Again, are you suggesting sanctions?The right to live without fear of repercussions simply because of your ethnicity isn't a political goal, how tone-deaf could your reply be. Because this is a state sponsored genocide, not some militia or organisation, that is supremely more important then the comfort of those who knowingly turn their head towards this injustice, over a million in camps, I'm all for making things difficult for the government of China, and I hope people of China start raising this issue rather then defending it.
What if I told you half the world really likes China and their global influence. Good luck finding anyone outside the US, Canada and Australia that puts any real effort in sanctioning China at all.
What if I told you half the world really likes China and their global influence. Good luck finding anyone outside the US, Canada and Australia that puts any real effort in sanctioning China at all.
We had a thread several months ago showing most of the developed nations in the world aren't huge fans of China if you go by their citizens.
Plus you have trade deals like the TPP that existed primarily to fight Chinese economic influence which was going pretty well for the US till Trump pulled out.
The main parts of the world that like China are the parts getting shitty loans from them.
A recent era thread said otherwise. The only countries way into China were other compromised authoritarian states and their neocolonial subjects
What if I told you half the world really likes China and their global influence. Good luck finding anyone outside the US, Canada and Australia that puts any real effort in sanctioning China at all.
Depends on the source I guess but I remember a thread showing half the world in support for China.
If the terms and conditions of playing nice with China is don't publicly badmouth their domestic oppression, then for a lot of nations that is supremely preferable to "play nice with the USA or we'll bomb, invade, or politically disrupt your country".
Probably depends on how you ask the question but I can't imagine recent events in Hong Kong andthe west have done wonders for their Worldwide popularity
this thread is eerily fascistic
"hey let's ban Chinese people from the US and trigger a global depression whilst ignoring all the other countries that also commit human right violations"
Yep.
And talking about regime change as though it's some easy miracle cure - as if the last two decades haven't happened and shown how massively that can backfire.
Part of Hong Kong's problem is their own corruption* and not what China is proposing to them.
That's garbage... Stop speaking nonsense. The leadership in Hong Kong has screwed over the masses there for so long and hoarded everything.
It's not even a question, we know who that would end up hurting most: average Chinese people.
So you're saying it's only a matter of time for when Hong Kong is considered merged back with China.
The problem is they do want their people to suffer. What do you think the fucking genocide is? It's inflicting suffering on their own people.That's on the Chinese government. We can't allow shitty governments to continue a genocide just because their average citizen might get hurt economically. If the CCP dont want their people to suffer, maybe they should stop ethnic cleansing minorities?
Ah yes, because era is truly representative, give me a break.A recent era thread said otherwise. The only countries way into China were other compromised authoritarian states and their neocolonial subjects. There's a real opportunity to unite against China in the WTO that is being flubbed spectacularly.
A lot of the comments in this thread are super disturbing
Ah yes, because era is truly representative, give me a break.
You know, one can almost argue that it would be better if that was case.
I can't tell if you're serious but that's an awful idea.A one China policy, by which I mean, is that Taiwan should be considered China.
This is hogwash. The people there are living good if you're slightly below middle class and up. The way of living there is actually pretty solidThe problem is they do want their people to suffer. What do you think the fucking genocide is? It's inflicting suffering on their own people.
Nothing.
I know that's pessimistic, but realsitically. ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING
A one China policy, by which I mean, is that Taiwan should be considered China.
The problem is they do want their people to suffer. What do you think the fucking genocide is? It's inflicting suffering on their own people.
So you're saying it's only a matter of time for when Hong Kong is considered merged back with China.
A one China policy, by which I mean, is that Taiwan should be considered China.
