phisheep

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Oct 26, 2017
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USA v Donald J Trump

Case Details
Court: District Court, District of Columbia
Case: 23-cr-00257 DOCKET DOCKET
Judge: Tanya Chutkan
Prosecutor: Special Counsel Jack Smith

The indictment is a mounting horror story of how close the USA came to having its system of government overturned, and of the scattered honest people who stood in the way of it happening - state officials, DoJ, law enforcement, and not least the Vice President Mike Pence. It details 7 states, 6 co-conspirators, 5 means and methods, 4 felony counts, 3 conspiracies, 2 US Senators and 1 alleged felon.

Events
18 Jul 2023 - Trump confirms he got a target letter
1 Aug 2023 - Indictment handed up, Special Counsel announcement, arraigned 3 Aug (not guilty plea)
4 Aug 2023 - DoJ motion for protective order, opposed 7 Aug, reply 7 Aug, hearing 11 Aug, PROTECTIVE ORDER 11 Aug
10 Aug 2023 - DoJ proposed trial schedule, opposed 17 Aug, reply 21 Aug, hearing 28 Aug, SCHEDULING ORDER 28 Aug
5 Sep 2023 - DoJ motion to file under seal, granted Sep 5, Trump move to vacate 5 Sep, VACATED 5 Sep (this was early version of the 'gag order' thing)
11 Sep 2023 - Trump motion for recusal, opposed 14 Sep, reply 17 Sep, DENIED 27 Sep
15 Sep 2023 - DoJ motion for 'gag order', opposed 25 Sep, reply 29 Sep, hearing 16 Oct, GAGGED 17 Oct
25 Sep 2023 - DoJ (sealed) motion for CIPA 4 protective order, GRANTED 1 Nov
27 Sep 2023 - Trump motion to delay CIPA process, opposed 2 Oct, reply 5 Oct GRANTED IN PART 6 Oct, objections due 11 Oct
28 Sep 2023 - Trump motion to delay pretrial motions by 60 days, opposed 2 Oct, reply 5 Oct, GRANTED IN PART 6 Oct (see schedule below)
5 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to dismiss for presidential immunity, opposed 19 Oct, reply 26 Oct, DENIED 1 Dec
10 Oct 2023 - DoJ motion for jury protection, response 20 Oct, reply 25 Oct, GRANTED 2 Nov
10 Oct 2023 - DoJ motion for notice of advice-of-counsel defense, opposition 20 Oct, reply 25 Oct, GRANTED IN PART 8 Nov
11 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to access sealed CIPA 4 filing, opposed 18 Oct, DENIED 1 Nov
11 Oct 2023 - Trump motion for 17(c) subpoenas, opposed 25 Oct, reply 1 Nov, DENIED 27 Nov ("fishing expedition")
20 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to stay gag order pending appeal, opposed 25 Oct, reply 28 Oct, DENIED 29 Oct
23 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to strike inflammatory language, opposed 6 Nov, reply 5 Nov, DENIED 17 Nov
23 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to dismiss on constitutional grounds, opposed 6 Nov, reply 22 Nov, DENIED 1 Dec
26 Oct 2023 - Trump CIPA5 notice to bring in foreign election influence, sealed motion to strike 9 Nov, no reply 27 Nov, revised notice 28 Nov
1 Nov 2023 - Trump motion to stay case until immunity claim resolved, opposed 6 Nov, reply 15 Nov, DENIED AS MOOT 1 Dec
1 Nov 2023 - Trump motion for time extension on 17(c) motions/motions to compel, opposed 3 Nov, reply 6 Nov, GRANTED IN PART 7 Nov
3 Nov 2023 - DoJ motion to file oversize brief to 2 Trump motions, opposed 4 Nov, GRANTED 5 Nov
12 Nov 2023 - Trump motion to extend filing deadlines, opposed 13 Nov, GRANTED IN PART 13 Nov
4 Dec 2023 - DoJ 404(b) evidence notice
4 Dec 2023 - (Court) juror prescreening form
7 Dec 2023 - Trump notice of appeal of denial of motions to dimiss for immunity and on constitutional grounds
7 Dec 2023 - Trump motion to stay proceedings pending appeal, opposed 10 Dec, reply 12 Dec, GRANTED IN PART 13 Dec
11 Dec 2023 - DoJ expert witness disclosure (anonymised summary for public docket, Trump's team has names)
12 Dec 2023 - DoJ notice of filing for CIPA 6 hearing

