Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT8| - The Dark Tower (See Staff Post)
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I lost track of the xbox one early in the generation. Was the second GPU and cloud based physics processing ever released via a patch?
There was one more person who shall not be named.
and its not just what people reported, its what they did NOT report. windows central and Arthur Gies's sources most likely know the PS5 specs as well, but there was no mention of the PS5. i can promise you that if the xbox was stronger, arthur and windows central wouldve been screaming it off the top of their lungs.
If the games look great graphically but just run at a lower resolution/framerate, what's the problem?
From where are folks coming to this conclusion? I am legitimately curious.
That is going to happen any way .
At least with numbers some of us that want to discuss certain things will have offical info.
I will say i am the most intrigued about their memory setup
TF. you can have all the data in the world, you still need to render it.
same goes for destruction, NPCs, and other simulations. sure the CPU will allow them to do all that but the GPU needs to be able to render the destruction, the hundreds of NPCs on screen at once and all those weather simulations we saw in the flight simulator demo.
lord knows what they are going to do with water physics next gen.
On HBM, didn't the theoretical bandwidth of a 8GB HBM2 + DDR4 setup seem a tad low? Or was that sufficient for Navi?
You'd think Sony would avoid a bandwidth bottleneck after Pro's lacking bandwidth.
You'd think Sony would avoid a bandwidth bottleneck after Pro's lacking bandwidth.
He can be passionate and also doing PR. He is an exec at a company, when it comes to his product in the public space he is always doing PR.
You got a point on the numbers part. Still think it's better to get official info, we're so close anyway.
Seriously he might like games but he isn't your bud, hes working for a giant company and trying to make them as much money as possible.
He's confident because in many ways it could be true.
If MS have a faster CPU then, by some metrics, the XSX is the more powerful console. If it has patented VRS. If he is confident about Direct X he can also argue that when you combine software and hardware they are the "most powerful".
If you are Phil Spencer and you have an XSX with a 10% weaker GPU but a 10% stronger CPU, and specialised rendering software/hardware you are confident in with DirectX and patented VRS what do you say when you are asked if your console is more powerful than PS5?
You say exactly what Phil Spencer has said. Exactly how he has said it.
All I'm saying is that taking Phil at face value as meaning the XSX has a higher TF GPU than PS5 is a large leap of faith, especially when we now know that the targets haven't changed and all other sources suggest that PS5 has the advantage.
It may well be the case that the XSX has a better GPU than the PS5, but Phil Spencer's statements aren't strong evidence of that. They come from a biased source with a dog in the fight and are worded in a way that can be spun any number of ways to be "true" even if the PS5 has a higher TF GPU.
So personally I would treat Phil's statements as support for the evidence that the consoles are very very close in performance because he probably wouldn't make them if that wasn't the case. Is it evidence in support of some big change in the relative power of the GPUs from the Reiner/Klee/Voldemort leaks? I don't think so - especially when Klee says nothing has changed and he has the final specs of the consoles.
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I dont..know, to be honest, I've remembered DF reveal talking about how Xbox X doesn't have a simple jaguar CPU that it has a heavy customized CPU based on jaguar...i'm still don't know what customization was made, that make it different than any other jaguar.
I'm still waiting for Directx12 close the gap wit PS4 performance, then the cloud...now looks la VRS is something exclusive to MS.
It is difficult not to see that Tom tweet about VSR/Direct X as an Xbox One vs PS4 2013 PR piece.
if anything, and completely imo, Lockheart being in the picture leads credence to PS5 having a performance edge... albeit likely slight, and probably not entirely appreciable.
but I think Microsoft has made a calculation they will not get a raw numbers advantage over Sony on the high end, and have decided it's better to get some kind of advantage over Sony, and have claimed the low ground/price advantage with a lower end model. i mean, if you're not leading on power against an entrenched market leader you may as well lead on something.
but I think Microsoft has made a calculation they will not get a raw numbers advantage over Sony on the high end, and have decided it's better to get some kind of advantage over Sony, and have claimed the low ground/price advantage with a lower end model. i mean, if you're not leading on power against an entrenched market leader you may as well lead on something.