Only if you don't find yourself in the government's crosshairs. The Chinese government imprisons anyone who dissents with the government. They were performing forced abortions on people (even Han Chinese people) for having too many children. They fined people like 5 years salary for having an extra kid. All of these oppressive policies are being enacted on their own people. The idea that China is going to relinquish their iron clad grip on their people because of suffering is idiotic. They are the ones inflicting the suffering.This is hogwash. The people there are living good if you're slightly below middle class and up. The way of living there is actually pretty solid
I don't have a solution
I'm not sure how you're going to square that with your country also keeping kids in cagesSince we're all incensed with the atrocities being done to them, we should put our money where our mouth is. US should offer political asylum to all Uyghurs and all HK citizens that request it
This is a recent pew research piece
Other Asian countries despise China's govt. to a similar extent as Europe and the US.This is a recent pew research piece
As you can see, its not just authoritarian goverments. I can also speak for what i see in my country which is not in the list(Perú) and others in South America, and let me tell you, people here LOVE China.
Its mostly western old powers that have a negative view on China as far as i can see, the rest of the world is either ambivalent or loves them.
China's economy will probably collapse within the next decade or so as more and more manufacturers pull out. It is almost inevitable at this point and it is going to suck for everyone.
So...for the moment at least, the US needs a competent government that will actually follow rules and not throw its weight around wantonly, and then a peaceful future might become slightly more plausible.Ok, there sure are a lot of simplistic solutions being posted for an incredibly complex problem.
The world economy is deeply embedded in the PRC, including that of the US and it's allies. Meanwhile, China has spent the past half-decade building development networks across South-East and Central Asia. Unless the US can offer equal or superior incentives to China (pro tip: it can't), sanctions are unlikely to be effective.
Overthrowing the central government is a pipe dream when we still don't even understand the basic structure of the CCP or its security apparatus.
More broadly, the relatively impotent impact of China's stock market crisis on popular support for the CCP demonstrated that nationalism is the be-all-and-end-all of Chinese domestic politics. The CCP has spent the better part of two decades cultivating a humiliation narrative which posits that China is and has been for the past 150 years, a victim of Western imperialism.
Trump's trade war emboldens this narrative. One need only follow the internal media coverage to understand this.
The future of China-US and China-world relations is a matter of heated debate in international relations theory. For the record, the two dominant theories are as follows:
Neorealism - famously argued by Mearsheimer, it is the belief that China and the United Stated are destined for war. This is neither a function of human rights abuses nor economics but the security dilemma produced by a rising power. It is by far the most popular theory.
Liberal internationalism - China can be socialised into international norms and reformulated as a status quo power.
Why is the latter scenario becoming increasingly unlikely? In short, because of US isolationism and American unwillingness to adhere to international norms itself.
Consider the following. Why should China adhere to UNCLOS decisions vis-a-vis the South-China Sea when the US hasn't ratified the agreement?
Trump's withdrawal from the TPP is a catastrophe from a geopolitical perspective. The US had (still has) the capacity to balance against the PRC by leveraging multilateral partnerships with regional middle powers such as Australia, Korea, Japan, Indonesia etc. The result of the US' backtrack on the pivot to Asia is immediately observable. China has dramatically expanded the reach of its economic hard power via the BRI.
The point comes down to the following. China needs to realise sufficient incentive from the prevailing liberal order to ensure their compliance to liberal norms. 'America Alone' isn't the answer.
They are already starting to take away China's manufacturing, but when an economy that large collapses, the world economy will go into a recession.I mean it could be a windfall for countries like India, Vietnam, Mexico, Taiwan, etc. that probably stand to have production shifted over that way.
They are already starting to take away China's manufacturing, but when an economy that large collapses, the world economy will go into a recession.
Yeah, I'm not saying China's economic collapse will be a disaster for the world or even the US, just that it will suck for a while. Also probably devalue the USD a little bit as China tries to dump its bonds and USD cash reserves, but the world will recover and hopefully a better government can rise from the ashes of China.World economies go into a recession from time to time anyway.
Growing up in the 90s, every electronic device I remember had "Made In Japan" on it basically, now almost nothing has that on it, not even Nintendo or Sony products.
These things can shift, India, Vietnam, Thailand, Taiwan, Mexico, etc. can all do the same thing China does, there's nothing proprietary or special about cheap labor.
Other Asian countries despise China's govt. to a similar extent as Europe and the US.
I mean it could be a windfall for countries like India, Vietnam, Mexico, Taiwan, etc. that probably stand to have production shifted over that way.