(pending motions)
5 Oct 2023 - Media Coalition motion for broadcast access, DoJ opposed 3 Nov, Trump response 10 Nov, reply 13 Nov, media reply 17 Nov ... (separate DOCKET)
23 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to dismiss on statutory grounds, opposed 6 Nov, reply 22 Nov ...
23 Oct 2023 - Trump motion to dismiss for selective prosecution, opposed 6 Nov, reply 22 Nov ...
27 Nov 2023 - Trump motion re scope of prosecution team, opposed 9 Dec, reply due 14 Dec ...
27 Nov 2023 - Trump motion to compel discovery, opposed 9 Dec, reply due 18 Dec, ...
4 Jan 2024 - Trump motion for prosecution to be held in contempt, opposed 5 Jan, reply 12 Jan, GRANTED IN PART 18 Jan (i.e. mostly denied!)

Schedule (as revised 13 Nov) STAYED PENDING APPEAL 13 DEC (*=missed deadlines while stayed)
* 11 Dec 2023 - expert witness disclosure (DoJ done, Trump to come?)
* 13 Dec 2023 - 17(c) motions, opposition 27 Dec, replies 3 Jan
* 18 Dec 2023 - DoJ notice of exhibit list, Trump response 18 Dec, objections 3 Jan, replies 9 Jan (Trump exhibits to come?)
* 27 Dec 2023 - DoJ motion in limine (motions in limine and suppression motions), oppositions 9 Jan, replies 22 Jan (Trump motions to come?)
* 9 Jan 2024 - proposed jury questionnaire
* 15 Jan 2024 - proposed jury instructions
* 15 Jan 2024 - deadline for notice and discovery of advice-of-counsel defense
* 9 Feb 2024 - start of jury selection (by questionnaire)
* 12 Feb 2024 - impeachment/credibility disclosure
* 19 Feb 2024 - witness lists
* 4 Mar 2024 - TRIAL (start of jury selection, expected trial length about 3 months)

DC Circuit Court of Appeals
18 Oct 2023 - Trump appeal of gag order (docket), brief 8 Nov, response 14 Nov, reply 17 Nov, hearing 20 Nov, UPHELD IN PART 8 Dec (read "mostly upheld")
18 Dec 2023 - Trump petition for rehearing/en banc/administrative stay, response 31 Dec, en banc DENIED 23 Jan, rehearing/stay DENIED 23 Jan

8 Dec 2023 -Trump appeal of denial of motion to dismiss on immunity and constitutional grounds (docket)
11 Dec 2023 - DoJ motion to expedite briefing, GRANTED 11 Dec, response 13 Dec, reply 13 Dec, GRANTED 13 Dec
13 Dec 2023 - Trump brief 23 Dec, response 30 Dec, reply 2 Jan, hearing 9 Jan (Youtube link), DENIED 6 Feb

SCOTUS
11 Dec 2023 - DoJ petition for certiorari before judgment (23-624 docket expedited), opposed 20 Dec, reply 21 Dec, DENIED 22 Dec

12 Feb 2024 - Trump petition for stay of immunity judgment (23A745 docket), response 14 Feb, reply 15 Feb, CERT GRANTED 28 Feb
13 Feb 2024 - Judge Luttig and friends amicus brief opposing stay
13 Feb 2024 - Constitutional Law Scholars amicus brief opposing stay
14 Feb 2024 - Protect Democracy Project amicus brief opposing stay
15 Feb 2024 - David Boyle amicus brief (stupid jokey brief, and not even funny)
16 Feb 2024 - Alabama + 21 states amicus brief (moan about length of time the prosecution took, wut?)
19 Feb 2024 - Christian Family Coalition amicus brief (indictment violates 1st amendment, so unconstitutional)
19 Feb 2024 - Jeremy Bates amicus brief (opposing stay on unclean hands principle)
20 Feb 2024 - Edwin Meese et al amicus brief (Special Counsel was not legally appointed)
28 Feb 2024 - CERT GRANTED, Trump brief due 19 Mar, opposition due 8 Apr, reply due 15 Apr, ...