He's both a massive fan and a senior exec.
He isn't a career exec. He's worked his way up from the very bottom at Microsoft over more than 2 decades and has been forever passionate about games and the industry long before his current role.
Of course he wants to make Xbox a massive success and earn some nice bonuses to set him up for retirement. But he's also deeply passionate about the industry.
Most people here, thinking that PS5 will be another "Miracle of the World" and destroyed XSX in dust....
Wouldn't the opposite be more likely? With lockhart existing, MS can go balls to the wall regarding both specs and price for the series x.
Obviously you can't say much, but just one question: Is it really a "full" spec sheet, so you know the RAM setup for both consoles?
I don't doubt hes a genuine person, its nothing personal at all but he is selling you something and his words are what he is using to sale it to you, if you think hes trustworthy that's fine but i'm not gonna take anything that either company says outside cold hard facts as the truth.
This is a good point, and to a significant extent this is a legitimate argument for Phil to make, even if XSX is lower on TF count. When you have so many beneficial factors that impact console performance (raw TF count, RT, SSD and I/O, VRS, etc.), it becomes less clear how any individual factor affects overall performance. It's more of the aggregate combination of features that will determine overall performance.
They would run the risk of having people jump to the PS5 rather than the XSX if they price it too high, especially if Lockhart is only a 1080p machine. If the lowest 4K MS next gen machine is a fortune they're probably handing the generation to the PS5, even if it is less powerful.
They need to distinguish and price them very, very carefully for both to be a success especially with a PS5 in the equation.
naw, cuz there's a limit to what you can price these boxes at... what tech is available, you can't just do whatever. i think Microsoft targeted highest possible spec/price, and Sony did the same. Sony made a determination to not get out-spec'd, to complete with equal boxes/playing fields, and leveraging the software advantage they've built in other areas. Microsoft threw Lockheart into the mix to hedge their bets, while also being somewhat synergistic with their overall strategy. IMO.
This kind of looks like the PS5 dev kit....hmmmPS5 to have cooling via hornets confirmed! 😃
Edit.
Pic of the cooler here
No, they aren't. I thought for sure we all settled on $499 for both consoles..
Now, when 8tf came back from the dead, 10tf too, the lower price popped back up too. Or some may be speculating that Sony will go for $399 again and say to hell with specs. AFAIK, those that thought that also think it's going to be in between Lockhart and Anaconda..and not similar to Anaconda.
And Cerny doesn't do PR? Just because you work for a company doesn't mean you can't be honest about what you are putting forward to customers.
That's silly. If your competition is slightly ahead of you, you fight on features and price. And most importantly - you do not build your message around being powerful. You focus on games, unique experiences, services, convenience etc.
Lockhart is what happens when you go all in and are afraid that competition will outprice you. The scary scenario for MS is having a beefy as hell 500$ box and PS5 launching slower console(albeit not much slower) at 400, which with Sony's success that generation could kill the race at the start. That's why they have Lockhart in the works - so they can always push 300-350$ SKU, which will have the same processor, RAM, SSD(maybe smaller one?) and enough horsepower to do 1080p where Scarlett does 4K. That way you have the crown, which you use for marketing, and mass-market SKU that can build you volume and bring more of that sweet subscription money.
Exactly. And if the consoles are as close as the rumours suggest then arguably anyone can claim they have the console that "sets the bar" and has the "best performance".
Which is exactly why people taking Phil's statements as the gospel truth specifically as it pertains to GPU TFs is really really naive.
His statement could mean literally anything. Better CPU. Better software (he feels) with DirectX. The patented VRS. The power of xCloud. Or any combination of those and others I haven't thought of.
And if you did have to sell an XSX with a ~10% weaker GPU (as the rumours from insiders suggest) as Phil Spencer that is exactly how you would spin it. The overall package of the XSX is the "most powerful" console that "sets the bar" and we "like being performance leaders". In many ways it may be true, and could certainly be argued to be true, without the XSX having a higher TF GPU than PS5.
Lol I didn't even realize he had gotten banned earlier this week. People need to take a break and go outside or something. It's not that serious.
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