018
2,083
This isn’t specific to this movie, but can somebody explain why there is a subculture of reading leaked scripts? I don’t get the appeal.
 

hank_tree

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
1,848
Who among us could have foreseen that a Joker movie from the guy who did The Hangover movies would be trash?
 

Drewton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,747
Even if the script isn’t the best the acting will go a long way in elevating it, and it still looks like a beautiful looking film.
 

Bus-TEE

Member
Nov 20, 2017
1,706
I honestly don't know why people are fretting themselves other this. This isn't a 'true' Joker film and was never labelled as such.

While the script (what draft are they reading?) may not 'sing' I believe that Phoenix wouldn't sign on for just anything let alone a CBM and while Phillips may seem like an odd choice I do believe that he has a great film in him.

I thought War Dogs was great and he's shown that he can grow from his comedy roots. Let's not forget Adam McKay's first film was Anchorman and now he's making films like Vice!

We shall see soon enough.
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,580
If they are trying to make Joker sympathic (when he shouldn't) and they are pulling an incel angle then there is no hope for this movie.
 

Richter1887

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,580
Did you even watch the trailer? That's exactly the story the trailer is selling, they are obviously going for a Fight Club, 'Robert Paulson' vibe.
I did but I never expected the whole incel angle.

Like I thought his mother would die from something which would make him snap and go full evil and unsympathetic. But to go for an incel angle? That's beyond problematic.
 

NameUser

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,102
I mean, I don't think Joker being that kind of piece of shit is a problem so much as it is the worship around his character that's hilariously stupid.

Let's see how the rest of the movie treats this. If it's as mediocre as they're implying it is then at least we have the dumb memes to fallback on lol
It’s a problem because—why should he care about that? To me he seems mostly asexual. He shouldn’t be flipping out for getting rejected. Shits awful.

————————

I think I said this movie seems unnecessary in the trailer thread and got called out for it. So I won’t lie, a bitter part of me wants it to be so I can say, “Told you!” 😭
 

zoozilla

Avenger
Jun 9, 2018
143
Japan
Seems like they're not kidding with the Taxi Driver comparison. People forget that the movie ends with
Travis Bickel hailed as a hero after his killing spree.

Of course, that movie also led to John Hinckley Jr., so....
 

Vonocourt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
710
With Marty involved?
I liked War Dogs
Scorsese hasn't been involved for a minute.

I'm surprised at how wrong my read from the trailer was, I thought while he had a checkups at arkham, his mother was gonna be taken there because a certain incident proved she needed psychiatric help and it meant that she had to become a ward of the state because he wasn't fit to be the guardian. Enforcing his distrust of government and the social climate that provokes him to rebel.

She probably just dies...
 

NameUser

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,102
Also (about that tweeted spoiler):

That’s probably Zazie Beetz’s character. So you have a white dude killing a woman of color for rejecting him. It’s bad no matter what, but this is even more tone deaf considering the times we’re living in.
Shame on anyone who doesn’t think that spoiler is a problem. Should The Joker really be concerned with something like that?

Hell no! That plot point shows that they really don’t understand his character!

If anything this is what should happen:

He rejects her because he doesn’t care about sex or love.
 

Vinimaw

Member
Oct 28, 2017
463
So someone who said that BvS was trash is saying that Joker is not great. Ok then Joker must be one of the best movie ever.
 

Vonocourt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
710
Also (about that tweeted spoiler):

That’s probably Zazie Beetz’s character. So you have a white dude killing a woman of color for rejecting him. It’s bad no matter what, but this is even more tone deaf considering the times we’re living in.
Shame on anyone who doesn’t think that spoiler is a problem.
Yep. It's a minefield no matter how you try to lay it.
 

honest_ry

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,240
"Ok I have made my mind up, this film sucks. Doenst matter than i have not seen it, doesnt matter that its not finished. Some guy said the script has issues so im gonna jump on that hate train. Fuck this film."

:ResetEra


(joke, dont go daft folks;))
 

Psychoward

Member
Nov 7, 2017
14,493
It's Joaquin. Worst case scenario he acts his ass off and makes the film partially worth watching even if everything else is a mess.