28 Feb 2024 - CERT on presidential immunity (23-939 docket)
"Whether and if so to what extent does a former President enjoy presidential immunity from criminal prosecution for conduct alleged to involve official acts during his tenure in office."
(merits briefs key: '-' supporting Trump '*'= neutral '+' supporting respondents)
12 Mar 2024 - Matthew Wilson amicus brief for Trump (if acted in good faith, and not being prosecuted in bad faith)
18 Mar 2024 * Guardian Defense Fund amicus brief (Smith wrongly appointed, impeachment is sole remedy)
19 Mar 2024 - Ohio, Alaska, Wyoming amicus brief (test for core Article II powers, and to urgency, at trial) (interesting)
19 Mar 2024 - Center for Law and Justice amicus brief (blanket immunity for official acts)
19 Mar 2024 - Condemned USA amicus brief (qualified immunity case-by-case, but definitely in this one) (bogged down in weeds)
19 Mar 2024 - Gavin M Wax amicus brief (no impeachment means no prosecution)
19 Mar 2024 - Former senior military officers amicus brief (no, he couldn't order SEAL team 6 to assassinate - we wouldn't do it) (lightweight argument)
19 Mar 2024 - Kansas+17 states' Republican parties amicus brief (blanket immunity for official acts) (big delay possibilities)
19 Mar 2024 - Alabama + 17 States amicus brief (danger of partisan prosecutions like this one is)
19 Mar 2024 - US Justice Foundation amicus brief (gotta impeach first, and immunity as for civil cases)
19 Mar 2024 - Coolidge Reagan Foundation amicus brief (immunity for core functions and speech, interpret criminal statutes to exclude the president)
19 Mar 2024 - Donald J Trump brief (absolute immunity for official acts, criminal laws don't apply to President)
19 Mar 2024 - Christian Family Coalition of Florida amicus brief (First Amendment protects Trump) (saying 2020 was a fair election is 'political ideology')
19 Mar 2024 - America's Future et al amicus brief (immunity is real, Jack Smith is bogus, Mike Pence was wrong)
19 Mar 2024 - National Republican Senatorial Committee amicus brief (Kendall cases, Youngstown, chilling effect on executive action, floodgates)
19 Mar 2024 * John D Ashcroft et al amicus brief (immunity is necessary, except after impeachment)
19 Mar 2024 * Mark Meadows amicus brief (don't forget the poor foot soldiers - self-serving claptrap)
19 Mar 2024 - Edwin Meese III et al amicus brief (Jack Smith not validly appointed)
19 Mar 2024 * Citizen Equal Rights Foundation amicus brief (STOP TERRITORIAL WAR POWERS) (utterly bonkers)
19 Mar 2024 - Sen Roger Marshall et al amicus brief (if Caesar had immunity, Rome would not have fallen) (not entirely on point)
19 Mar 2024 * David Boyle amicus brief (even Charles Manson had due process rights) (reasonable argument, dreadful brief)
4 Apr 2024 + John Danforth, Judge Luttig et al amicus brief (no immunity for attempted coup)
5 Apr 2024 + G Antaeus B Edelsohn amicus brief (Charles I, and Benjamin Franklin - no immunity for a former President)
8 Apr 2024 + Scholars of Constitutional Law amicus brief (no federal immunity for former presidents)
8 Apr 2024 + Puerto Rico House of Reps amicus brief (no immunity)
8 Apr 2024 + Retired Generals & Admirals etc amicus brief (immunity would threaten military, constitution, and national security)
8 Apr 2024 + Common Cause amicus brief (no immunity for this case, and the court should not further delay)
8 Apr 2024 + C.R.E.W. amicus brief (court should not consider validity of Jack Smith's appointment)
8 Apr 2024 + Public Citizen amicus brief (immunity a grave threat to constitutional order)
8 Apr 2024 + Former Government Officials amicus brief (no immunity, and especially not in this case)
8 Apr 2024 + Leadership Now amicus brief (immunity would undermine the rule of law)
8 Apr 2024 + ACLU amicus brief (no absolute immunity)
8 Apr 2024 + Finkelstein & 14 NSI Professionals amicus brief (no person is above the law, immunity would harm national security)
8 Apr 2024 + Stephen McAllister & Scott Paul amicus brief (no textual support for immunity) (excellent!)
8 Apr 2024 + Jeremy Bates amicus brief (as a fiduciary, presidential official-act crimes should be punished more) (fascinating! relevant?)
8 Apr 2024 + Scholars of the Founding Era amicus brief (historical perspective, no immunity)
8 Apr 2024 + Prof Martin S Lederman amicus brief (constitution and statutory construction say no immunity, even for the DoJ bit)
8 Apr 2024 + DoJ response (no immunity, and especially not in this case)
15 Apr 2024 +? Thomas Ogden amicus brief (the President is a King, he is he is) (no he isn't)
15 Apr 2024 - Donald J Trump reply

25 Apr 2024 - oral argument



Applicable Law
18 USC 371 Conspiracy to Defraud the United States
18 USC 1512 Obstruction of an Official Proceeding, and attempt to (c)(2) and conspiracy to (k)
18 USC 241 Conspiracy against Rights (specifically the rights to vote and to have vote counted)
Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure

Background

Well, we all know what happened here, we were probably all watching it.

Trump had been stoking the fires of electoral fraud from well before the election. Hell, I still remember that his lawyers were arguing fraud in an actual courtroom in New Mexico on actual election day in 2016! It was his plan all along. There's a whole load of backstory around fake legal theories, fraudulent electors, raids on State legislatures, performative and bonkers court cases, pressure on Governors - much of which overlaps with the Georgia investigation.

On November 7th 2020, four days after the election. A totally bizarre press conference at Four Seasons Total Landscaping in Philadelphia was banging on about election fraud at the same time PA called the race for Joe Biden.

On December 18th 2020, four days after the electoral college vote confirming that he had lost the election, Trump summoned his goons to a rally in DC to be held on the day that Congress was to certify the results. "It will be wild" he said, and he wasn't wrong.

On January 6th Trump and others (the usual suspects) riled up the crowd that later that day attacked and occupied the Capitol, delaying the certification of votes, calling for the execution of Vice President Mike Pence and otherwise seeking to keep Trump in power. The whole thing was bolstered by a bonkers theory by John Eastman that State Legislatures acting alone could overturn their slates of electors and put up alternate electors to be certified. The man himself, having promised to walk down to the Capitol with the crowd, didn't do so, though allegedly not for want of trying. Instead he watched on TV and singularly failed for hours to take any action whatsoever to prevent the insurrection. The cops were overrun, the National Guard kept unarmed and only reluctantly deployed, five people died.

Eventually, Congress reconvened and certified the votes. Even Mitch McConnell called Trump out as "morally responsible" for the attack.

The House impeached Trump for a second time on January 11th, but the Senate acquitted (by a margin of ten votes) on February 13th, McConnell voting to acquit.

In May the House proposed, but the Senate filibustered, an independent commission to investigate. June 30th the House established a Select Committee to investigate. McCarthy tried to stuff it with MAGA nuts (again, the usual suspects) who Pelosi rejected, which prompted McCarthy to withdraw all his nominees, leaving the Committee with Democrats and two renegade Republicans (Cheney and Kinzinger) who were then censured by the RNC. The Committee held public hearings from June to December, made criminal referrals on Dec 19th and published its final report on Dec 22nd.

The DoJ has been busy, with over 1000 convictions so far.

Following the mid-term elections, Jack Smith was appointed Special Counsel for the Investigation.

The Impeachment
H Res 24 Articles of Impeachment
Trial (wikipedia page)

The House Select Committee
Main page including links to transcripts and evidence
Final Report
Youtube playlist of Committee hearings

Department of Justice Investigation
Main page
Fucking enormous list of all Jan 6 cases in DC, with all indictments, sentences kept up to date

Other Reporting Links (to come)
The Big One: Trump is Indicted for Jan. 6 (lawfare)
Trump's Free Speech Defense? (Legal Eagle youtube)

Related Threads
Michigan attorney general charges 16 'false electors' over efforts to overturn the 2020 election
Jan. 6 grand jury files indictment in Trump 2020 election probe

Also on Resetera
NYT: Several House Republicans seek to challenge Biden victory during Jan 6 electoral vote tallying
Terrorist invasion of Capitol building by Trump/MAGA supporters; shots fired, Senate evacuated, 5 dead including cop
Pelosi: House will reconvene once capitol is "cleared for use"
The Second Impeachment of Donald Trump (Update: House Officially Votes to Impeach)
Second Impeachment Trial of Donald J. Trump, former President of the U.S. |OT| [Up: Senate acquits 57-43]
Jan 6 commission bill passes House 252-175 (35 republicans voted 'yea')
NYT: Senate Republicans block the creation of an independent inquiry into the Jan. 6 riot.
Cheney joins Dems on Jan. 6 probe, defying McCarthy threat
Kevin McCarthy will pull all GOP members from the Jan. 6 committee in response to Speaker Pelosi vetoing the appointment of Jim Banks and Jim Jordan
Rolling Stone: Jan. 6 Protest Organizers Say They Participated in 'Dozens' of Planning Meetings With Members of Congress and White House Staff
G.O.P. Declares Jan. 6 Attack 'Legitimate Political Discourse'
WaPo: Justice Dept. investigating Trump's actions in Jan. 6 criminal probe
Jan. 6 panel to vote on urging DOJ to prosecute Trump for at least three criminal charges
SCOTUS agrees to hear Trump's case over presidential immunity

People who enjoyed this may also enjoy ...
E Jean Carroll v Donald J Trump (civil case for battery and defamation)
Trump on Trial - Episode 1 |OT| The One with the Porn Star
Trump on Trial - Episode 2 |OT| The One with the Perfect Phone Call in Georgia (Fulton County)
Trump on Trial - Episode 3 |OT| The One with the Bigliest Assets Ever (New York Civil Fraud)
Trump on Trial - Episode 4 |OT| The One with the Missing Documents
Trump on Trial - Episode 6 |OT| The One with the One Weird Trick (14th amendment ballot access)
Trump on Trial - Episode 7 |OT| The Ones with the Ku Klux Klan Act (Jan 6 civil cases)
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
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Oct 26, 2017
4,960
I've had it with waiting. Plus, there are rumours flying around. Let's go!
 

Falch

Member
Jan 6, 2018
136
Could this potentially be the trial that will have the worst outcome for Trump?
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
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Oct 26, 2017
4,960
From the Mar-a-lago thread:

Day 2 of the prosecutors in front of the Jan 6th grand jury with no witnesses present.. something is definitely cooking.

Could this be the reason Trump cancelled his Friday plans, since he knows what's coming? Also the reason the Republicans were off the chain yesterday. Screaming about the DOJ and FBI before your arrest.

Also,


View: https://twitter.com/MuellerSheWrote/status/1679528651090710528

Looks like State-level stuff in MI and NM will be rolled up into the Federal investigation, so it's gonna get real confusing with lots of similar things happening.
 

Doctor_Xoa

Member
Dec 16, 2019
327
so it's gonna get real confusing with lots of similar things happening.
Which has always been Trump's greatest political defense for his misdeeds: complexity and a high pace of events means that no single simple truth is hammered home by the media. Instead we have every crime everywhere, all at once.
 

JediMasterMatt

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
606
I love these posts; but, I wonder if we could use a shared image in all the threads of a Venn diagram of how all of this legal jeopardy overlaps…

With a crudely drawn line in Sharpie extending the overlapping areas of course.
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,960
Could this potentially be the trial that will have the worst outcome for Trump?

Probably. It may not have the biggest sentence in the end (that's why the DoJ has appealed some of the Oath Keepers' sentences). But it does give the possibility - subject to a load of legal arguments of barring him from future office. And at trial, it is the one that will most expose his malicious pettiness and personal weaknesses and stupidity.

It's definitely going to be the one with the worst outcome for the GOP as a whole. Not only that it might drag in various Representatives and Senators and State party organisations, but it will show up their undisciplined craziness big time. If it goes to trial early enough, it should be a big boost for Christie in the primaries.
 
OP
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,960
I love these posts; but, I wonder if we could use a shared image in all the threads of a Venn diagram of how all of this legal jeopardy overlaps…

With a crudely drawn line in Sharpie extending the overlapping areas of course.

Love the idea! But probably it won't work, as most of them really are independent. Jean Carroll, Stormy Daniels, business fraud, and stolen documents are all completely independent. It's really only Georgia and Smith that intersect - and we won't know exactly how until we see indictments.

Maybe that's how we got Four Seasons Total Landscaping? The absurdity of it was needed to jump to an alternate crime universe.

I had totally forgotten that farce. Adding the background in the OP. Thanks.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,920
Posting to subscribe (Yes I know there's a Watch button).

I haven't heard too many talking heads on cable TV speculate how close we are to indictment for 1/6, but if the DoJ is going to do something, they should get the trial process going soon so it happens before the election.
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
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Oct 26, 2017
4,960
I haven't heard too many talking heads on cable TV speculate how close we are to indictment for 1/6, but if the DoJ is going to do something, they should get the trial process going soon so it happens before the election.

Yeah, that's the word on LawTwitter, from people doorstepping court buildings and speculating sensibly about how Smith's timescales will have to meld somehow with Fanni Willis'.
 

Nobility

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,055
NYT reporting Jared Kushner testified to the Jan 6 grand jury.

I think that would be enough to set him off.
 
Oct 27, 2017
10,201
PIT
I've
been
waiting for this!

akihiko-ive-been-waiting-for-this.png


Same, same.
 

Genesius

Member
Nov 2, 2018
15,921
It's amazing that Trump has overtly been a criminal piece of shit his whole life and may only experience a consequence for it (still not convinced) by becoming the leader of a world superpower.
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
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Oct 26, 2017
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Not sure if this is the right thread or what so much stuff going on. Maybe not sigh

View: https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1679904954553597952


You're in the right place!

What's happened with all the state-level stuff is Arizona and Georgia are doing their own thing, while Michigan, New Mexico and Pennsylvania have passed their investigations over to the Feds. Don't know what is happening in the other states (I think there were two of them) - maybe they're trying to pretend nothing happened.

Georgia has it's own thread just because it was first and high-profile what with that taped phone call. Might even be first to trial too.
 

Loudninja

Member
Oct 27, 2017
42,309
You're in the right place!

What's happened with all the state-level stuff is Arizona and Georgia are doing their own thing, while Michigan, New Mexico and Pennsylvania have passed their investigations over to the Feds. Don't know what is happening in the other states (I think there were two of them) - maybe they're trying to pretend nothing happened.

Georgia has it's own thread just because it was first and high-profile what with that taped phone call. Might even be first to trial too.
Thanks! Good to know :)
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,432
I genuinely wonder if his defense is going to eventually turn into "Come on, do you really think I did all these crimes?"
 
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phisheep

phisheep

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes
Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,960
I genuinely wonder if his defense is going to eventually turn into "Come on, do you really think I did all these crimes?"

When I was in college all those years ago, a friend of mine kept his heating on all day every day. Come the bill at the end of the year, he contested it, saying "these numbers are ludicrous, do you realise that to spend that much I would have had to have my heating on all day every single day". Got away with it too.
 

Tackleberry

Member
Oct 31, 2017
4,881
Alliance, OH
So if Jack is gonna jump ahead of Fani in GA, the clock is ticking.

Having heard some legal experts on the charges that Trump (and co) can be charged with.. they can be MORE damning than the documents case.
Obstruction, defrauding the government, and conspiracy.

"Those schemes included creating fraudulent electoral certificates that were submitted to Congress, implicating statutes such as 18 U.S.C. § 371, which prohibits conspiracies to defraud the United States in the administration of elections."

Creating those fake electoral certificates could also implicate statutes that prohibit obstruction of an official proceeding, one of the charges also leveled at numerous rioters who entered the building, including members of the Oath Keepers and military and chauvinist group the Proud Boys."
 

Version 3.0

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,414
When I was in college all those years ago, a friend of mine kept his heating on all day every day. Come the bill at the end of the year, he contested it, saying "these numbers are ludicrous, do you realise that to spend that much I would have had to have my heating on all day every single day". Got away with it too.

So you're saying Trump's gonna walk? Damn.

LOL
 

Foffy

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,400
After reading the NYT article on how Trump literally plans to be a dictator if he gets back into office, please, put his ass in jail with one of these fucking things, p l e a s e.
 

Garp TXB

Member
Apr 1, 2020
6,350
This was supposed to be the hardest one to pin on him, so the evidence must be absolutely staggering. Not that we haven't seen a lot already with the Jan 6th commission, but so many people were saying that wasn't enough for an actual federal indictment